Large Tank IN a Basement-Ventilation Suggestoin Please oh brethern of the mamoth tank
- Thread starter skippyreef
- Start date
I know this is an old thread, but trying to find a practical, economical solutions for humidity control for my fishroom....The new tank is roughly 350 gallon display and 157 gallons. The fishroom itself is 12x15, and I already have ductwork installed to exhaust humid air to the outside. Should I install another duct to bring air in or draw air from outside the fishroom as the fresh air source?
I should add that I installed vapor barrier to all the walls and ceiling and used Dense Armor drywall.
The house is total electric with heat pump, so I'm taking it no ill affect from negative pressure. Should I add air ducts from the viewing area as well?
I should add that I installed vapor barrier to all the walls and ceiling and used Dense Armor drywall.
The house is total electric with heat pump, so I'm taking it no ill affect from negative pressure. Should I add air ducts from the viewing area as well?
jnarowe
New member
Ultimately is comes down to how much humidity you are experiencing, and how much you can afford to correct it. If you cool your tank via evaporative cooling, you will see a lot more humidity than using a chiller. Something to think about though, is that it is very nice to get "fresh" air into the tank room. I don't know what the weather is like in PA, but that is a major factor in deciding to use indoor makeup air, or outdoor.
Bringing in fresh air helps a lot to stabilize ambient CO2 & O2 and I believe that is key to a healthy tank.
Bringing in fresh air helps a lot to stabilize ambient CO2 & O2 and I believe that is key to a healthy tank.
Thanks....here in PA we have a short period of humidity, but not extended periods of time....The tank and fishroom will both be located in the basement which is totally finished and is the family room.....Adding a chiller wouldn't be an issue, but was trying to cut energy costs, so was thinking that just adding another duct to pull fresh air in might be the better of the 2 options.....I'm looking at installing the Hydrofarm ActiveAir Blower fan which is rated at 465 cfm. I know this is overkill for the size room.....
jnarowe
New member
that's about what I did but with higher CFM, believe it or not. I had mine set to room temp. because ambient humidity is high here in the Northwest. But, it's my experience that using this method of cooling will give sporadic results. In other words, in my tank room, humidity could often climb higher than what I could remove, due to ambient conditions. I did use a marine dehumidifier as well, but getting a commercially rated one is also something to consider.
Next time around, I will cool my tank with a ground loop, and greatly reduce the amount of humidity I am adding to the room.
Next time around, I will cool my tank with a ground loop, and greatly reduce the amount of humidity I am adding to the room.
I've had tanks before in my family room itself and never had any issues with keeping the tank cool or humidity, but going with a larger volume of water I want to try to be ahead of the game....I have a 1hp chiller from my last setup, but would just hate to have to go back to using it....Actually with my last setup in the family room I had more issues with heating the tank......So with running an exhaust and intake in addition to a dehumidifier is it possible to control the humidity issues?
jnarowe
New member
I would think so, but again, it depends on so many variables relating to your system and tank room, it's hard to know without trying. Seems like you have everything you need, and you can always phase in cooling and air exchange elements as you see how the system operates. If you are worried about making the hole, you can go ahead and do so before you set the tank up, using a plug/cap, so if needed, you have it ready without disturbing a running system.
It's going to boil down to how much outside humidity you have (percentage and duration). I know it can get pretty humid in the northeast in the summer time. If those periods last longer than a few days, you will need to use something besides evaporative cooling to keep the tank temperature stable. During seasons where the outside humidity is pretty low, you can get away with fans for cooling and exchange with the outside.
450cfm doesn't sound like all that much to me. You (or a consultant, including some that will do it free for you) can do the thermodynamic calculation based on heat you're putting into the tank and the humidity and temperature deltas to determine what flow rate you'll need to evacuate the extra moisture. It goes up pretty significantly if you have a slightly higher humidity outside, so take care!
My tank room is about 16 x 18, I have 1000 system gallons, the outside humidity is never above 30% and often closer to 15 or 20%, and the temperature outside is always below my desired tank temp of 78F. With what are pretty much perfect conditions, I run two 450cfm fans (pointed one each way) and see duty cycles of about 50% during peak warm days.
One side problem I have is that the system doesn't know how to handle rain and snow. In those conditions, the "humidity" goes way up and the fans can get stuck in a feedback loop, bringing more and more water into the fish room. Since we don't get extensive rainy periods, it's never been a big issue.
Just seat of the pants, I would guess you could stay comfortably passive for at least 50% of the time. You'll probably still need the equipment to cool actively some subset of the remaining time, and then there'll be this middle ground where it'll work but have an aggressive duty cycle. It's certainly worth considering, if only for the electricity savings!
Good luck.
450cfm doesn't sound like all that much to me. You (or a consultant, including some that will do it free for you) can do the thermodynamic calculation based on heat you're putting into the tank and the humidity and temperature deltas to determine what flow rate you'll need to evacuate the extra moisture. It goes up pretty significantly if you have a slightly higher humidity outside, so take care!
