IncomeTax time - Am buying High dollar equipment, Please help?!

[Mpthreer]

After everything comes back in I should be getting close to $3,400 dollars approx. for my incometax. I am going to spend it all on my aquarium to try to get it really close to being a dominant SPS tank. Ok I've got a 120 gallon rimless starphire reef tank with an overflow. I have 432 watts (Eight 48" T5 HO 54 watt bulbs) of T5 Lighting over it and the tank is 24" tall. I have a 30 gallon sump below it with a 1200 GPH return pump that circulates about 1000-1100 GPH @ 5 ft of lift. I've got 5 maxijet 1200's right now on an alternating wavmaker. Which is a piece of crap setup as far as flow goes. I am looking to upgrade this as well. I have a eshopps skimmer that is bottom of the barrel but it works ok for now but I'm geting a new one that can handle heavy loads so I can upgrade this thing to a full blown sps tank in the future. So here goes. Note: Please give me solid opinions based on actual usage or based on someones opinion that you know very well and trust in this hobby that has had actual expierences with these brands and even better if they've used the actual model numbers. Thanks!

I need to buy -

1. New quality test kits & refractometer.
a. Sailfert
b. api
c. seachem

Which brand should I use for the price. I was thinking sailfert for calcium, magnesium, alkalinity, and ph. Then using seachem marine and reef test kits for phosphate, nitrite, nitrate, ammonia, silicate, and iodide/iodine. That way I can save some money for the other stuff. I also need a quality digital salinity tester that is very accurate, so which one doe you guys use and what do you think about the tests?

2. New Skimmer
a. Deltec External Protein Skimmer APF600
b. Bubble King Mini 180

I am really partial to going for the Deltec because it is cheaper and I have seen a lot of people grow successful reef's with Deltecs but I'm not sure about the bottom line of either of their skimmers. I've also seen some awsome tanks online that used Bubbleking. Please inform me and give me some good solid advise on this subject.

3. Calcium Reactor
a. Deltec PF501 Fluidized Calcium Reactor
b. Korallin C1502 Calcium Reactor with Eheim Pump

The Korallin sounds good because I can get a packaged deal with everything I need, regulator, tank, and ph meter. But I'm not sure if it matches the deltecs quality. The Korallin says its rated for 800 gallons an the Deltec is only 237 and is much more pricey. What do you experts think.

4. New Wave System
a. Tunze Multicontroller w/ 4 Tunze Turbelle® Stream 2 Controllable Pump Model 6105 @ a flow rate of 792 to 3,434 gallons each
b. Hydor Koralia Wavemaker Controller 4-Way Deluxe w/ 4 Hydor Koralia 4 Controllable Powerheads @ a flow rate of min 550 GPH and max 1400 GPH each

5. Kalk Reactor
a. Precision Marine Kalkreactor KR620
b. MRC (My Reef Creations) Kalk Reactor

I am going to hook my auto top off unit up to the Kalk Reactor to help keep my ph buffered and to blast useable calcium into the tank when my tank gets low due to evaporation. I would go for the MRC Kalk Reactor but I didn't see any available on their webpage at the moment, so what have you guys hurd about the Precision Marine Kalk Reactors?

All this is going to cost more than my budget allows, I'm going to have to sacrifice somethings and get some later. so would the Hydor Koralia Wavemaker setup work well for me. I only have 120 gallons of display tank so I think the tunze setup would be overkill right? Mabe if I only used two of the Tunze powerheads, but even then I'm still going to be paying more for it. I've hurd great things about the Tunze's and I've hurd some good stuff about the Hydor Koralia. I want to buy the items in the order listed, so first testing supplies, next the skimmer, then the calcium reactor, after that I'll make due with whatever flow system I have to that is acceptable, and finally a kalk reactor. Thank you very much for your time and please let me know what you guy's have expierenced and share your thoughts with me.

