Home being fumigated, QUESTIONS!

[Irvine Man]

Hey fellas, so my place is being tented and all "live" animals have to be removed. No problem moving the cat and plants to a friends place but then, uh oh my tank!
I can catch the fish and get someone to hold them if I need too, but I'm thinking what about the corals and the rock and everything??

Would it work to just saran wrap the top openings so that it doesn't get the smoke/posion in there? I'm assuming the issue there would be no fresh oxygen and the build up of carbon monoxide...
It will be for two days...

HELP?!?!

 

[TheMcs]

That would also mean shutting down all filtration. Trying to leave anything in there would be taking a huge risk. Do you have a friend, relative or LFS that would let you move everything to their place. You don't have to move the tank, just use a big stock tank or rubbermaids for a few days. Then I'd wrap the begeezus out of the tank and remove any equipment you possibly can. Once the house is habitable, prep a good amount of NSW prior to moving the animals back.

Good luck, sounds like a challenge.

 

[usefulidiot213]

I went this same thing about 4 years ago. My Condo got gassed, and I had to move my entire reef tank out for a couple of days. I completely emptied it. All the animals, coral, rock, sand & Water. Everything went into rubber made tubs and other smaller tanks. That gas will kill anything. I actually took the tank itself out.
The hole experience totally sucked, and I don't envy you at all.

 

[bsg]

I'm going through the same thing in a couple of weeks, I feel your pain. After talking with the fumigation folks there is no doubt the whole tank has to comeout. However it has given me a good reason to upgrade (40 to 120)

Good Luck

 

[Mouse]

when I fogged the house for fleas (darn cat) I used plastic and tape to seal it up then a damp towel over it. But that was only for a few hrs

 

[Irvine Man]

geez. What I wanted to hear was, "that stuff only kills termites, not fish!, You'll be fine, just do a 50% water change after and you'll be back to normal..."

Well looks like I need to think about the always lurking upgrade concept, and a reloactino for my current stock. fun.

Oh boy.

 

[pimp4cheddar]

I don't understand...

Can't you turn off all filtration, throw an air pump into the tank, leave the powerheads on and shrink wrap the entire tank? I mean...grab some shrink wrap and wrap the entire tank after the air pump is in the tank.

No filtration!...as the water in the sump will be exposed to the gas.


This seems like a fairly easy fix to me...thoughts?

 

[anbosu]

when I fogged the house for fleas (darn cat) I used plastic and tape to seal it up then a damp towel over it. But that was only for a few hrs

I did the same thing and everything was fine.

 

[davocean]

Just shut off skimmer and anything that will induce outside air into tank, and run a PH or 2 for circulation.
Seal w/ plastic, tape it up tight, turn off lights so they don't melt plastic, corals/fish will be fine for the 3 days off.(might even look better/cleaner)
I've done this several times, and worked for a termite Co many years ago, seen it done many times.
Just make sure they are aware of this, I have heard cases where they actually pulled livestock and set in a bucket in a yard so they weren't the responsible party for fish deaths(even though they pretty much know what will happen)

 

[TheMcs]

Just read in a local thread an excellent idea if you're going to attempt leaving the tank in place. Place an air pump outside with a line going into the tank. Then seal the tank off with plastic and tape as mentioned above. Turn on the pump. Any minute gaps/holes will push air away from the tank, not pull anything harmful in. I wouldn't leave any piece of equipment exposed.

 

[Gotcha!]

geez. What I wanted to hear was, "that stuff only kills termites, not fish!, You'll be fine, just do a 50% water change after and you'll be back to normal..."

Well looks like I need to think about the always lurking upgrade concept, and a reloactino for my current stock. fun.

Oh boy.

Trust me when I say this and this is not coming from your view of the aquarium and fish but from an exterminating company's and minimizing any risk: Everything needs to come out. The products used in the fumigation will kill everything. There is no way you will seal out the fumigants without the chance of penetration. If its my aquarium and equipment I am removing it all. Sorry to have to tell you this yet thats just how it is. Hope after they are done you never get the drywood or dampwood termites again or its rinse and repeat. The company that is doing your tenting should be capable of explaining all this to you. Fumigants are nothing like insect foggers listed above. Extreme caution needs to be used.

Good Luck, plan accordingly and take the time to make sure you get everything out.

 

[davocean]

I worked for a termite company for 3 1/2 years and always gave same advice as I have here.
That was over 10 years ago, and I've given this advice to club members or here over the years, and so far never heard a negative result.
As long as it's sealed, no sweat, done this several times myself.
It's the same vikane gas that has always been used, that has not changed.
This is a pretty common thing here in Cali.
Just use painters plastic, good thickness, 2mm or better, blue tape so it doesn't become a pain to remove.
As long as you're not introducing air/gas into tank you are fine.
Air house out well when done, maybe use fans.
If you ask termite company, yes, they will suggest removal so they don't have to deal w/ liability issues and cover their butt.
Almost always the tent crew is seperate and sub'd out from the original termite company that inspected, and that is why I suggest being there as tent goes up to make sure there is no confusion, like i said I have seen them pull small tanks and just set them in the yard, so you want to make sure.

 

[SpencerG]

This is probably apples and oranges, but I bombed my house for fleas and while the fish and corals fared well, the shrimp on down to the pods did not. I covered the tank, turned off the skimmer, aired out before restarting everything, etc. and my tank was still toxic to shrimp and pods for a few months thereafter. Now, no problems. But, as I said, probably a different situation with a different chemical.

