Keeping difficult fish vs. fishing

[Roadkillstewie]

...consider also, if no one tried it, where would we be?

Some of the fish, creatures we are able to keep..have been a result of trial and error.
I'd say it's one thing to try a difficult 'fish' and fail, then another... to try, repetively w/o re-assesing what went wrong the first time.

 

[michealprater]

If someone had not taken a risk at one time, we wouldnt even have saltwater aquariums in our home. However, I do agree with some comments made previously, the methods need to change from one attempt to the next. The true definition of insanity, is to do the same thing over and over again, the same way, and expect different results.

 

[Kahuna Tuna]

Great topic IMO and a lot of very valid and insightful points are being made here. Here is my take on reef keeping and fishing in general. There is no question that commercial food fishing operations are one of the greatest threats to the oceanic environment (the other being degradation of the environment in general), and that commercial aquarium livestock fishing and sport fishing have a miniscule effect compared to the other factors. I know a lot of anglers who catch and release (it seems to me a large percentage of sport anglers are in this catagory now) and the fish they catch and release are in infinately better hands than a novice aquarist with a 20 gallon tank. In the big scheme of things, neither sportfishing or the aquarium trade is going to have a significant impact on the environment by itself. We are however a convenient target for environmental groups.

The part of this hobby that kills me is seeing LFS's continuing to sell completely innapropriate fish and coral species to absolute beginners, knowing full well the organism has no chance at survival (the LFS owner knows there is a much better chance of making another fish or coral sale when this one dies), the amount of garbage like this that continues to go on in this industry just digusts me. The goal in shops like these seems to simply to sell livestock as fast as possible and make as money before the person quits the hobby in frustration. The majority of shops I have personally visited fall into this catagory unfortunately.

With rare fish, those of extremely limited geography, or hard to keep species I think they should be left in the sea whether common or not. I think that some species have shown themselves to be so notoriously difficult or innapropriate for home aquaria that further importation only harms our hobby in the long run. My one exception to this thought is when I see experienced or dedicated aquarists trying to keep a difficult species in order to unlock some husbandry secrets, this type of experimentation has helped our hobby greatly IMO. There is a difference between a noob keeping a moorish idol in a 30 gallon because he liked "Gill" in finding nemo and a veteran fishkeeper trying to figure this species out.

 

[ctrl+f]

I think some of the opposition comes from the suffering inflicted. Slow starvation in an aquarium is a pretty terrible way to go.

The other thing is that people make a distinction between food and pets. If I eat a steak most people consider that okay, but if I neglect my cat, that's cruelty.

I have a problem with people taking a living thing for decoration and mistreating it. I can live with fishing because people are omnivores.

 

[tibob32]

it's the whole killing for pleasure vs killing for need... The whole argument is invalid as one we can simply decide not to do it, the other one plays a role in survival. Then I guess we could push it further by including people who simply grow fatter by the minute; those who will eat fish without the need to. I guess on both sides, we can simply go intelligently and with moderation.

 

[ShrimpChipGal]

IMHO, everyone should take a minute stand in other's shoes and think about it before flaming. There are many different circumstances/factors in every situation. Could everyone on the board access the same supply of fish? Could everyone find the same kind of food? Just to name a few. I am a firm believer in the benefit of exchanging experiences; however, finger pointing and blame assigning really does no one any good. I, too, have experienced such unpleasant replies and it has prompted me to share less and post less.

On a lighter note, the thought of eating deceased ornamental fish is just nauseating. Considering how many fish I have seen with parasites. :hmm3:

 

[psilentchild]

If you are the owner of a lfs who are you to decide how much experience one has?(This is a question I'm not mad or trying to argue with anybody I can see how this question can be taking the wrong way)What lfs should do is give the buyer all the information he needs to be successful in keeping this fish.What is experience determine by years?Or what you have done in those years.I think if you want a fish get it.Well do your research learn what problems come with this fish.What has worked and what has not worked and go for it.Now if you are unsuccessful revaluate what went wrong and try again if you want.Its all trail and error if no one would have tried the very first salt water tank we wouldnt be here today loving this hobby.I have a buddy of mine who started after I did and he has been battling ich for about a year now.I have not had an ich problem(knock on wood).So who is more experience in ich me or him when I started in saltwater a whole year before he did.

 

[timdam]

seriously though, and i'm not trying to be funny... if we really wanted to stop eating fish we could. same with meat. we are not eating them for survival. we are eating them for enjoyment. fact is, we could all be vegetarians. now i'm not saying that i am one. i eat fish and meat.

 

[Masterofnonsense]

Great topic. A great example of a difficult fish is the orange spotted filefish. How many times has it been said that they are impossible without a large aquarium full of sps and short of that they would be doomed. However some brave individuals have managed to not only keep them without corals, but have even had success breeding them and raising the fry. It is great seeing folks progress the hobby and figure out how to keep harder species.

As far as the fishing aspect goes, there are a lot of fish that we keep that are also caught for food as well. I know clown tangs, and blue spotted rays are caught to be eaten and I would wager that far more of them are caught for food than are those destined for the aquarium trade.

 

[tibob32]

you're right to some point. If I don't get my red meat I become a dangerous man :fun2:

 

[psilentchild]

I would love to have a pair of orange spotted filefish.But LA and I think someone on here are the only ones that have got them eating frozen food.

 

[michealprater]

I am really enjoying all of you opinions. If you are enjoying the thread, don't forget to rate it!