Basically that is all I'm going to buy to add on to my tank right now. As soon as I get all this installed I'm going to get a canister filter with UV of to keep the bacteria and diseases and algae that is free floating killed off. I will have to clean it out quite often though to keep it from becoming a nitrate factory but it has a nice polyweb filter cartridge and I hear their easily cleaned. I also am going to put a sock filter on my sump and install a nice refugium as soon as I figure out how much space I will have left inside my stand. Kudo's to you all~ Matt :strooper:

 

[BLANKENSHIP76]

1. Salifert---
2. New Xtreme Cone 250A
3. GEO 618
4. 2 Vortechs
5. GEO Kalk Reactor
6. Reed Keeper Elite

You can buy all of this and still have some money to stock your tank with frags.

This is what I would get, if I had $3400 and blank slate.

 

[chadfarmer]

1 i have no clue
2 atb small
3 geo 618
4 tunze
5 dont need it

 

[detroit_fan]

1 I use salifert, but some like the other ones better

2 MSX 250

3 Geo

4 2 Vortechs

5 Don't need it, just mix you kalk into your ato water and let your top off pump do the dosing(I use a Liter Meter 3 for this)

 

[8BALL_99]

1. API. IMO they are just as accurate as Salifert but easier to read and test. They also give you plenty of tests.
2. Skimmer I dont know. I wouldn't get a Deltec, They work well But IMO they are overpriced. They are made with thin Acrylic and just aren't worth the price. The ATBs seem to the the in thing now but they are very $$. I'm sure in a year or two ATB will be old news and there will be another In skimmer. Both ATB and Bk having nothing but good reviews minus the complaints about price. IMO though if your on a budget these top of the line skimmers might not be your best bet. You can get a good skimmer that performs very well for much less. Might not be the best of the best. But you pay a premium for that little extra.
3.Geo 618
4. I don't see how you need 4 tunze streams for a 120. I've got 2 of them and vortech in a 300 and its plenty of flow. Your tank is half the size. I'd just get two Tunze with a controller or Two vortechs. I like the Tunze better because they are quieter and bullet proof. Vortechs take up less space in the tank though. So your choice
5 Aquamedic Stirrer model 1000 I've got two of them and they are great. Pretty cheap no pump to clog. They work like the deltec but cost less then half the price.

You could easily get everything on your list with 3400 if you shop smart and don't worry about buying high end.. Just Buy what you need to run your tank No more no less. Trying to keep up with the Joneses will just waste money

 

[sjm817]

1) Unfortunately, Salifert is not what it used to be. Check out Elos.
2) Lots of interesting options in skimmers these days. I wouldn't pick the APF600 unless you want to run an external. There are many internal skimmers that would work well for less $.
3) pass
4) I think a pair of 6105s would be plenty for a 120
5) Ditto on the dont need it. Mix the lime in your topoff.

 

[Mpthreer]

Awsome thanks a lot for all the great replys guys, I'm happy becasue I feel now that I'm gonna save some money and get just as good of a reef growing! Thanks again~ Matt

 

[8BALL_99]

I don't know about you guys that pass on the Kalk reactor/Stirrer. If you have the cash for one I'd do it. I agree that it should be at the bottom of your list since all it does it make life easier. About twice a month I Turn the lid 1/4 turn lift dump several spoons of lime in then close.. Thats it. thats all I have to do to keep my top off saturated with Lime. For 200 bucks its very worth it to me.

 

[FishTruck]

Hey there. Your money and the space under your tank will go fast! Sounds like you are on the right track though.

See below...