 

[bsg]

I spoke with the company doing our fumigation and they stated "it absolutely has to comeout". I called two others companies for their opinions and they agreed, stating the gas will penetrate through wood and kill anything. I suppose if you wrapped tank 100% (including the bottom) and used positive pressure you MAY be ok...but why risk it.

 

[davocean]

It doesn't penetrate glass.
Taping top will keep it from display.
Go w/ your gut and situation, if it's a small tank and you have a way to move it safely, and that is what makes you more comfortable, do that.
I'm just saying many have taped it tight and just ran a PH for circulation.
My tanks have been way too big and established to move them easily, so I've taped them up several times over the years, no sweat.
The company's have to advise moving it to clear them of liability issues.

 

[pimp4cheddar]

It doesn't penetrate glass.
Taping top will keep it from display.
Go w/ your gut and situation, if it's a small tank and you have a way to move it safely, and that is what makes you more comfortable, do that.
I'm just saying many have taped it tight and just ran a PH for circulation.
My tanks have been way too big and established to move them easily, so I've taped them up several times over the years, no sweat.
The company's have to advise moving it to clear them of liability issues.

^^^Pretty much sum'd up.

There's no way in hell I'll move my 45 gallon.

Like I mentioned earlier...I don't understand how shrink wrapping doesn't solve this?

No company will ever advise you to leave a tank in there...

It's your tank...and your piece of mind... You're either going to move it or leave it inside... I would wrap the life out of it and leave it be...

 

[Irvine Man]

So great thoughts and thanks for the expereinces and advice both ways. I think I'm going to try and wrap it but the little gaps around plumbing and HOB equipment scare me. SO I'm going to move the fish and shrimp to a friends and then wrap the stuf well, wait a week and if water is good, add the livestock back in.
No way I'mmoving a 40 to my parents house for a three day treatment.
The loss of all doesn't outweigh the hassle of it all.

Thanks fellas, I needed those replies.

 

[Gotcha!]

I worked for a termite company for 3 1/2 years and always gave same advice as I have here.
That was over 10 years ago, and I've given this advice to club members or here over the years, and so far never heard a negative result.
As long as it's sealed, no sweat, done this several times myself.
It's the same vikane gas that has always been used, that has not changed.
This is a pretty common thing here in Cali.
Just use painters plastic, good thickness, 2mm or better, blue tape so it doesn't become a pain to remove.
As long as you're not introducing air/gas into tank you are fine.
Air house out well when done, maybe use fans.
If you ask termite company, yes, they will suggest removal so they don't have to deal w/ liability issues and cover their butt.
Almost always the tent crew is seperate and sub'd out from the original termite company that inspected, and that is why I suggest being there as tent goes up to make sure there is no confusion, like i said I have seen them pull small tanks and just set them in the yard, so you want to make sure.

I own a company. If the company says you can seal it from the fumigant and everything will be ok get in writing a guarantee that they assure you this will be ok and you will not loose anything. If they are unwilling to offer you this written guarantee with the value of the livestock then you know to remove everything. They may have insurance yet try to tell the insurance company the value of the livestock you have in the tank. Good luck with that one.

If you worked for a company that did fumigations then you are aware of the difference in a fumigant and some of these peoples insect fogger/flea bomb issues. They are totally different.

Again to the original poster. Get a value of the livestock in your tank. If the Fumigation Company says its fine to leave it in the structure being fumigated make sure they sign the guarantee that it is safe along with the value of the occupants you have/all livestock and have them wrap the tank -not you. Then if something happens you are not at a loss by an insuarance company negotiating a different settlement and you covered all your bases. That way you minimize any attorney costs you may encounter when your livestock dies and you try to obtain back the cost to replace everything.

I am not saying a tank can not be wrapped yet its not that easy. A person that does fumigations is way ahead of the wrapping ballgame then the average person that is not familiar with all the ins and outs of fumigants.

 

[Gotcha!]

I spoke with the company doing our fumigation and they stated "it absolutely has to comeout". I called two others companies for their opinions and they agreed, stating the gas will penetrate through wood and kill anything. I suppose if you wrapped tank 100% (including the bottom) and used positive pressure you MAY be ok...but why risk it.

I own a company. Insect foggers for fleas, roaches, etc. is not the same as a fumigant. Fumigants will kill everything if there is the smallest gap present. Please read what I posted directly above in the other persons reply. I can not stress to you enough that wrappings fail as much as they succeed when the customers do the wrappings. Leaving livestock in an aquarium and wrapping it will always spell a huge risk of loosing it all (wrappings fail in many many cases since it only takes the smallest gap for a fumigant to penetrate). If you leave the stuff inside during the fumigation expect to replace everything (livestock). It will all be as dead as dead can be when the re-entry time of 72 hours or so comes around if even the smallest gap was present. Its your call, is it worth the risk. What are the occupants you have worth to you.

Get everything OUT! All livestock must be removed. The rest you can wrap and leave in (equipment based stuff and make sure if you do leave equipment in that you wrap completely "no gaps" and Good luck, I know its a lot of work. Fumigants may not penetrate glass or plastic yet your aquarium is not a glass cube with no gaps and wrapping may leave the smallest gap which IMO is not worth the risk of loosing livestock. Good luck.

 

[davocean]

I never stated anything about flea foggers or whatever, just going off of about 14 years of giving this advice to others w/out one single incident.
The op has already made a decision he is comfortable w/ in case you did not read that.
I understand gas will get into wood, but a well sealed tank it will not.
I don't give advice unless I'm certain it will help, saying I don't know what I'm talking about is uncalled for, I speak from years of experience, and experience of many fellow reefers.