Hypo fish health issues

[Spar]

Does anyone else seem to have problems with fish surviving through the full 6-8 weeks of hypo treatment? I am getting real frustrated to the point of thinking copper or just temporary observation QT (week or two at normal/slightly-reduced salinity) is better. This is my 2nd batch of hypo and both times I have experienced fish loss at the 3 to 4 week mark. Checked parameters and no issues, everything stays stable (pH, temp, salinity, etc), nitrates are only around 3-5ppm.

What is the general group consensus on whether a complete ich-killing hypo period is excessive or not? Obviously there are mixed feelings out there, but I also dont want to scrap this method and introduce ich to my DT since there is no turning back at that point.

 

[Spar]

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1990809

Reading Scungili's point is spot on with where my mindset is going. I just want to get new fish into the large display tank as soon as I know they aren't obviously sick (week or two), and just let ich play its course. I never had issues with ich in my old non-QT'ed 180g.

 

[b0bab0ey]

Personally, I would never use hypo as a preventative. Seems to me fish can only live so long in hypo before it starts stressing them. If I were you, I would just QT in regular s/w and observe. Maybe do one dose of Cupramine to get the copper up to half strength (0.25). This is what a lot of LFSs and wholesalers do as a preventative. This way if you do have to end up treating for parasites/Ich, you're already half-way there with your copper level. I would have to think this method would be less stressful on the fish than just adding all that copper over 2-3 days.

 

[b0bab0ey]

I wanted to add something else:

I used to work for a guy who did aquarium maintenance. He would order thousands of dollars worth of s/w fish at a time. He would QT them all for one month using just old school air-driven u/g filters and HOB power filters. Immediately after acclimating them he would treat all his holding tanks with Coppersafe and one dose of Maracyn 1 & 2. He lost very little, maybe 1 or 2 fish at most. And once they made it to the clients' tanks they lived forever!

Now, to be completely forthcoming I need to tell you he only ordered from Quality Marine, one of the best wholesalers in the country. So I don't know for sure if his success was more due to the wholesaler he used or his QT methods.

 

[mess7777]

I did lose a fish during hypo at about the 5 week mark, but it was due to some sort of infection that must have been preexisting.

I found my fish were not very stressed at all during the 8 week period, they moved slower than normal and didn't have all their personality. Almost like they were on drugs and didn't have a care in the world.

Anyway, I am not sure I would do it for preventative as the previous poster mentioned. The one local LFS here that has healthy fish and I have yet to see signs of disease swears by Paraguard. It doesn't affect filtration and claims to be broad spectrum for pretty much everything but internal parasites. For internal maybe feed some medicated food as a preventative measure. I intend to treat all my new fish with paraguard for a couple days just to stop anything before it becomes a problem.

Myself, I want to avoid copper in my QT as I intend to QT everything going into my tank, including corals and inverts.

Back to the original question, hypo itself shouldn't cause you to lose fish. Likely there is some other factor at play. It's a lot of work though to keep it clean(so ammonia doesn't spike), frequent water changes, obsessive salinity monitoring. pH swings are a reality, you have to make sure you take steps to stabilize it.

 

[BigGimp77]

How did you measure your salinity? What fish did you try to QT? How long were fish in the QT before starting hypo?

I'm in the process of raising my salinity after 4 weeks of Hypo. I also did Copper treatment on a Royal Gramma (this fish will not live through Hypo) while the other fish were in Hypo. I found hypo to be a lot easier to set up and maintain. Once you get the ATO and the salinity set you're good to go.

I will be ordering 3 new fish next week (Blue Tang, some kind of watchman goby, and a tail spot blenny). I will put all three fish through hypo before adding to the DT. I will probably put them in the QT for 7-10 days while treating with Prazi pro. I will make sure they are eating and look healthy and then begin Hypo.

I want to try and keep my DT as ich free as possible. However, I'm sure somehow, someway, it will find its way into my tank someday. The best way to avoid Ich is to keep the tank relatively stress free and keep parameters in check.

 

[LargeAngels]

Hypo is only good for ich. It does nothing for velvet or flukes so IMO it is really worthless unless you know for sure that the fish has ich and only ich and you don't want to use copper. I use Cupramine for ich and velvet and always give my new fish 2 treatments of Prazipro.

 

[Spar]

How did you measure your salinity? What fish did you try to QT? How long were fish in the QT before starting hypo?

I want to try and keep my DT as ich free as possible. However, I'm sure somehow, someway, it will find its way into my tank someday. The best way to avoid Ich is to keep the tank relatively stress free and keep parameters in check.

I use a refractometer and use 1.026 SG calibration solution. It reads .002 low on RO/DI so I aim to keep the tank at 1.007/1.008 knowing it will actually be 1.009/1.010. I have an ATO and use a sump, so the salinity really doesn't fluctuate at all. I still test it before and after each waterchange, but have never seen it change.

My last batch was 4 tang's, and 3 of them made it fine, one died but am thinking it was something else that caused it (wierd brown blotches on skin). This current batch is 10 Bartlett's Anthias. They went straight into hypo (were already at hypo at vendor for the previous 5 days).

Agreed on the eventual accidental introduction of ich.

 

[b0bab0ey]

Anyway, I am not sure I would do it for preventative as the previous poster mentioned. The one local LFS here that has healthy fish and I have yet to see signs of disease swears by Paraguard. It doesn't affect filtration and claims to be broad spectrum for pretty much everything but internal parasites. For internal maybe feed some medicated food as a preventative measure. I intend to treat all my new fish with paraguard for a couple days just to stop anything before it becomes a problem.

I would love to add ParaGuard to my med chest, if I could just read something solid on it. Some people claim it messes with your biological filtration, some people say it doesn't. Some people say it's better for treating fungus, some people say Ich. Some people say all it is is malachite green and that it's reef safe!? Me, I don't know what to think!?

 

[BigGimp77]

I use a refractometer and use 1.026 SG calibration solution. It reads .002 low on RO/DI so I aim to keep the tank at 1.007/1.008 knowing it will actually be 1.009/1.010. I have an ATO and use a sump, so the salinity really doesn't fluctuate at all. I still test it before and after each waterchange, but have never seen it change.

My last batch was 4 tang's, and 3 of them made it fine, one died but am thinking it was something else that caused it (wierd brown blotches on skin). This current batch is 10 Bartlett's Anthias. They went straight into hypo (were already at hypo at vendor for the previous 5 days).

Agreed on the eventual accidental introduction of ich.

IC IC. Sounds like you have a good system set up. How large of a QT are you running? Any chance one of the tangs was picking on another and stressed it out?


Does anyone know of a list of fish that don't do well in hypo treatment? The only one I'm aware of is Royal Grammas.

 

[Spar]

IC IC. Sounds like you have a good system set up. How large of a QT are you running? Any chance one of the tangs was picking on another and stressed it out?


Does anyone know of a list of fish that don't do well in hypo treatment? The only one I'm aware of is Royal Grammas.

it is a 75 gallon, but the sump holds 20+ gallons more water (30g tank as sump). I have a lot of base rock in the sump for the bacteria. And run UV and carbon down there.

the tang's got along great actually and still do in the 450g... i did try to introduce a 5th after the others were in the QT but that was a mistake that I won't attempt again (fighting was bad, but not within the original Tang gang).