After everything comes back in I should be getting close to $3,400 dollars approx. for my incometax. I am going to spend it all on my aquarium to try to get it really close to being a dominant SPS tank. Ok I've got a 120 gallon rimless starphire reef tank with an overflow. I have 432 watts (Eight 48" T5 HO 54 watt bulbs) of T5 Lighting over it and the tank is 24" tall. I have a 30 gallon sump below it with a 1200 GPH return pump that circulates about 1000-1100 GPH @ 5 ft of lift. I've got 5 maxijet 1200's right now on an alternating wavmaker. Which is a piece of crap setup as far as flow goes. I am looking to upgrade this as well. I have a eshopps skimmer that is bottom of the barrel but it works ok for now but I'm geting a new one that can handle heavy loads so I can upgrade this thing to a full blown sps tank in the future. So here goes. Note: Please give me solid opinions based on actual usage or based on someones opinion that you know very well and trust in this hobby that has had actual expierences with these brands and even better if they've used the actual model numbers. Thanks!

I need to buy -

1. New quality test kits & refractometer.
a. Sailfert
b. api
c. seachem

*You will test your alk, Ca, and Mg most often for an SPS tank. Salifert will be fine for that. Good to have Phos on hand too. Marine depot has refractometers for pretty cheap. Definitely a good investment!

Which brand should I use for the price. I was thinking sailfert for calcium, magnesium, alkalinity, and ph. Then using seachem marine and reef test kits for phosphate, nitrite, nitrate, ammonia, silicate, and iodide/iodine. That way I can save some money for the other stuff. I also need a quality digital salinity tester that is very accurate, so which one doe you guys use and what do you think about the tests?

2. New Skimmer
a. Deltec External Protein Skimmer APF600
b. Bubble King Mini 180

*Two awesome skimmers there! However, I am surprised you are not going with an in-sump setup to save space. I use a reeflo orca 250, so I can't comment further... except that external skimmers will require some kind of colection cup with autoshutoff for safety. Or else, an overflow that will drain back into your sump if there is an overflow problem. Price out a reeflo orca 200 just for kicks... if you are sure you want an external skimmer and check out acropora nut's TOTM from awhile back. If you are going to spend some Cash though, an awesome skimmer is a good investment for the long haul.

I am really partial to going for the Deltec because it is cheaper and I have seen a lot of people grow successful reef's with Deltecs but I'm not sure about the bottom line of either of their skimmers. I've also seen some awsome tanks online that used Bubbleking. Please inform me and give me some good solid advise on this subject.

3. Calcium Reactor
a. Deltec PF501 Fluidized Calcium Reactor
b. Korallin C1502 Calcium Reactor with Eheim Pump

*Check the dimensions on those. I use a GEO reactor which works great for me and was much more compact than the comparable Korallin model for my tank size.

*You did not mention a controller. If you use, for example, an aquacontroller, you can use the pH probe from that and use your aquacontroller to handle the lights, heater, chiller, CO2 solenoid, etc... This will save space on wiring to eliminate timers, multiple control mechanisms, regulators etc... The aquacontoller can expand to have two pH probes (one for your sump, one for your Calcium Reactor). Use the aquacontroller to hold the pH inside your reactor constant (mine is at 6.6). Then, you just adjust the effluent rate until it holds your ALK stable in your tank.

The Korallin sounds good because I can get a packaged deal with everything I need, regulator, tank, and ph meter. But I'm not sure if it matches the deltecs quality. The Korallin says its rated for 800 gallons an the Deltec is only 237 and is much more pricey. What do you experts think.

* the capacity depends on how much media it holds and the maximum effluent rate that can be supported, while holding the pH somewhere in the 6.5-6.9 range, without burning CO2 too quickly. An under-rated unit will require media to be replaced often and CO2 bottles that will empty more quickly. Maybe there is more to it than that... but, the Korallin units are supposedly efficient with the CO2... which I guess is why the rated capacities are so high. Most of the Korallin users really like them, but, they are hard to set up for the first time user, since the instructions are practically in German. You will find plenty of help on RC for that though. My real life experience with my GEO is that the media lasts about 10 months and a 20 lb. CO2 bottle lasted me for a year. The only maintence it needed was to replace the maxijet that feeds it and tubing that gets clogged on the feed end.

