Hippo tang white spots - need help diagnosing

[Thinner25]

Hello All,

I was hoping if somebody can help me diagnosing what parasite is infecting my Hippo tang.
[1] It has been 3 weeks of Cupermine treatment (between .5 to .6 potency - Salifert and Seachem test kit).
[2] After 7 days of treatment 85% of the spots were gone but a few remain.
[3] But every 3 days then on the spots becomes a lot again and then goes away and a few remains. This occurrence happens every 3 days.
[4] I am treating in my display tank (FOWLR - 125g) since it was very difficult to catch the guy.

I have attached the best picture that I cant take. Any assistance is appreciated. Thank you in advance.

 

[FishAndPhysics]

Sorry, trying to understand. Do the spots get worse 3 days after you stop copper? Or do they get worse every 3 days even on copper?

The fish has been in .5-.6 mg/L of copper for 3 weeks with no breaks, correct?

I wonder, if the system is heavily infected with the cyst stage (which is difficult to kill with copper) the fish might be getting reinfected even though you are dosing with copper. One suspects eventually you will deplete the system of that cyst stage and then clear the system of ich.

Is the fish still acting and eating normally? If so, I'd leave it on copper until it clears.

 

[HumbleFish]

Hippos can be very tricky to treat, because they will sometimes get viral/bacterial lesions which look very similar to ich. However, I would feel better if I knew your Cu level had been confirmed to be 0.5-0.6ppm by using a Hanna copper checker. Free swimmers shouldn't be able to survive that concentration long enough to keep reinfecting your fish.

 

[Thinner25]

Hello FishAndPhysics,

Thank you. The white spots clears out about 85% after the first week of Cupermine treatment. But never 100% cleared. Then after 3 days, it seems white spots come back again...not worse but like it was 2/3 days ago.. (like in the picture I attached) ...Then after 2 or 3 days it is gone and around 85% clears out once again... and this seemed to happen like clockn work.

The hippo is eating well. Hanging out on the power head a lot .. but she was always like that anyways even without the spots.

I have a yellow tang, Convict Tang and a Lamark Angel in this 125g. All of them are scratching but not signs of spots except for the Hippo.

 

[Thinner25]

Hello Humblefish,

Thank you .. I am currently using Seachem copper test kit... okay, I will get the Hanna test kit. With the color chart, I believe I am pretty confident the range is between .5 - .6.

I guess with your advise, I will get the Hanna just to be 100% sure. I have this Hippo for almost 4 years now. It started in a 40 gallon then moved to a 125g.

 

[HumbleFish]

Is the Hippo being treated in a tank with rock & sand? If so, absorption is probably occurring causing the Cu level to fluctuate.

Also, how close is the 40 gallon to the 125g?

 

[Thinner25]

Hello HumbleFish...

Yes .. it is being treated in a tank with rocks and sand .. so it took about 4 days until the Cupermine Levels stabilized... I checked twice a day. Mornings and evening.

I will be ordering the Hanna .. and will do the same.. checking mornings and evenings.

Do you think, it will still be an issue?

 

[Thinner25]

...and what I mean was the Hippo was housed in a 40g about 3 years ago.. and moved to a 125g...sorry for the confusion

 

[HumbleFish]

Hello HumbleFish...

Yes .. it is being treated in a tank with rocks and sand .. so it took about 4 days until the Cupermine Levels stabilized... I checked twice a day. Mornings and evening.

I will be ordering the Hanna .. and will do the same.. checking mornings and evenings.

Do you think, it will still be an issue?

So long as the copper level remains stable and doesn't dip below therapeutic, it shouldn't be an issue. When you first get the Hanna checker, test several times a day to see if there are any fluctuations. What typically happens with rock + copper is rock absorbs copper, copper leaches back out, rock absorbs copper, copper leaches back out... rinse & repeat.

 

[Thinner25]

Humblefish ... basing on the picture, do you suspect it is indeed ick..or other sort of parasite?

 

[mkart]

I bought the Hanna copper kit not realizing it only comes with 6 reagent packs. Make sure you order more reagents as well so you have them on hand.

