High Nitrate

[PaPa P]

Hi, from sunny Australia.
I am new to this forum. Thanks for the addition.


My tank is 3000mmL x 1100mmW x 900mmH, with a drop-off at the last 800mm to 1200mm depth.
Sump is located in the basement, with 2 tanks of 2400mm Lx 600mmW x 500mmH.
Lower one is the true sump, with Filter socks, throught to Chaeto refugium, to Deltec Skimmer, frag section and to return pump.
Upper tank is split into 4 Q tanks - actually plumbed into the main system, but each with its own values, so they can be run isolated .
System is nearly 2 years old.
Have 8 AI Hydra 52 lights and 1 4ft T5 4 bulb.
Full community tank with SPS, morphys, and SPS.
Water volume - ca. 4400 Ltrs - 1100 gallons.

Basic parameters :
Salinity - 1.025
pH - 8.24 mornings to 8.45 by evening
Alk - 8.1 ~ 8.3
Ca - 430 ~450
Mag - 1330
K - 380 ~ 420
Br - 4.5
St - 5.4
Temp - steady 26 ~26.5 C

Now the issue - Nitrate and Phos PO4

The last 18 months after I set up the Chaeto refugium, I had consistently low Nitrate, 3~5.
I use RowaPhos in a small reactor and had my PO4 at 0.05 ~0.07

About 3 months ago I noticed my first Bubble Algae, and left it initially hoping it will die back, but it did not, and it started to smother the base of some nicely glowing SPS. Lost a grapefruit size Stylo to RTN, and then about 4 weeks later a pink Birdsnets, a Green Acro and another purple Birdsnest.

After reading and asking all around for option, I ended up with 2 options I thought best for me. One was Continuum, which was a fast , 2 weeks, treatment, but I was concerned by the quick-fix approach, as from experience I know there is always a knock-on effect. In the end I decided on the other option - Vibrant.
Went on=line to BRS and saw the interview with the inventor, who was asked all the questions I had , and he catagorically answered that the use of Vibrant will NOT kill off the beneficial algae, such as my Chaeto. It is a slow mapproach, with dosing every 14 days.
I started it, dosing on the low side to be safe.
After about 6 weeks I did notice a reduction of the Bubble Algae, BUT I also noticed my Chaeto mwas not growing as fast. Prior to this, I had to harvest the Chaeto every 3 weeks, about 1.5 Kg. Recipients and my LFS loved it, as it was so healthy, dark green and long strands.

On testing I also noted a climb in my NO3 to about 25, and PO4 to 0.030 which got my attantion !
Since 3 weeks I have stopped dosing the Vibrant, in the hope my Chaeto will recover and become my main NO3 exporter again, but it has started to vanish to the point its chamber is half empty now.

I am assuming I will have to be patient and allow the water conditions to stabalize so the Chaeto can recover, but in the meantime I need a solution for control of my NO3.
I set up the RowaPhos reactor again, which has been able to reduce the PO4 to 0.07~0.09, but my NO3 stayed high at about 20. A week ago, I did a 60% WC - 2400 Litres.
Laborious task, as I can only do 600 Ltrs at a time - lower DT into Sump, drain, and refill with NSW and pump up to DT again. Repeat 4 times.

24 hours later, I tested and NO3 is down to ca. 7, and PO4 at 0.08

I would ideally like to lower them more, but this is a temp improvement.
I am looking for a solution.
I have looked at the NO POx, but with a system this size, that can get expensive , and I was advised to look into the DIY version, such as Carbon ( Vodka) dosing.
Additionally, I plan to buy a few Bio Blocks to place in the sump, parallel to the Chaeto.

Before I take this road, I would appreciate any and all advice and suggestions on what the brain trust would do in this situation.

Thanks in advance.

 

[five.five-six]

For where you are I would recommend carbon dosing. I use the NoPox even though there are cheaper DIY alternatives. You can get a 5L bottle of NoPox for about $100US which isn’t the end of the world

I can’t speak to the DIY solutions though I do hear they work. I can tell you that NoPox does work as advertised. I just connected a 1.1mp peristaltic pump and just do the math and pump that amount daily. In my case, it’s 12ML so I run the pump for 3 min every 6 hrs.

 

[bertoni]

There's a DIY formula for NOPOx:

To make a DIY version of Red Sea NO₃O₄-X, mix:
    375 ml 80 proof vodka
    500 ml vinegar (5% acetic acid)
    125 ml RO/DI water

I'd probably start there. Any carbon dosing, whether it's Vibrant or some other product, will be competing with macro algae for nutrients, and is likely to kill off the Chaetomorpha, though.

This article covers vodka dosing:

http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2008-08/nftt/index.php

This article has tables for vinegar dosing:

http://reefkeeping.com/joomla/index...ar-dosing-methodology-for-the-marine-aquarium

In the short term, cutting back on feeding should help with the nitrate level, unless there's a lot of debris caught in a coarse substrate. I had to ditch all my crushed coral due to nutrient problems. That's quite common.

 

[PaPa P]

For where you are I would recommend carbon dosing. I use the NoPox even though there are cheaper DIY alternatives. You can get a 5L bottle of NoPox for about $100US which isn't the end of the world

I can't speak to the DIY solutions though I do hear they work. I can tell you that NoPox does work as advertised. I just connected a 1.1mp peristaltic pump and just do the math and pump that amount daily. In my case, it's 12ML so I run the pump for 3 min every 6 hrs.

Thanks. The NoPox is considerably more expensive here but may be the advisable option at the end of the day.
Paralell to starting with the NoPox, should I try to get a new batch of Chaeto to add to the refugium, and see if it starts to take ? OR
Accept that the Vibrant as obviously had an effect on partially removing the Bubble Algae, while removing nutrients for the Chaeto, so may as well start to dose the Vibrant again ?

 

[five.five-six]

Thanks. The NoPox is considerably more expensive here but may be the advisable option at the end of the day.
Paralell to starting with the NoPox, should I try to get a new batch of Chaeto to add to the refugium, and see if it starts to take ? OR
Accept that the Vibrant as obviously had an effect on partially removing the Bubble Algae, while removing nutrients for the Chaeto, so may as well start to dose the Vibrant again ?

you can hit from all directions. there are several people who have successfully used vodka and if NoPox is that much more it might be a better option.

 

[bertoni]

The Vibrant seems to be a reasonable product. Continuing it should be okay.

 

[vair]

There's a DIY formula for NOPOx:



I'd probably start there. Any carbon dosing, whether it's Vibrant or some other product, will be competing with macro algae for nutrients, and is likely to kill off the Chaetomorpha, though.

This article covers vodka dosing:

http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2008-08/nftt/index.php

This article has tables for vinegar dosing:

http://reefkeeping.com/joomla/index...ar-dosing-methodology-for-the-marine-aquarium

In the short term, cutting back on feeding should help with the nitrate level, unless there's a lot of debris caught in a coarse substrate. I had to ditch all my crushed coral due to nutrient problems. That's quite common.

Hey Jonathon And others

So I've used a biopellet reactor for years, coming off a few years of serious tank neglect, running nothing. Thinking of vodka, vinegar or the combo dosing of the Nopox home made version which seems like both worlds.
Does it make any difference, are they all the same?

 

[bertoni]

I don't think anyone actually know the differences, if any, between the various forms of carbon, but some seem to work better in some tanks, for reasons that aren't clear. One of the more common differences is the amount of cyanobacteria that show up on dosing, which is easy to spot, at least. I'd probably try the cheapest and easiest one first.

 

[vair]

Thanks. Vinegar for the the tank vodka for me, that was easy.

 

[bertoni]

Better than the other way around, for sure.