4. New Wave System
a. Tunze Multicontroller w/ 4 Tunze Turbelle® Stream 2 Controllable Pump Model 6105 @ a flow rate of 792 to 3,434 gallons each
b. Hydor Koralia Wavemaker Controller 4-Way Deluxe w/ 4 Hydor Koralia 4 Controllable Powerheads @ a flow rate of min 550 GPH and max 1400 GPH each

*I would favor the Tunze. If you do end up with an aquacontroller, you can use that (with the aquasurf module) to ramp up and down your tunze pumps as well. The programming you can do is crazy and includes wave generation in your tank.

*Start with two of them. Four is alot for 120! You might even stick with what you have to save some money for now rather than buy something that you might trash later. You wont really need monster powerheads until your tank is loaded with Corals and the tunzes are easy to drop in later, as long as you plan your aquascaping carefully.

*Also, you can get a lot of bang for your buck (flow wise) with eductors on your returns. They burn about five feet of head pressure, but, boost the "in-tank" flow by about 4x.

5. Kalk Reactor
a. Precision Marine Kalkreactor KR620
b. MRC (My Reef Creations) Kalk Reactor

*I use the PM Kalkreactor powered by a peristaltic pump (liter meter), and an ATO from ATO.com. Works well for me for about two years now. Simple, solid construction and the maxijet works well to stir the kalk. I recharge the Kalk about every three months for my 500 gallon system. What are you going to use for a RO water resevoir? If you plan to run an RO line directly to your Kalk reactor... you might need to look at Deltec. I am not sure about MRC, but, I am pretty sure the PM unit is not rated for that kind of pressure. I use both a calcium reactor and a Kalk Reactor, but, you can easily get by on just the calcium reactor if you run out of space under your tank.

I am going to hook my auto top off unit up to the Kalk Reactor to help keep my ph buffered and to blast useable calcium into the tank when my tank gets low due to evaporation. I would go for the MRC Kalk Reactor but I didn't see any available on their webpage at the moment, so what have you guys hurd about the Precision Marine Kalk Reactors?

All this is going to cost more than my budget allows, I'm going to have to sacrifice somethings and get some later. so would the Hydor Koralia Wavemaker setup work well for me. I only have 120 gallons of display tank so I think the tunze setup would be overkill right? Mabe if I only used two of the Tunze powerheads, but even then I'm still going to be paying more for it. I've hurd great things about the Tunze's and I've hurd some good stuff about the Hydor Koralia. I want to buy the items in the order listed, so first testing supplies, next the skimmer, then the calcium reactor, after that I'll make due with whatever flow system I have to that is acceptable, and finally a kalk reactor. Thank you very much for your time and please let me know what you guy's have expierenced and share your thoughts with me.

Basically that is all I'm going to buy to add on to my tank right now. As soon as I get all this installed I'm going to get a canister filter with UV of to keep the bacteria and diseases and algae that is free floating killed off. I will have to clean it out quite often though to keep it from becoming a nitrate factory but it has a nice polyweb filter cartridge and I hear their easily cleaned. I also am going to put a sock filter on my sump and install a nice refugium as soon as I figure out how much space I will have left inside my stand. Kudo's to you all~ Matt

* As space becomes short, I would hold off on the cannister filter. Plan for a possible UV sterilizer, but, they are not usually necessary. Especially if you quarantine. I confess that I use one, but, I have a fish room and space to burn.

* In summary, you have good lights and a good sump. I would prioritize a skimmer, calcium reactor and aquacontrolller. When you need it and have the cash, add on the aquasurf and tunzes. In a year or two, if you have trouble holding your calcium up when your SPS and clams are growing like crazy, add a Kalk reactor. UV only if you have room.

*Also, the best advice I got which I can pass to you is to get a HUGE supply of two part solution and magnesium. When you initially set up your tank, you need to dose your Calcium, Alk, and Magnesium to proper levels before you start tinkering with your Calcium Reactor. I don't know why, but, initially getting these up, especially Mg, can be a real challenge and if you don't do this first, your calcium reactor will give you fits.