 

[Thinner25]

I bought the Hanna copper kit not realizing it only comes with 6 reagent packs. Make sure you order more reagents as well so you have them on hand.

Thank you for the heads up mkart! .. by any chance did you at one point before you bought the Hanna Cu test kit use Salifert or Seachem? And if yes, did you find that you were misreading them as compared to Hanna?

 

[HumbleFish]

Humblefish ... basing on the picture, do you suspect it is indeed ick..or other sort of parasite?

Some of the spots look like ich/velvet, some are too irregular to be caused by a parasite.

Has he been dewormed with Prazipro yet? A 5 min FW dip would tell you whether or not he has flukes: http://humble.fish/freshwater dip/

 

[Thinner25]

Some of the spots look like ich/velvet, some are too irregular to be caused by a parasite.

Has he been dewormed with Prazipro yet? A 5 min FW dip would tell you whether or not he has flukes: http://humble.fish/freshwater dip/

Just got my Prazi in the mail today and I have already dosed the recommended amount in the tank. Turned off my skimmer as well. I am monitoring the fishes if it causes any issues together with Cupermine. I have an RO/DI unit anyways so in any event, I am ready to do a water change.

Unfortunately, I cannot catch the Hippo tang unless I take all the rock work/caves apart. I attempted several times but failed so that is when I decided to treat Cupermine in my display tank instead.

Do you know the lead time to see/determine if Prazi makes a difference? In addition, was it okay running the skimmer while using Cupermine? I know for Prazi, skimmer needs to be off.

thank you.

 

[HumbleFish]

If the fish has flukes, the fish should begin twitching almost immediately as the flukes spasm on him before dropping off. He should be 100% clear of flukes 24 hrs after dosing Prazipro UNLESS you are dealing with a prazi resistant strain.

 

[Thinner25]

If the fish has flukes, the fish should begin twitching almost immediately as the flukes spasm on him before dropping off. He should be 100% clear of flukes 24 hrs after dosing Prazipro UNLESS you are dealing with a prazi resistant strain.

Understood.

By the way, I know it might not be clear in the pictures, but the white spots in the Blue tangs seems to be larger that normal. I have seen Ick and it is a smaller spot. Any ideas what else is the culprit?

So here is my plan:

1. Once I receive my Hanna Copper test kit, I will test for copper potency 3 times a day and maintain a .6 potency of Cupermine
2. I will do Cupermine for additional two weeks and if fishes does not get better/improve, I will do a 50% water change for 3 consecutive days and in the same time run carbon to take the cupermine out.
3. Once Cupermine reading is a least below 0.1, I will treat with Seachem Paraguard so I can hit a bit broader range of parasites.

 

[mkart]

Thank you for the heads up mkart! .. by any chance did you at one point before you bought the Hanna Cu test kit use Salifert or Seachem? And if yes, did you find that you were misreading them as compared to Hanna?

I haven't used it yet. My 4 fish are in prazipro now. This is their second dose and has helped with black spots on the tang. Cupramine will start this weekend and is my first time treating with copper.

 

[Thinner25]

Update - After dosing Prazipro yesterday

Update - After dosing Prazipro yesterday

My Hippo tang looks a whole lot better this morning (picture attached). I do think it does not shows in the picture but if I look closely, very few white spots are left. Right now it looks like, the Hippo have tiny dots on his skin mostly likely where the ick were attached previously. However, this is exactly how he looks as I mentioned in my previous post when white spots begin to disappear but come back after 2 or 3 days.

I am unsure if today's improvement is due to Prazipro that I dosed yesterday. But one thing I observed though is that the other fishes has stopped flashing/scratching for the first time since 3 weeks of Cupermine. I assume that that was caused by some worm that Prazipro took care of...or maybe Cupermine finally working...!?!?

I will receive my Hanna Cu test kit later today and use that going forward as oppose to the Seachem test kit.

In another note, this is another occasion that I can say (at least for my experience) that Cupermine and Prazipro can be mixed.

I will continue to post progress