idea for a buried cooling loop

sharkdude

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637Resize_of_Rotation_of_cooling_loop.jpg


my house is built with a crawl space underneath with about 2-3 feet of clearance. It stays quite cool under there, even in the summer. The general idea is to bury a type of closed loop in the hopes that this would provide some cooling effects to the main tanks during the summer.
I think I could do this with just the main return pump with two valved inputs from the sump. This way I could either draw straight from the sump or send some quantity of water through the loop at a slower rate and hopefully achieve some cooling. When the summer heat is over, I could drain the line and close off the valves. Gravity would work to equalize the levels between input to the cooling loop and the intake to the pump, so I would not be sucking water against significant head pressure as you might expect. kind of like a closed loop application.

Main problem I see is not enough capacity in the cooling loop. A total of 100 feet of thin wall 1 inch pvc gives only about a 4 gallon capacity ( pi x radius squared x length of pipe in inches / 231 cu in per gal).

difficult to estimate how much cooling as variable of length of pipe, temp differnetial of ground, efficiency in heat transfer of pvc, rate of water flow, etc.

what do you guys think? am I nuts or possibly on to something that may work?

maybe a buried and sealed larger reservoir? or thin vinyl tubing in many feet coils?
bury it as deep as possible like 3-5 feet?

I want to keep any pumps or valves easily accessible and not under neath the house, nor do I want to add any additional pumps to conserve electricity.

I hope to achieve an approximate 5 degrees F cooling on my estimated 150 gal water volume system during peak summer heat waves.

comments appreciated.
 
i saw someone do something like this in the large tank forum, they dug some 10-15 feet deep in their yard and burried lots of insulated hose for cooling.. it worked as the guy never had to use a chiller... dont ask me where this thread is but it will work if you can get more hose.. 4 gallons of water in a hose underdround wont do anything...
 
Chris It is only 4 gallons of water but it would be circulating. I would think the hose they use for thermal heating would proabably have a better heat transfer rate then PVC. To me the trick part is how to control the cooling.
 
You could do it as a remote DSB, using a sealed container of sand with moderate flow over the top of it, buried under ground. This gets you higher water volume and a secondary use (denitrification). With 150G, a pair of 5 gallon buckets filled with water, simply placed in the crawl space or buried to the rim in the ground may actually be very effective at increasing water volume, lowering nitrates, and cooling the tank.

See: http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=595109
 
Chris, talk to Steve Garrett or Drew Whetherholt. They both use the ground for cooling their tanks. Steve uses something simular to your plan. Drew went the other way and buried a 180 gallon tank.
 
interesting read jjirsa78. I scanned several pages and while it seems it would have benefits of denitrification, I am not convinced I would get a whole lot of cooling from what you propose.

I also cross posted this in the diy forum, and I've gotten a few interesting replies there too.
http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=952653

it would be an awful lot of sweaty work to set up, just to have it fail or not work as intended, so the more input the better.

I definately want to have something in place by next spring/summer heat waves.

If it wasn't for the high electrical costs, I'd just invest in a chiller and vent it outside.
 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8359886#post8359886 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by laverda
To me the trick part is how to control the cooling.


I thought that's what MH's were for;)

Didn't Dave B do this for a while? If I had a sub floor I'd sure do it, or atleast get the chiller down there. It might be best to just throw a 60 gal plastic drum down there and circ through that.
 
Unless you hit well water i would scrap the idea.
Yep i had an underground cooling setup that consisted of 20 holes each 8" in Dia and 6' deep in the last two feet of the hole i placed 50' of 1/2" refrigrant tubing and ran the system with a heat exchanger in my sump. The heat caused by the pump used up half of the cooling capasity and the other half was insuficent for my 1000gal setup. I just use blower fans like Marc Trimble, thay only use 50 - 70 watts and can do as much cooling as a 1 1/2 hp chiller.

see you at the meeting this friday
Steve G
 
I beleive Scuba dave did one in Florida. Saw a thread about it. I remember seeing pic's of him digging up his whole back yard to put in the pipes. Lot of work.

As for your drawing, I see one flaw. You have the pipes all connected in parallel to two manifolds. This may or may not work and could cause stagnet water. The best bet is to make one continous run and loop it back and forth. One it will prevent any stagnet areas and two it will allow for a longer contact time with the ground for heat transfer. Also you may be able to just lay the piping on the ground under the house and not have to bury it since it dosen't get that hot under there. That way you could run more piping.

For the winter months or when you don't need the cooling, you will want to do something with the water inside the pipes. Either drain it or cap it and flush it out before the next seasons use as the water will go stagnet and cause problems. Also may want to set up some way to flush it seperat from the tank just in case you need to.

I too have a crawl space and have been complentating the idea but since I live on the coast, so far I haven't had any issues with heat that a small fan didn't take care of.
 
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