Kelley's 37 gal system. from the start

[zmazza]

Sorry for the double post, but just remembered something...

Do you happen to have any more pictures of your overflow and bulkheads? Do you remember what size bulkhead that you used? That looks like a really safe way to set up a sump. Water in my living room is a very big concern, and one reason I've stayed away from sumps. The overflow does look like it will work very well during a power outage though to keep water from going in the floor.

It doesn't work on a siphon, does it? It's just natural flow?

Would you mind posting some more pictures or dimensions on your overflow and bulkheads?

Thanks!

 

[kelley_mc]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9171833#post9171833 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by bstoner
I really like your stand and canopy so far. I like how you made a trim piece for the tank to hide the edges and the plumbing in the back.

Thank you! I tried to think of the final product and did my best to keep the focus on the display and not the equipment and plumbing.

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9171833#post9171833 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by bstoner
The sump looks good too, but where are you going to put the skimmer or are you not going to have one?

That is the interesting part....

The skimmer will actually sit in the middle section BUT the pump and the water outlet will sit the drain section. The reason I did this was because the water level in the drain section of the sump will always be at a certain level except when I overfill it like I did in the pic when I tested the sump. The actual water level of the sump will be lower than what I show in the pic. Here is a very quick drawing (not to scale).

I will use the remaining area in the refugium for LR rubble and some macro. I may have to build a screen to keep the area around the skimmer body clean. I would use eggcrate if I find that is necessary.

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9171833#post9171833 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by bstoner
And how did you get that paper towel roller in there without the paper towels getting all soggy!!!:lol:

I can't reveal all my secrets...

 

[kelley_mc]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9172901#post9172901 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by zmazza
Thanks for the helpful tips. I wish I had more cabinetry tools. My brother-in-laws are framers and use alot of tools like miter saws, circular saws, table saws, etc. A router or biscuit joiner are hard to come by. So basically, like you said, just make sure the sides of the canopy cover up the black trim? And it's modular? That's really awesome. I'm definitely going to give it a try.

Go for it! Anything is worth trying, right? With some patience and time, I am sure it would come out great. Maybe your brother-in-laws can frame the stand for you!

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9172901#post9172901 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by zmazza
Then again, I guess you don't have to cover up the back, do you? Since that part will be up against a wall?

Correct. You will want the back open to allow for airflow.

 

[zmazza]

Sounds good. I can build a 2x4 frame all day long, but it's the actual skinning that gives me such a headache. Definitely worth a try though. I'll hav eto lay down some plans.

One question though. How do you keep the top half from falling over? Does it just rest on the tank?

And are there any reasons to use 2x2 instead of 2x4?

 

[kelley_mc]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9172921#post9172921 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by zmazza
Sorry for the double post, but just remembered something...

Do you happen to have any more pictures of your overflow and bulkheads? Do you remember what size bulkhead that you used? That looks like a really safe way to set up a sump. Water in my living room is a very big concern, and one reason I've stayed away from sumps. The overflow does look like it will work very well during a power outage though to keep water from going in the floor.

It doesn't work on a siphon, does it? It's just natural flow?

Would you mind posting some more pictures or dimensions on your overflow and bulkheads?

Thanks!

I am using 1" bulkheads. I bought these from Savko. Mine are threaded on the inside and outside. I then painted a pvc elbow with black krylon fusion I bought from HD and screwed it in. Then I screwed the nut on the back of the bulkhead and made sure the elbow was straight.

I will be updating the actual drain plumbing once I finish the stand. I will post more pics of the drain plumbing at that time.

As for the overflow box, it is a Calfo style. If you are not familiar with these, you can find a lot of good information here on RC about them. I believe my box is roughly 20"x5"x2.5". The actual size of the box is not overly critical. As long as it can handle the flow, you can make it any size you want.

You are correct, these style overflows work by gravity, not siphon. I bought a HOB overflow and never had the guts to use it. Scared me.

 

[zmazza]

You have really got me wanting to start a new tank with a sump. I believe I'm going to take your lead and start working on one of my own. The overflow is just built out of a few pieces of glass, right? Is one side shorter than the other side? Or is it just a box without a top? Water comes around from all the edges?

I'm going to check out Savko. We're the 90 degree elbows the only things that you had to buy? That sounds like it was pretty easy to do. I guess the other thing I need is a diamond hole saw.

1" bulkhead = 1" hole in glass? You've got 2 bulkheads, right?

How long do you have to wait for the Krylon to dry before you can put it in the tank?

 

[zmazza]

Is this the bulkhead that you purchased? You purchased two of them, right?

http://www.savko.com/partlist.asp?pgid=2&ptid=6&pid=30&part=8837930738

Did you use any ball union type connectors? Or did you just run pipe straight from the bulkhead down to the sump below?