I hope that gives you some things to think about. Can;t wait to see your build thread!

 

[bosborn1]

I would make room for a Hanna Phosphate photometer. I think its an absolute need for a SPS tank. Phos will give you problems in a hurry and titration is not an accurate method of testing, especially at number less than 0.1...Which is the level that is must be below.

Also I would pick up a good controller. Neptune's AC Jr is what I use and I love it. Since you need to monitor pH anyways I think your better off just getting a controller rather than a pHmonitor.

As for your skimming try a MSX200 skimmer. Similar performance at a much cheaper price. if you want something cutting edge....(While I have no personal experience with it) take a look at the MSX MiniS cone skimmer. Cone skimmers work very well, and it might be wise to consider one. MSX has the cheapest cones.

 

[sjm817]

Good call bosborn. The new mini cone looks like it will be pretty sweet, or you could get an MSX200 and have more $$ for other stuff.

 

[JNye]

do you have SPS currently?
I'm not sure you need a calcium reactor right away. if you must check out aqua-c
You need to upgrade flow right away though, I'd go with 2 vortechs.
A better skimmer is a must, lots of good choices listed above, skip the deltec.
Kalk reactor- its a good idea, Geo owners seem to love theirs. I've been told by a friend PM makes solid reactors. I like having a kalk reactor, it keeps up with my calcium demand just fine, I've been growing SPS for almost a year now. Eventually I'll need to step up to calcium reactor, I just think they come later when necesary.

 

[chadfarmer]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14412187#post14412187 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by bosborn1
I would make room for a Hanna Phosphate photometer. I think its an absolute need for a SPS tank. Phos will give you problems in a hurry and titration is not an accurate method of testing, especially at number less than 0.1...Which is the level that is must be below.

i would never recommend a hanna meter

i had one and never used it more than 5 times

i also had the deltec low range test kit

these are a luxury item and you can run a sps tank with out them

i haven't tested my water in over 8 months (i mean anything but salinity)


skimmers are a personal preference (just don't be a beta tester for any of these companys make them do there own R&D)

 

[8BALL_99]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14412498#post14412498 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by chadfarmer
i would never recommend a hanna meter

i had one and never used it more than 5 times

i also had the deltec low range test kit

these are a luxury item and you can run a sps tank with out them

i haven't tested my water in over 8 months (i mean anything but salinity)


skimmers are a personal preference (just don't be a beta tester for any of these companys make them do there own R&D)

I agree 100% minus the you dont need any tests. I do test Alk, CA, and MG but thats about it. I know tons of people with SPS tanks and non of them own a hanna meter. Most never test anything other then three things I listed.

 

[Mpthreer]

Thank you all so much for your kind advise. I wouldnt make it very far without you guys! Last night after getting rid of the pricey deltecs and making cash room for other things, I had room for the aqua controller III Pro with the 8 port plugstrip and all the lab quality meters. Only thing I'm cant see buying right now is the tunze's. Check out my shopping cart list and let me know what you guys think i should do! Thanks again!

Note: All this is also considering what will fit under my tank, I dont know if i'll be able to fit the refuge in there on top of my sump anymore but I'm gonna try lol. If not I will get a side cab and redo some plumbing. I might also eventually get a ozone reactor to control orp. And If i dont get the tunze's i'll probably get the canister filter with uv as well.

CR-GEO-618
618 Calcium Reactor by GEO
$415.95 $415.95

CR-AM76023
Kalkwasser Stirrer 1000 by AquaMedic
$238.95 $238.95

PS-OCT-PRO-250
Reef Octopus PRO 250 Needle
Wheel Protein Skimmer*
$499.95 $499.95

