"ICH FREE TANK" Quest Begins

[markcasto]

Thanks plaz the tang is eating now so hope all will be well.

I heard lots of people tell me that ich was allways in the tank but the facts dont support that theory.

If the parisite was bigger and we could see it better then it would be easier to keep out of our tanks but I belive that if you kill them all they wont get into your tank unless they are put there by you. They dont fly into your tank from the sky they come in on fish and rock and such.

The hard lesson to learn here is to treat everything that goes into your tank with QT or pay the price, and I belive that many of us myself included get lulled into a false sense of security then all it takes is that one parisite to slip in and your in big trouble.

Sure if you have a small tank and not too many fish you will find it less bother but with a big tank like mine dealing with ich is a nightmare world.

Welcome to my nightmare...

 

[diverdan814]

my experiences after a year and a half

my experiences after a year and a half

I have learned that QT is certainly a way to go but it is not without pitfalls. I have lost more than a few fish in a QT tank. Seems like the larger water volume in my displays eliminates the cycling and amonia problems associaited with my 20 and 30 gallons QT tanks.

One must constantly change water, remove uneaten food, and this is no guarantee. Even if a QT tank is cycled, you still have to hope that the fish settles in.

What I have learned is that for certain species like anthias, QT is good for getting them to feed. I had a square spot that learned that the turkey baster and me = food. It took several weeks but he eats well now.

Tangs almost always need QT as they have a propensity to bring it into the tank. I have had to do hypo for tangs bringing ich into my system.

What I do now (learned this from an experienced wholesaler) is to do a freshwater dip, PH and temperature balanced, with some blue paraguard solution. Angels, tangs and triggers handle this quite well and can go about five minutes. 80% of all fish pulled from the ocean have fluke worms and you can see them come out during the dip. It is quite amazing to watch. A lot of ich also gets eliminated this way, although if the ich is embedded deep in the fish, freshwater dips won't eliminate that.

The fish love it- it cleans them out and gets rid of many parasites that cannot handle the freshwater.

Anthias, cleaner shrimp, crabs, all get dipped but for much less time.

This has worked for me. QT is risky. I know it is a fooproof method for eliminating ich, but all should know that it is NOT without its risks as well.

 

[cduran02]

Im contemplating treat all future fish I get for ich while their in quarantine. Here's my new QT procedure:

1) Aclimate new fish to my parameters.
2) During the first two week, build up the fishes imune system, garlic etc.
3) Following two weeks treat with low dose of copper (half the recomended dose.
4) 2 weeks of copper free QT
5) Put the fish in display

I will QT everything else for 12 weeks. Im going to set up the QT tank with good lighting (for future corals) and build a stand for it (currently I just have it on the floor) and keep it in our bedroom as a small display.

 

[tjay]

The pitfalls all surround the ability to maintain a stable QT tank.
It is work trust me.

I will post a couple picks of my QT that I plan to keep running at all times. It is not perfect but so far so good.

One of the things I think is an absolute plus was listed above. When a new arrival comes how do you know you are caring for it correctly while dealing with a main tank full of other inhabitants.

One advantage I see ( looking at half full vs half empty) is that the QT period is a great way for us to get to know the life form in a controlled environment before introducing it to our small ocean with competing animals.

 

[markcasto]

Yes I have to agree, it is not without its risks. But the task of having to remove ALL of the fish from your main tank once ich has taken hold makes the risks seem small in the long run.

I am now keeping an intensive log of everthing I am doing so I will learn from it all and be able to pass it on.

My tang is now feeding better as well, something I could not get him to do in the main tank so it has its benifits.

 

[cduran02]

Having a QT tank forces one to prepare better for new stock. Theres less inpulse buying because you know it will be a while before you introduce your new creature into the display.

Maintaining a QT shouldnt be that dificult, the best thing to do is, to keep a sponge filter media in your sump or fuge. When you get a new fish, setup your QT (if its not already running) the day before and toss the sponge in the QT or use it as the media for the QT's filter. And make sure you toss a new sponge in the displays fuge/sump for the next time. When your done with QT discard the old sponge.

 

[Triggerfish]

the "real" only pitfalls of using a QT is not monitoring water quality. the larger tank you can setup the better..i really think a 50-55 is a good size.

it's amazing to think that not too long ago, i was not an advocate for the use of a QT, except to medicate diseased fish.
but after researching the most notorious parasite in the marine world, i wouldn't think of doing anything but use one. it's only taken me 9yrs to realize it.

OK, i tested the swing arm hydrometer with the exact IO mixture indicated by the manufacturer to equate to a SG of 1022.
Results:
swing arm measured around 1019.
this seems to coincide with what some of you folks have attested to when using the refractometer. i am doing a 20% water change now and will bring sg to read 1012 with the swing arm. think it will be closer anyway to what it was b/f.

BTW: it's great to post these experiences with you folks that will follow this.. it will be a year long thread and hope you all stick around and continue to provide input. thanks

 

[tjay]

Yes it was a great idea Trigger.
One thing I noticed and appreciate is that there are varied levels of experience and tanks here so it should be fun to compare notes as we progress.

I have two things to report today but I am not sure they are related to the process.
I lost an emerald crab sometime this morning. I just noticed him lying on his back. This is in the main tank, all levels are good so I am not sure what caused the little fellow to kick off.

I also am noticing a lot of new small white hair like algae growing on my glass and plastic skimmer box. I did a search on hair algae but it seems that it is green not white. I wonder what I am in for?????

I started dripping kalk in my main today the tang in QT is still doing great.

 

[markcasto]

I think the more people that read this thread and decide to QT there fish the better.Sure will save them a lot of greif if there tanks get ich.

