I can't keep any dwarf angels for some reason.

[cherubfish pair]

I can't keep any dwarf angels for some reason.

I would like to keep one bicolor in a 30 gallon minimalist coral as the only fish.

 

[geaux xman]

I've seen those bi-color dwarfs die quite a few times for no apparent reason. One died on me, saw some at 2 different LFS's and read plenty of other cases on here and my local reef board. Some blame it on the collection method(cyanide), but who knows for sure.

 

[BANDIT ANGEL]

BI-colors are a bit hard to keep, I tried two times and they died in three days. The LFS owner told me that these fish are sensitive to cyanide.

 

[rnscross]

which centropuge have you tried and what QT did you employ?

 

[BANDIT ANGEL]

which centropuge have you tried and what QT did you employ?

I kept flamebacks, flames,bi-colors,eibli and lemonpeel before. I ask my friend and LFS to help me QT the angels. I am not sure what medicine they use but I think it involves nitrofurazone and other anti-biotics.

 

[prodman]

I kept flamebacks, flames,bi-colors,eibli and lemonpeel before. I ask my friend and LFS to help me QT the angels. I am not sure what medicine they use but I think it involves nitrofurazone and other anti-biotics.

^ = no QT

 

[cherubfish pair]

I have read bicolors need some types of sponges in their diet. Anybody know this is true?

 

[BANDIT ANGEL]

I have read bicolors need some types of sponges in their diet. Anybody know this is true?

Virtually all Centropyge angels will chew on sponges and gorgonians.
I think bi-colors will eat sponges too.

 

[cherubfish pair]

which centropuge have you tried and what QT did you employ?

]
I've had two bicolors that I didn't QT and both of them lived about a week. I had a heraldi I didn't QT that lived about two weeks. I had a coral beauty that I didn't QT that I had for about three months that I had to get rid of because of a move. And I had a pair of cherub angels that I QT for five weeks and after putting in the display, one died right away and the other jumped out.

So other than the CB, I've done really bad with dwarf angels. And I don't think it's me because I kept an ocellaris for 8 years.

 

[Angel*Fish]

]
I've had two bicolors that I didn't QT and both of them lived about a week. I had a heraldi I didn't QT that lived about two weeks. I had a coral beauty that I didn't QT that I had for about three months that I had to get rid of because of a move. And I had a pair of cherub angels that I QT for five weeks and after putting in the display, one died right away and the other jumped out.

So other than the CB, I've done really bad with dwarf angels. And I don't think it's me because I kept an ocellaris for 8 years.

Bicolors and Herald's angels are notoriously captured using drugs and this is very possibly what caused the death of these 3 fish. Neither fish is for beginners because there are acclimation issues and the challenge of obtaining a healthy one. It would seem your CB was fine. That's pretty bizarre with the cherubs. I assume you matched salinity?

Your quarantine involves treating with antibiotics? Dwarf angels generally just need to be observed and wormed as long as they show no signs of other disease during the QT period. I can't think of a reason to treat an apparently healthy fish with antibiotics.

 

[cherubfish pair]

That's pretty bizarre with the cherubs. I assume you matched salinity?

That might have been the problem.

Your quarantine involves treating with antibiotics?

No.

 

[Sheol]

When I set up my first Reef back in 2005, I tried Coral Beauties twice. Both died within two weeks. The first one was because of a faulty hydrometer (Lucky I didn't lose everything!). The second one, who knows? It was doing fine. Then stopped eating and just almost disintegrated.
I was told by my mentor that often Angels do poorly in tanks that aren't firmly established. I believe him now.
I had a Cherub for a number of years after. Very hardy, but aggressive fish.
My current tank has one C. bicolor and a C. acanthops.
My Bicolor is healthy and a glutton. But its the second of a shipment of two. The first did well for about 2 weeks. Then stopped eating and vanished.
Bicolor is not a beginners fish. The Cyanide issue, for sure. But they can be hard to aclimate as well.
One thing that helps a new dwarf angel in a tank is having productive, established Live Rock that has lots of algae. Especially our hated hair algae. They love it. This can keep one alive long enough for it to learn how to eat aquarium foods.

Sincerely,
Matthew

 

[JamesJR]

Bicolor angels are difficult fish to keep regardless of where they are caught so it is a big assumption to say that that the fish died due to cyanide collection. How do you quarantine your fish? I definitely include a run of praziquantel treatment for all of my fish, especially angels as they are prone to having internal parasites when they are imported. It is a very safe drug to use and doesn't affect the biological filtration.

The best choice would be cherub angels or african flamebacks as I feel that ultimately bicolor angels would be ill suited to a 30 gallon tank as they get pretty big.

 

[Angel*Fish]

Sorry about the antibiotics - I misread Bandits post as yours. I'm sick and have been making goofy mistakes all day.

I can't keep any dwarf angels for some reason.

I would like to keep one bicolor in a 30 gallon minimalist coral as the only fish.

Like Sheol said angels need an established tank. Dwarf angels have specific needs and a litle more research into the group might be what's needed.

Bicolors get up to 6 inches long. A 30g cube is small for a cherub and extremely undersized for a bicolor. All angels need plenty of rock work to graze on and to hide in. A minimalist concept is the worst possible world for angel.

I finally started my blog and the first subject is angels and rocks - there's more detail about it there http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/blog.php?u=5247

 

[Angel*Fish]

Bicolor angels are difficult fish to keep regardless of where they are caught so it is a big assumption to say that that the fish died due to cyanide collection.

What do you base that on? I think they are hardy, tough fish given the right environment and as I mentioned proper acclimation. Herald's as well.

 

[SkullV]

It looks like you are not using any sort of QT at all which is surprising after losing so many fish. QT is not just for medication, but also for observation, relaxation after transport, and getting them eating the foods you feed properly. Is this in the tank where you are using completely unfiltered well water? Dwarf angels are known for being sensitive to heavy metals which are possibly (probably) contaminating your well.

 

[Angel*Fish]

^^^ Good point^^^

 

[JamesJR]

What do you base that on? I think they are hardy, tough fish given the right environment and as I mentioned proper acclimation. Herald's as well.

The impetus is upon you to back up your claim. YOU claimed that they are notorious for being cyanide caught. Based on what? Also, he made no reference to where his angel was collected so we have no reason to assume that his angel was caught using drugs.

 

[dwanner]

It seems that there are mixed signals on this topic, is QT to be avoided as dwarf angels require a decent amount of live rock to thrive and most QT tanks are set up with bare bottoms and no live rock?

 

[SkullV]

It seems that there are mixed signals on this topic, is QT to be avoided as dwarf angels require a decent amount of live rock to thrive and most QT tanks are set up with bare bottoms and no live rock?

Like I said, QT isn't just for medicating. I only have one friend who is very interested in Dwarf Angels but he has 2 QT tanks. The first is for right after the fish arrive and it looks like a normal FOWLR tank. This tank is to get the fish relaxed and eating (FAT). Once the fish is fat, eating prepared food, and can handle treatment he has a hospital tank with only PVC (but the PVC has algae on it) that he ties Nori all over (to simulate live rock to a point). He then treats with Prazi and Hypo before it goes back to the FOWLR QT again for another couple weeks to calm down after treatment. If all is well then the fish can go into the display.

Seems like the system has been working. I am still curious to know if the OP is using the completely unfiltered well water that he spoke about in another thread in this tank. Seems like that would be highly suspect as to the reason he keeps losing fish.