TK-SL008
Calcium Test Kit by Salifert
$24.95 $24.95

TK-SL017
Magnesium Test Kit by Salifert
$24.95 $24.95

TK-SL015
KH/Alkalinity Test Kit by Salifert
$15.95 $15.95

TK-SL033
Strontium Test Kit by Salifert
$36.95 $36.95

TK-SC990
Marine Basic Multi-Test Kit
75 Tests, by Seachem
$25.95 $25.95


TK-SC992
Reef Special Multi-Test Kit
75 Tests, by Seachem
$26.95 $26.95


CO-DXCR
Deluxe Calcium Reactor Package
Calcium Reactor Media: : ARM Media Coarse, 10 lbs.
CO2 Cylinder: : 5 lbs.
CO2 Regulator: : Milwaukee MA957
pH Controller: : Milwaukee pH Controller
$294.95 $294.95


CT-NS-AC3PRO-DC8-PHORP
Aqua Controller III PRO
w/ pH, ORP &Temp. Probes &
DC8 by Neptune Systems
Please Select pH & ORP Probes: : LabGrade pH&ORP Probes
$794.95 $794.95

WP-TS24
Tunze Turbelle Stream Kit TS24
$978.83 $978.83


Order Total

Merchandise Total: $3,379.28

Order Total: $3,379.28

All from Aquacave.com for easy reference to shopping cart.
And I would get a bigger c02 tank but I dont have the space.
With the tunze's its pushing the price really close. If i didnt
get them I could get a refugium of choice and the UV canister filter.
Plus some extra cleanup crew and macro algaes.
What do you guys think, once again thanks a lot for the
great info. I cant say it enough!

 

[Mpthreer]

I also thougha bout one of the cone skimmers along with a bunch of others. 500 dollars for something that is overated for my tank seemed good. Plus ive got a friend taht has had some phat sps colonies on maast growing on his dual ocotopus 160 on a 300 gallon total water volume. What do you guys think about the ocotpus pro skimmers?

 

[Creetin]

Well look at the Itech skimmers! It will save you money and keep your money here in the states.
Look for the Itech thread in this forum.

 

[BLANKENSHIP76]

You won't need the Milwaulkee controller for the reactor the ACIII PRO will take care of that.

Also the OctoPRO250 has the Askoll 900 pump on it, not to many people have had much positive to say about that pump.

You would be better served for 120 gallon tank to get a better skimmer for $379.00 you can get the MSX Extreme 250 w/2 sicce pumps (A major uprgrade over the OCTO PRO250). Having an oversized skimmer is a GOOD thing. I would seriously get the xtreme 250A cone (skimmers are the CRUCIAL with keeping a good SPS tank) spend your money where you need it.

I like the Octo PROs I have a 300PRO, but it has the Askoll 1500 pump, NOT the 900 pump.

Finally, you really don't need a kalk reactor if you are going to get a calcium reactor. Your need for extra calcium on new SPS tank will be 1-2 yrs away, and until then you can dose a little 2 part solution to keep everything regulated.

 

[Jefe12234]

The Octopus Pro skimmers were replaced by the Hurricones. They use the Askoll 1500 pump but have a new pinwheel, volute, and skimmer body with a semi-cone shape. I just got a CAT-2 internal for my 120 which is way overkill. It's a huge improvement over my MSX 200 though, which didn't pull enough air with the pinwheel (and meshwheels are too unreliable for me). I would definitely recommend the CAT-1 for your tank. I cannot say enough good things about the Askoll 1500 pump and I would try to get one regardless of what skimmer it comes on. I do think the Hurricones are the best value, though. A complete cone skimmer with an Askoll will cost you a few hundred more and I can't imagine it performing much better than what I'm seeing now.

An MSX 250 will save you a few hundred more and will be an improvement over the 200 with the additional pump, but I have had problems with the Sicce from day one. Others seem to like them a lot, but the Askoll seems to be more reliable.

 

[sjm817]

The Octo Pro 250 with the Askoll 900 doesn't get great reviews. I would reconsider that,

Not a fan of kalk reactors. It is so simple to just mix the kalk in your topoff. If you can mix a glass of lemonade, you have all the skills needed to do this. Money is better spent elsewhere.