Again, thanks for helping me with this. I've wanted to learn more about building a sump for a LONG time but can never find the right sources.

 

[kelley_mc]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9173076#post9173076 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by zmazza
One question though. How do you keep the top half from falling over? Does it just rest on the tank?

Yes, I used 3/4" plywood datoed into the canopy. The front and side rest of the top of the tank. The back actually sits on the lower part of the stand on the trim. I will use pins here to keep it in place.

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9173076#post9173076 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by zmazza
And are there any reasons to use 2x2 instead of 2x4?

Not sure what you mean. I used 2x4s. I don't think 2x2s would be strong enough.

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9173175#post9173175 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by zmazza
You have really got me wanting to start a new tank with a sump. I believe I'm going to take your lead and start working on one of my own.

Good, I think...

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9173175#post9173175 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by zmazza
The overflow is just built out of a few pieces of glass, right? Is one side shorter than the other side? Or is it just a box without a top? Water comes around from all the edges?

Open top. Just a very thin layer of water comes over the entire front of the box. The sides are slightly higher, only because that's the way they were cut. The key is to have the tank perfectly level. You want the water to come evenly over the top of the box.

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9173175#post9173175 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by zmazza
I'm going to check out Savko. We're the 90 degree elbows the only things that you had to buy?

I bought the elbows at Home Depot or Lowes, I can't remember. I only bought the bulkheads from Savko.

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9173175#post9173175 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by zmazza
I guess the other thing I need is a diamond hole saw.

I got mine from ebay, a guy name Lau. Cost me less than $10 shipped.

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9173175#post9173175 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by zmazza
1" bulkhead = 1" hole in glass? You've got 2 bulkheads, right?

Nope. The 1" is the inside diameter. You will need to get a bigger hole saw. There is a thread by JustOneMoreTank who goes into great detail on drilling tanks. He even has the conversions of bulkhead size to mm drill bits.

Yes, I did get 2 bulkheads.

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9173175#post9173175 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by zmazza
How long do you have to wait for the Krylon to dry before you can put it in the tank?

Not sure on this one. I would give it a couple days at least. I painted mine weeks before they saw the wet test.

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9173189#post9173189 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by zmazza
Is this the bulkhead that you purchased? You purchased two of them, right?

http://www.savko.com/partlist.asp?pgid=2&ptid=6&pid=30&part=8837930738

Yes, I think that is them.

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9173189#post9173189 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by zmazza
Did you use any ball union type connectors? Or did you just run pipe straight from the bulkhead down to the sump below?

I did use unions. You can see them here:

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9173189#post9173189 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by zmazza
Again, thanks for helping me with this. I've wanted to learn more about building a sump for a LONG time but can never find the right sources.

Happy to help. Good luck and let's see some pics when it's done!

 

[zmazza]

Sounds good. I'm going to go ahead and order those bulkheads, if those are the right ones. I'm also going to check out Lau and order that glass drilling hole saw.

Thanks again!

 

[zmazza]

Thanks for the tip on Lau. I am about to order the 45 mm hole saw. Savko says there 1" lightweight T*T uses a 1.75" hole, so that's 44.45mm, so I figure with a gasket it should work out OK. We'll see I guess.

 

[kelley_mc]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9173777#post9173777 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by zmazza
Thanks for the tip on Lau. I am about to order the 45 mm hole saw. Savko says there 1" lightweight T*T uses a 1.75" hole, so that's 44.45mm, so I figure with a gasket it should work out OK. We'll see I guess.

Yup, 45mm sounds right. I think that is what I used.

 

[zmazza]

Sounds good! Because that's what I just ordered!

It's crazy how good those prices are. You couldn't HOPE to get anything at that price here in the states. If you can even find it locally.

Thanks for the link to Savko.com as well. I didn't even know that site existed but I'm definitely going to be ordering from them.

Did you order the gaskets from savko as well? Or did you just use silicone to seal everything up? And is your overflow sealed with silicone only as well?

After looking at your plumbing setup, and i know you'll get to it later, lol, but just a quick question.

Do you have the bulkheads coming down to a Y and then into one pipe? Or do they drain seperately?

 

[kelley_mc]

Wednesday I installed my RO/DI unit. A Typoon 5 stage system with booster pump. I also purchased a dual TDS meter, TDS alert and pressure gauge. Installation was a breeze, took about an hour or so including mounting it to the wall. I was originally getting 85 psi out of the pump but the RO/DI unit was rated at 75 psi. I have since adjusted the pump down to 75 psi and I am getting about 4 gals of water per hour at 0 TDS. Surprisingly, the water out of my well comes in a 34 TDS.

