How much kalkwasser can I add at once?

[t-dizzle]

How much kalkwasser can I add at once (as a percentage of tank volume) without seriously affecting pH and alkalinity? I'd like to start dosing kalkwasser into my 26 but I don't have an auto-topoff system yet, nor do I have a shelf above my aquarium from which to drip kalk. I currently top off manually with about 1 gallon of RO daily, usually in 2 1/2-gallon increments (before and after work).

Thanks!
T./

 

[Amphiprion]

I believe around 2-3% tank volume per 24 hours, maybe a little more (without raising pH too high).

 

[salreus]

The reason why kalk has to be added slowly is because if added quickly it will increase the ph too high. How quickly your ph increases would depend on how much buffering you have currently in your tank. I have no idea how much your PH would go up if you added 1/2 at a time. But I would still say the less at a time the better. With that, you could at least do 1/3 in the morn, 1/3 when you get hime and 1/3 right before you go to be. Another reason this is hard to answer is because it was also depend on the concentration of calcium hydroxide you have in your water when you do the water changes. Are you thinking about using a saturated concentration or are you going to use 50% saturation.

What I would recommend by logic,Not by experience or knowledge is to make a very weak concentration of limewater and add it to your tank and then measure your PH. A very weak concentration shouldn't effect your ph too much. then over a many days you can slightly increase that amount of calcium hydroxide and monitor your ph and determine the max concentration of limewater you can have with it being within the range of ph you want after you add your top off.

But I doubt if anyone is going to risk it and say to add x amount and you will be fine. This is just my idea and what I would do to ensure the safty of my tank.

 

[bertoni]

http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2005-01/rhf/index.php

That article discusses dosing lime. I have chosen to add limewater only by drip, although some aquarists do have success pouring larger quantities into the tank. I tried dosing without autotopoff, and thought it was too much trouble and too error-prone, so I stopped using it until I got the autotopoff in place.

 

[Randall_James]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7351605#post7351605 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by bertoni
http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2005-01/rhf/index.php
That article discusses dosing lime. I have chosen to add limewater only by drip, although some aquarists do have success pouring larger quantities into the tank. I tried dosing without autotopoff, and thought it was too much trouble and too error-prone, so I stopped using it until I got the autotopoff in place.

I "tried" to drip, my lines invariably plugged up at the discharge side. I had to clean the thing every few days and I would forget at times.

My current system uses a Toms aqualifter pump and a DT17 Intermatic timer from HomeD. It runs for 2 minutes every hour when the lights are turned off. It does not keep the tank full, but almost. This also keeps my PH at 8.2-8.4 at all times.

. Link to image of container, pump, sump setup

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7349406#post7349406 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Amphiprion
I believe around 2-3% tank volume per 24 hours, maybe a little more (without raising pH too high).

This is mostly true, I don't know if I would do this all in 1 dose. 3 or 4 would prevent the wide ph dance. I set up my dosing system as a ooops "all in" but alive theory.. pretty self explanatory but Murphys law states

things will go wrong in any given situation in which error is possible. "If there's more than one way to do a job, and one of those ways will result in disaster, then somebody will do it that way."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murphy's_law

with a couple experiments on my own moderately stocked tanks, you can dump in roughly 2% of the tanks volume in kalkwasser in a single dose without pushing the PH over 8.6. NOW this is not going to be true on all tanks due to what I would guess is buffering ability, and starting PH. But it does give me a good idea how big my dosing container should be.

Murphys Law = container should contain no more kalkwasser than you could dump in your system in 1 dose.

I have inadvertently tested this and it works at 2% of tank volume but a few of my softies came pretty close to going "toes up" With that little disaster behind me and everything (well stuff I could see) alive I think .75-1% should be about as much as I would purposely dose at 1 time.

Your mileage may vary and this is a very UN scientific experiment. Just an incidental report of "what worked" for me.

Again, we put a lot of money in our tanks and error to the side of caution always fits IMO

 

[salreus]

Just thought of something else. depending on your calcium needs. you could always do normal water top offs during the week and dose limewater on the weekends when you have more control.

I do right now close to the guy above. I use the aqua lifter pump too and I have to add about 2 gal of water. I do this all at one time though. The pumps are rated at about 3.5 gal per hour. So my two gal top off takes me over 30 min. And I am adding this to about 200 gal of water into a sump. This is all going to change when I install my ATO with a kalk reactor my local club is building.