My tank room is about 16 x 18, I have 1000 system gallons, the outside humidity is never above 30% and often closer to 15 or 20%, and the temperature outside is always below my desired tank temp of 78F. With what are pretty much perfect conditions, I run two 450cfm fans (pointed one each way) and see duty cycles of about 50% during peak warm days.
One side problem I have is that the system doesn't know how to handle rain and snow. In those conditions, the "humidity" goes way up and the fans can get stuck in a feedback loop, bringing more and more water into the fish room. Since we don't get extensive rainy periods, it's never been a big issue.
Just seat of the pants, I would guess you could stay comfortably passive for at least 50% of the time. You'll probably still need the equipment to cool actively some subset of the remaining time, and then there'll be this middle ground where it'll work but have an aggressive duty cycle. It's certainly worth considering, if only for the electricity savings!
Good luck.
Thanks for the info....this is the fan/blower I'm considering....
http://www.amazon.com/Hydrofarm-Act...TF8&coliid=I1R0HTSKF7AU2X&colid=2NDEGP8CU1WUH
http://www.amazon.com/Hydrofarm-Act...TF8&coliid=I1R0HTSKF7AU2X&colid=2NDEGP8CU1WUH
jnarowe
New member
Yes & no. I had my intake and export right next to each other. My intake was just a passive attic vent under my deck. Outbound I added piping outside to run the exported air about 15' away from the intake. Of course, I could only do this because of the tank room being adjacent and lower than a huge outside deck.
phillyfishguy
New member
building tank room
building tank room
I am in the process of building a tank room with my sump and other tanks. My main display tank is in my living room. My basement is open to the rest of the house via stairs. I have an old home but also have attic fan vent. I have gas hot water and gas boiler uses flute. I wonder if I could draw the air from the basement and vent the air outside via bathroom fan. I was going to leave it open to the rest of the basement just now confused to maybe close it up lol
Not a huge amount of water in the basement 48X18X18 sump 30 gallon and a frag tank plus qt tank but not up all the time. Never had a saltwater tank so not really sure. Great thread by the way
building tank room
I am in the process of building a tank room with my sump and other tanks. My main display tank is in my living room. My basement is open to the rest of the house via stairs. I have an old home but also have attic fan vent. I have gas hot water and gas boiler uses flute. I wonder if I could draw the air from the basement and vent the air outside via bathroom fan. I was going to leave it open to the rest of the basement just now confused to maybe close it up lol
Not a huge amount of water in the basement 48X18X18 sump 30 gallon and a frag tank plus qt tank but not up all the time. Never had a saltwater tank so not really sure. Great thread by the way
sfsuphysics
Active member
wow thanks for the bump... I'm going to be in the process of doing a "fish room" (few months out however at a minimum) and venting is on my mind. I'll bring details back later, but I do have an outside wall I can drill through, so figured tossing one of those "quiet" exhaust fans to blow everything outside might be great hooked to a humidistat with temp & humidity controls, but was curious what is an "acceptable" level of humidity? Hopefully the temp will be in the 80 range, so I don't have to use heaters too often (chilling the tank will not be an issue)
Was a tad worried about input air though, the room will be (hopefully) sealed up tighter than a frogs butthole (insulated too
) but I'm worried put a vent (even if its low) might defeat the purpose of me building a room to purposefully trap the heat to save money on electricity (to heat the tank).
Also would it make any difference between long cycles or short cycles of the vent system? I mean I know start up current would add a bit of stress, but was wondering if that really makes a difference. Or would they typically use the same amount of energy either way.
Was a tad worried about input air though, the room will be (hopefully) sealed up tighter than a frogs butthole (insulated too
) but I'm worried put a vent (even if its low) might defeat the purpose of me building a room to purposefully trap the heat to save money on electricity (to heat the tank).Also would it make any difference between long cycles or short cycles of the vent system? I mean I know start up current would add a bit of stress, but was wondering if that really makes a difference. Or would they typically use the same amount of energy either way.
jnarowe
New member
Mike, you have to be very careful about employing a humidistat in your venting system. My experience was with fresh outside air as the replacement air, and often times here in the NW, it was humid air inbound, and my vent fans would cycle on and off repeatedly. Ultimately I disabled the humidistat function and just had it come on at a set temp. You can see pictures on my web site, but the nut of it is, you have to have replacement air, and where it comes from, completes your equation.
phillyfishguy
New member
120
120
120 gallon in my living room rest in basement
120
120 gallon in my living room rest in basement
capncapo
New member
I think I'd watch and see if you have any issues. Your system is not all that large and your house can probably handle the humidity.
Older houses seem to have quite a bit of outdoor air infiltration which can keep humidity levels in check in the cooler months and your A/C
( if you have one ) should handle it in the warmer months.