Here is an image of my setup.

 

[kelley_mc]

A member of my local reef club recently had to move and sold his setup. I purchased another 20 lbs of LR for about $3 per pound. I also purchased a large mushroom rock from him for $25. It is about 8 inches across. Here is an image:

I purchased this nice polyp rock from him for $5!

He also gave me a free clump of chaeto for my sump. Right now that is sitting in my QT with about 35lbs of LR I probably won't need.

I wasn't planning on getting any corals at this time but these were too good to pass up and are very easy to care for. They now sit in my 29 gal.

 

[zmazza]

Congrats on the purchases. Can't beat deals like those.

Keep posting those pics! I'm getting ready to start drilling my tank here soon. I've just got to order a 30" light (I've got a 36" coralife double right now) so it will fit in the canopy, and a pump. I've got my eye on the quiet one 2200, which is just over 600 gallons per hour.

Got any more pics of your cabinet / stand or your overflow?

And do you have trouble keeping the tank topped off for the overflow? Do you just set it right at the water line? Is it OK to have water higher than the overflow box? Or do you just top the tank off every day?

 

[vessxpress1]

Wow! Just got done reading your whole thread and this is great. Glad you decided to let us tag along.

I love the overflow you went with. You made it look so easy. How much water sits in the overflow box under normal operating conditions? Could a small fish survive in it? Are you going to put some type of grate over the top? The setup looks to be almost accident proof but it looks like fish and other critters (especially snails) will get in there pretty easily. I guess I'll have to go back and look. Maybe your elbows are low enough in the box that nothing 'should' get under them to block them. That's an excellent design.

Your explanations for the way you're cooking the liverock were very good. That's a great way to do it. I'm cooking liverock too, that after about 5 years just exploded with algae growth. After a month and a half, they're still leaching nitrates. Anyway, you have a good method for transfering them straight over to the other bin. You probably already know but the rock will stay good for a while under wet newspapers too, if you ever need to leave them out for a while. Just keep them damp and you shouldn't have any die off. Your method is safer and quicker though.

The stand is really neat. I love how the black trim is covered. Have you considered putting narrow trim pieces on the corners of the tank?

Man, I've got a lot more questions for someone that's really thought everything out so well but maybe I should just sit back and watch the progress.

Anyway, awesome job. Keep us posted. I'm subscribed.

 

[zmazza]

Definitely top notch, kelley. One question about the canopy... Did you just use oak plywood? I'm thinking of using 3/4x3/4 moulding on the inside to keep it on the tank. Would that work? As for lighting, what did you use? Or what would you recommend? I'm not an electrician by any means, but I had considered purchasing the satelite single 1x65 w lunar light. I'm sure it will fit in the canopy. At least I hope it will. I'm thinking at 30", it will sit RIGHT on top of the tank rim. With a glass lid underneath, I should be good to go. I guess we'll see. LOL.

 

[kelley_mc]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9173932#post9173932 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by zmazza
Did you order the gaskets from savko as well? Or did you just use silicone to seal everything up? And is your overflow sealed with silicone only as well?

Gaskets came with my bulkheads. Silicone should not be needed on the bulkhead. However, you are correct, I did use silicone on the overflow box.

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9173932#post9173932 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by zmazza
Do you have the bulkheads coming down to a Y and then into one pipe? Or do they drain seperately?

No, they are seperate drains. I wanted both of them going down to the sump. If one failed due to blockage, I have the other available to keep on going. Both drains are rated at 600 gph, more than enough in each one.

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9197452#post9197452 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by zmazza
Congrats on the purchases. Can't beat deals like those.

Keep posting those pics! I'm getting ready to start drilling my tank here soon. I've just got to order a 30" light (I've got a 36" coralife double right now) so it will fit in the canopy, and a pump. I've got my eye on the quiet one 2200, which is just over 600 gallons per hour.

Got any more pics of your cabinet / stand or your overflow?

Yes, I was very happy with the prices.
I will try to post pics as often as I can. I know that I always like to see pics too when I read a post. I don't have many others right now. The stand is still at my father's workshop so I can't even snap a couple for you. In the future, I will post some detailed pics so everyone can get a better understanding of how it went together.

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9197452#post9197452 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by zmazza
And do you have trouble keeping the tank topped off for the overflow? Do you just set it right at the water line? Is it OK to have water higher than the overflow box? Or do you just top the tank off every day?

The way an overflow works is that the water in the display will always be at the same level. Evaporation will actually be visual in the return section of the sump. That being said, yes I do top off water daily. The location of this tank does not allow for an auto-top off. But maybe in time I will try to plumb something up from the basement. We'll see.

