I'm Baffled. Suggestions?

powder_blue

New member
So I just completed my new system and after I promised myself that I wouldn't buy a new skimmer, I of course bought a new skimmer. I have the sump baffled at 6in for the skimmer section and now it has to be set at 7in. I have 1/4 glass baffles on a 40 breeder. There is not way for me to take the baffle out to put in a new one because the system is up and running. I was thinking of having a new baffle cut and place it in front of the old baffle. The current baffle is water tight but of course it's an inch too short. If I place the new baffle directly against the old baffle will that work? Also since I can't silicone it in I need suggestions on how to adhere the 2 panes of glass together. I am thinking that the new baffle would not be water tight around the top 1" because of the slight space on the sides. Anyone see this as a problem or have suggestions on how to raise the height other than this?
 
If you have decent flow the extra inch doesn't have to be completely water tight... A flat piece of waterproof material held onto the short baffle would probably be enough to raise water level, even with a little leaking past it around the ends. Keep in mind what you use may expand, like acrylic would (but not much) so don't make a tight dry fit.
 
With baffles set at 6 or even 7 inches on a 40 breeder you're losing a lot of potential water volume. I suggest throwing all your equipment in a Rubbermaid tub temporarily and redo your baffles at 12 inches and put your skimmer on a egg crate or PVC/acrylic stand to the desired height. This will be helpful to if you replace the skimmer in the future as only the stand needs to be adjusted and not the sump itself.
 
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So I had them cut a new glass baffle at 7" and also a piece that is 1". I'm wondering if I could take the 1" piece and superglue it to the other 6" baffle? I could then put a little superglue on the sides and stick it to the tank walls as well. I just just REALLY do not want to have to go spend $100 and remove my sump just to replace this baffle. I know I could make the baffles taller but I like them to be set at skimmer level and it also gives me piece of mind for a power outage. I don't really care about a few extra gallons of water volume and I don't want stands for the skimmer and zeo reactor. I appreciate all suggestions as I know their are a million ways to setup a sump.
 
With just 1" I think you will fail. Not enough to hold it.
Put the 7' up against the 6" inside the chamber & do it that way.
 
I would just drain the sump down a few inches and move the filtration into a tub or bucket next to the tank for a week or two and silicone in a 2" piece of glass (overlapping at least 1" onto the old one, sealing along the top and sides, allow to cure for at least a full week or longer then put all back together. leave a small power head or something in if you have any algea etc in the sump you can't move.

Otherwise your best bet is to do as others suggested and just place the 7" tall piece in front of the other baffle on the high water side and I'd sort of "seal" it in place or rather wedge it in with a bead of reef epoxy and maybe a piece of foam to keep it pressed tight in place. With enough flow the leakage will not matter.

Super glue won't stick long to glass
 
A picture of the sump would be helpful. Having said that, there are a number of options, depending on space available. Placing a higher baffle up against the existing 6" one will probably work just fine. You could use an old mag float to keep it in place. Other option would be to build an acrylic box 7" tall in which you could place the skimmer. Still another would be to adjust the overall levels in the sump.
 
With baffles set at 6 or even 7 inches on a 40 breeder you're losing a lot of potential water volume.

Maybe yes, maybe no. Sump isn't really about adding water volume to the system, it's primarily there to enable effective surface skimming of the main display and secondarily as a place to put unsightly equipment. Depending on the ratio of display to sump, lower baffles will provide greater overflow capacity in the sump versus higher ones. In the case of the OP, display to sump ratio is about 2.8, which is good, and he certainly could raise the baffle height if desired, however, not really sure what the benefit would be (beyond the requirement to have 7" depth for the skimmer).
 
Maybe yes, maybe no. Sump isn't really about adding water volume to the system, it's primarily there to enable effective surface skimming of the main display and secondarily as a place to put unsightly equipment. Depending on the ratio of display to sump, lower baffles will provide greater overflow capacity in the sump versus higher ones. In the case of the OP, display to sump ratio is about 2.8, which is good, and he certainly could raise the baffle height if desired, however, not really sure what the benefit would be (beyond the requirement to have 7" depth for the skimmer).

Not maybe, it's a mathematical certainty that it adds volume to the overall system and the more volume the better as proof from how difficult Nano tanks are to maintain consistent parameters compared to larger tanks or the fact that dosing errors or pollution won't have a greater effect on a large tank compared to a small tank.

In my opinion, utilizing the maximum amount of water without overflowing the sump when turning off the return pump is advantageous.

I'll use my 29 gallon sump for example. If I set my baffles to 6" I would effectively cut my sumps volume in half from 24 gallons to 12 gallons. While the loss of 12 gallons may not sound like much it's essentially 15% of my total volume. (90 gallon display with an estimated 30% displacement from rock, sand, livestock, equipment)

Furthermore, depending on the setup, if I had a 6" baffle height the flow through the sump would be so rapid the baffles would likely not allow sufficient time to pop and therefore would get sucked into my return pump and into the display. So many people put a valve on their return pump to slow down the flow. This is counter productive. A) you wasted money on a bigger pump your're not utilizing and B) For most systems, we can never have enough flow.