One big problem I am having is the ammonia levels I am 99% sure that if I had some foam filter in my main tank with the bacteria on them ready I would not have been having such a problem with this.
Having a QT tank with out the biological filter ready is hard work lots more water changes means more salt and stressed out fish. Its so easy to avoid just put sponge filters in your main tank or sump ready for the QT without them this is twice as difficult.And I would get a refractomer if you can afford one.

The money of dished out on salt would have payed for this one already.

 

[Triggerfish]

white algae..?? no idea what that would be.

all fish doing well after 1st QT water change and are quiete active this evening.

mark-what size QT do you have going again? and what's in it.
that blows that the amm is giving you an ongoing issue. is there anything you can use from the main tank,,some rock or something? i would try to get something in there to relieve the burden a little.

i did some re-aquascaping in main tank today..redid the whole left side, moved couple corals around and took out some of that crappy old crushed coral remnants i still have sitting in there.
damn,,can't wait to get the fish back in there..+ add a few more.

 

[tjay]

damn,,can't wait to get the fish back in there..+ add a few more.

I hear ya. But here is a little read to reinforce our decision. This is sad we are debating a powder blue or blonde Naso to join our yellow so I read this thread. About half way down this poor soul got hit with ich.

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=589806

 

[tjay]

I have been doing some forward thinking and here is something that is bugging me.
I plan to do a fresh water dip on the fish when moving from QT to main tank. I have been told this should be done on all fish to remove flukes and parasites.

Now here is what is bugging me. With all that we read about the importance of acclimating fish to our tanks then what are we doing when we use fresh water dips.

That is not acclimating a fish at all. Plus once in the dip you have to move them from there back to saltwater within a matter of minutes. You cant slowly acclimate the fish from fresh back to the main tank slowly the fish would die.

I am still a long way from this step but it has been bothering me.

As for the algae, I have no clue what this stuff is. Looks like little clumps of white or clear filaments growing on rocks glass and plastic. Where would be the best place to post for help with that.

 

[Triggerfish]

lol..ya that's what 25yrs experience will do to ya.. of all fish not to quarantine...a tang..funny reading that post,,i was ready to respond before i even knew what the outcome was. i posted a brief comment anyway..

are you going to dip the fish or bath the fish?
if you are going to dip it..just make sure temp and ph are the same..the fish will not last long before going into osmotic shock..maybe only 30-60 sec depending on species. iv'e never had any acclimation issues after dipping fish.

what about a bath..less stress i think. that worked well to release the mature ich parasites from my angel..

new tank pic: still need to add about 50-60#'s more of rock.

Trumpet coral

Toadstool

 

[markcasto]

The QT tank is a 52 gallon Juwel Rio 240. I have the two big tangs on small one 8 chromis and 2 yellow tailed damsels in there.I am checking the ammonia levels twice a day and using water changes and amquel+ to keep it down.

2 days ago I placed the old juwel filter system back on there I did however give the filter sponges a very good clean in boiling water as they had been in my shed for some time.This might be the reason for the ammonia peeking a bit.

I am going to get some bottled bacteria this week and add that to see if it will help.It is very surprizing to see just how fast ammonia can build up and doing a test twice a day is the only safe way to be sure its ok.

On the bright side though my tang is feeding really well now and they both seem in good health. It will be good to see them back in my main tank again.

 

[markcasto]

Heres a pic of my tangs in the QT tank.
Glad to say they are both doing really well and theres no sign of whitespot.

Now on my second week of Hypo treatment and things are looking good ammonia starting to level out but I still test twice a day to be safe and keep a bottle of amquel ready.

Out side I have a 200litre rain butt to store my RO water in and I have done more water changes then I care to think of but it will be worth it to have an ich free tank.

 

[cduran02]

Good looking Tangs you got there Mark.

Today hits week 7. Main tank is being over run by pods now. I think they are even anoying my cleaner shrimp. Not even my horse shoe crabs can keep the population under control. The pods even seem to make fun of the HS crabs by riding along on their backs. When I feed the tank I have to make sure to put double the food or else the pods wont leave enough for the others.

The fish are going to have a feast when they go back in.

 

[plaz]

Great looking Tangs Mark! It is very rare to see the Yellow Bellies - at least in the states!!!

 

[markcasto]

The two tangs are at least 5 years old now but I have had to seperate them as they are fighting with each other. My tank is crawling with pods as well they are all over the back wall.Your right the fish will have a major feast when they go back.

Doing this hypo treatment is not so difficult as I thought it would be and it saves having to use lots of salt with the water changes.

The big plus is you get to study the main tank with out fish in it all those other creatures have a chance to come out and play. But I do miss having the fish in there.

 

[cduran02]

I think I will be using hypo on new fishes when I QT, weather they need it or not, just to make sure they are "clean" when they go into the tank. The LFS water is usually at a lower salinity than my tanks so it would take that long and it wouldnt be as stressfull at the bigining, the worse part is bringing them out of hypo....would have to be very slow. Since my (errr my companies) density meter is so accurate, I could do 0.0005 every 12 hours and make it a smoother transition.

 

[Triggerfish]

Update

Update

ok,,going on week 2 in hypo, i have noticed a couple of spots on my angel.. damn.. other fish look ok..
i think i will lower the sg a bit more and just go with the swing arm reading.. if it's lower then there is nothing i can do about that at this time.. i'm brutally strapped for cash and cannot get the refrac at this time.
- as it is, i had to hold off on a couple of group buy orders that i had planned. and salt supply is getting low.

i have also began to add some copper as well to help move this drawn out process along.