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9198336#post9198336 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by zmazza
Definitely top notch, kelley. One question about the canopy... Did you just use oak plywood? I'm thinking of using 3/4x3/4 moulding on the inside to keep it on the tank. Would that work?

I don't see why that wouldn't work.

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9198336#post9198336 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by zmazza
As for lighting, what did you use? Or what would you recommend? I'm not an electrician by any means, but I had considered purchasing the satelite single 1x65 w lunar light. I'm sure it will fit in the canopy. At least I hope it will. I'm thinking at 30", it will sit RIGHT on top of the tank rim. With a glass lid underneath, I should be good to go. I guess we'll see. LOL.

I will be using a Sunpod from Current USA. It is MH with 6 white lunar lights and 6 blue lunar lights. Nice light, very happy with it.

 

[zmazza]

Price kept me from going that route. I've just got a few zoanthids, so I'm not too concerned about high lighting. I only run one lamp on my 192 watt fixture anyway. I'd sell it or trade it for something smaller if I could. I don't think the 30" single 65w fixture will get too hot in the canopy. I'm going to leave the back open, anyway.

I checked around on some prices... I couldn't get any prices on the krylon fusion though. I'm going to get some blue and black. The smooth sided pine plywood is only 23 dollars a sheet though, so that's a good thing. The most expensive thing is probably going to be the white paint it seems. Perhaps my wife will let me use some of our tax return money to buy that, lol. 100 dollars for a 5 gallon bucket of white paint. I wonder how much paint I'll need?

As far as the corner moulding goes... what did you use on your stand? I know you used the moulding to hide the bottom trim on the tank. I think it looks awesome and would love to recreate that. I'm wondering though... with the 3x4 MDF... you're going to have 3x4" of overhang, right? So if you build the plywood to fit perfectly on the plywood, the moulding should fit perfectly after you "skin it", right? Then with the canopy... you cut it so it fits right inside the moulding? Or how did that work? I'm guessing if it fits inside the moulding... then it can't cover up the trim, right? Or did you even use moulding to hide the trim? Or am I missing something?

 

[kelley_mc]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9198289#post9198289 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by vessxpress1
Wow! Just got done reading your whole thread and this is great. Glad you decided to let us tag along.

Thank you. I enjoy sharing my experience. A lot of people here on RC are to thank (or to blame ) for getting me this involved in a box of water.

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9198289#post9198289 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by vessxpress1
I love the overflow you went with. You made it look so easy. How much water sits in the overflow box under normal operating conditions? Could a small fish survive in it? Are you going to put some type of grate over the top? The setup looks to be almost accident proof but it looks like fish and other critters (especially snails) will get in there pretty easily. I guess I'll have to go back and look. Maybe your elbows are low enough in the box that nothing 'should' get under them to block them. That's an excellent design.

The overflow is known as a Calfo overflow, at least that's what many people call it. You can find a lot of information here on RC about them.

The water level is at about the bulkhead level.

I don't think I would want to put a fish in there. Small space and tubulent water would not make good living conditions.

You are correct. I will actually be using a piece of eggcrate over the top of the overflow to keep the critters out of it. The elbow is low, but not low enough to keep anything out of it. I thought about it but was somewhat concerned about cleaning it. If the drains ever start to get dirty, I can use a small cleaning brush and clean them. This may never be an issue, but I tried to plan ahead just in case.

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9198289#post9198289 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by vessxpress1
Your explanations for the way you're cooking the liverock were very good. That's a great way to do it. I'm cooking liverock too, that after about 5 years just exploded with algae growth. After a month and a half, they're still leaching nitrates. Anyway, you have a good method for transfering them straight over to the other bin. You probably already know but the rock will stay good for a while under wet newspapers too, if you ever need to leave them out for a while. Just keep them damp and you shouldn't have any die off. Your method is safer and quicker though.

I am sure you know this, but I do want to say that I cured my LR this way, not cooked it. However, you can use a similiar technique, just don't use the light. I believe "cooking" required darkness.

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9198289#post9198289 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by vessxpress1
The stand is really neat. I love how the black trim is covered. Have you considered putting narrow trim pieces on the corners of the tank?

Yes I have thought about it. I have seen tanks with those and they are SWEET. However, my tank is pretty small and I don't want to block too much of the view. In addition, my top and back is completely removable in case there is ever a problem. I think those trim pieces might make it harder to design something to fit there.

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9198289#post9198289 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by vessxpress1
Man, I've got a lot more questions for someone that's really thought everything out so well but maybe I should just sit back and watch the progress.

Anyway, awesome job. Keep us posted. I'm subscribed.

Thanks for sticking around and thank you for the kind words.