And finally, I'll reiterate my second point from my original post, had the op setup the baffles to a greater height initially, any future replacement of a skimmer that required a different water level would only require that a new stand be made, which is cheap and easily accomplished.

It is for that very reason we are having this discussion.

Your point of hiding equipment is valid and rudimentary. Surface skimming is a good point too as an overflow clears the top layer of water allowing for better light penetration and increased gas exchange and oxygenation. However, your points don't contradict mine. They are simply other benefits of a sump and not specifically water level/baffle height.

Here's a good read by Marc Levenson from Reefkeeping Magazine that reiterates some of my points.
 
Why not just add more water to the sump, or raise your float for the ATO by an inch?

This is certainly an option and also the easiest. I was under the impression that the baffle would make the water level as stable as possible. Not sure if it would be any less stable using my ato? This is actually the first tank I've ever run with baffles and never had an issue with bubbles on either.

I am a slow flow through the sump person and I try to keep it close to what the skimmer turns over if not slower. I just bought the new RODC Water Pump so now I will have even more control over sump flow.

Thanks for all of the info I love to see all of the different opinions! I'll try and post a pic of the sump when I get home this evening.
 
Not maybe, it's a mathematical certainty that it adds volume to the overall system and the more volume the better as proof from how difficult Nano tanks are to maintain consistent parameters compared to larger tanks or the fact that dosing errors or pollution won't have a greater effect on a large tank compared to a small tank.

Eh ..... no! Mathematical certainty that it adds volume, sure, all else is conjecture. Simply adding a few extra gallons to the sump just doesn't make any material difference. It is my opinion, based on many years of running reef tanks, that the whole 'volume' things is a red herring. Just because somebody writes it doesn't make it true :lol: I've seen no direct evidence, one way or the other, than a larger sump volume (beyond absurd extremes) contributes anything in terms of stability. And frankly, if you are running so much flow through your sump that bubbles don't have a chance to rise to the surface, then you're putting far too much water through the sump - unnecessarily!

But a debate for another thread . . .
 
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Eh ..... no! Mathematical certainty that it adds volume, sure, all else is conjecture. Simply adding a few extra gallons to the sump just doesn't make any material difference. It is my opinion, based on many years of running reef tanks, that the whole 'volume' things is a red herring. Just because somebody writes it doesn't make it true :lol: I've seen no direct evidence, one way or the other, than a larger sump volume (beyond absurd extremes) contributes anything in terms of stability. And frankly, if you are running so much flow through your sump that bubbles don't have a chance to rise to the surface, then you're putting far too much water through the sump - unnecessarily!

But a debate for another thread . . .

Perhaps 15% more water in my system doesn't make all that much of a difference. But I believe it does just based on the fact that while we're maintaining delicate micro ecosystems the inevitable human error will have less of an effect on a larger volume of water as opposed to a smaller amount. It's rather basic, we know a tablespoon of salt is going to have a greater effect on a liter of water than it would on a gallon. Also, wouldn't you agree that if you had one coral in a liter of water and one coral in a gallon of water, the coral in the liter of water is going to use more calcium, etc. faster than the other, thus, resulting in reduced stability until you dose or change the water?

And to your point of too much flow, I also believe that more flow through your sump would be better than less flow. The more "new" water that comes in contact with a filter sock, skimmer, uv sterilizer, GAC, GFO, etc. will result in better efficency of cleaning the water than a slow flow that is constantly filtering some of the same already processed water. One could argue these point are minuscule, but maybe it's just that little extra that keeps algae in check or the tipping point for an acro to be brown or colorful.

In the grand scheme of things every little improvement helps. They all add up.

To each his own.
 
Also, wouldn't you agree that if you had one coral in a liter of water and one coral in a gallon of water, the coral in the liter of water is going to use more calcium, etc. faster than the other, thus, resulting in reduced stability until you dose or change the water?

Conceptually I absolutely agree. Trouble is the practical quickly diverges. Reef tanks are like storage: crap expands to fill the available space. Sure, there are exceptions, but the vast majority of the reefs I haven seen are pushing their limits. I just haven't seen a bit more sump volume make a whit of difference - and I've been at the reefing game longer than most.

And to your point of too much flow, I also believe that more flow through your sump would be better than less flow. The more "new" water that comes in contact with a filter sock, skimmer, uv sterilizer, GAC, GFO, etc. will result in better efficency of cleaning the water than a slow flow that is constantly filtering some of the same already processed water. One could argue these point are minuscule, but maybe it's just that little extra that keeps algae in check or the tipping point for an acro to be brown or colorful.

I have been arguing this point for a very long time. At the end of the day there is no harm from more versus less flow through the sump. But other than absurd arguments like the need to match skimmer throughput with sump flow, I have yet to hear (or experience) any cogent reason to exceed 2-3 times display volume per hour. The notion of 'new' water really is a non factor, otherwise recirculating skimmers wouldn't exist.

But you're right, to each his or her own.
 
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