 

[Alaskan Reefer]

If you drip, you can reduce line maintenance by having the discharge side under water. A nail jammed in the line every couple of weeks is all you need when you do it that way.

I wouldn't do kalk any other way but a drip of some type, and frankly only with a peristaltic pump (no float switches or regular pumps for me when it comes to kalk). Here's an easy system that replenishes my calcium, alkalinity, and evap water in my 125 and only requires attention every other weekend -- which consists of a hose full of water, dumping in a cup or two of Mrs. Wages, and 2 minutes with a mixing pump. Easy and effective...

 

[boxfishpooalot]

LIME WATER FACTS:
-Saturated limewater contains 41 meq/L.
-about 2 teaspoons per gallon, but not necessarily exactly 2 teaspoons per gallon has a concentration of 808 ppm of calcium at 25 deg C
-2 tsp per gallon of limewater will approximately raise pH by 0.6 pH units, alkalinity by about 0.5 meq/L (1.4 dKH) and calcium by 10 ppm if added at about 1.25% of the tank volume
-Alkalinity almost never gets too high with limewater alone. The demand rises as the pH rises.
-Contains hydroxide wich then combines with CO2 once in the tank to form bicarbonate or carbonate.
-saturation is 2 tsp per 1 gallon.
-a rise in pH of 0.3 pH units means a halving of the CO2/H2CO3(carbon dioxide/carbonic acid) content of the water
-Limewater may help precipitate calcium phosphate,wich can be readily skimmed out from the aquarium.

ALKALINITY FACTS:
-alkalinity is a way of measuring the bicarbonate and carbonate available to corals for skeleton formation,alkalinity will determine your ph.
-2.5 meq/L (7 dKH) is a typical ocean value
-High alkalinity will push down the calcium faster than usual.
-All alkalinity supplements(store bought) contain either bicarbonate(baking soda), carbonate(washing soda or baked baking soda), or hydroxide. They all equilibrate in the tank with adequate CO2 from the air to form the same thing: mostly bicarbonate and some carbonate. If CO2 is not drawn in from the air fast enough, using carbonate and especially hydroxide it can boost pH (which is often an advantage).


PH FACTS:
-pH is controlled by the alkalinity (dKH) and the level of CO2 in the tank/home air.
-ph stands for the power of hydrogen.
-The ph scale ranges from 0 to 14, with 7 being equal portions of hydrogen ions, and hydroxide ions.Anything above 7 is alkaline(hence alkaline salts) and anything below 7 is acidic.
-Co2 being breathed by people when they exhale lowers ph temporarily. It does not change alkalinty.

 

[Randall_James]

Yea I can run out and spend a couple hundred dollars and buy dosing pumps etc.

I gain the same effect and it has proven safe and reliable for $20. (I do not have room for a trash can as everything I have must fit in stand)

I on the other hand would never connect any dosing system to my tank that "Could" wipe out my tank if it was to malfunction. Again "Murphys Law" and anyone that has had a tank for any length of time has most probably encountered Murphy himself.

No system is 100% fail safe , not a one.

Any timer, pump or rig can malfunction and it in time will. I have a $4000 dosing rig in my office that is toast.(is used for humans) Sure is pretty however
It failed but would not have OD'd the tank as the roller assy crapped out.

I spend money on a lot of stuff, but my budget rig has taken care of top off, PH issues and maintains CA for $20.

IF I was going to spend more than that, I would buy a calcium reactor.

Back to the original question how much can you dose at 1 time? I would not dose more than 1% of tank volume. I like doing it at night as it takes care of the low ph/topoff/CA additive (really not good at raising CA levels, more of maintaining).

 

[Alaskan Reefer]

Actually, it's $339 for a Litermeter III. But, the next upgrade for me is two more pumps hooked to it and two more trash cans for automated water changes -- which for me will be priceless...

My last system was a used $50 peristaltic hospital pump and a $15 sterilite -- all of which fit in the stand of a 75 gallon. Topoff handled for two weeks at a time with that system as well.

Peristaltics are as safe as you can get -- worst case the tubing breaks over the rollers and you have some vinegar cleanup to do. Can't hurt the tank with an overdose unless it goes haywire and just starts running constantly.