Large Tank IN a Basement-Ventilation Suggestoin Please oh brethern of the mamoth tank

[skippyreef]

I paid 127.00 shipped for a Cap-1 de-humidistat that works on temp and humidity levels.

The fan was 169.00 (290 cfm whisper quiet panasonic)

so that cost me 293.00 combined and adding the vents cost another 60.00

so its 353.00 approx all together and thts about what a decent de-humidifier cost.

I look at it like this though:

House would be >250K to replace LOL

then I will have nearly 12K in the tank.......

So this is a drop in the black hole of reefing money pit

 

[clamdigr]

Hmm. This has me rethinking my set-up. Currently two blowers, one on a dehumidistat for the tank room and one that comes on with the halides for the light hood (also in the room). Both vent to outside. I have noticed the basement is warmer in summer than before becuase of the fans sucking in warm (hot) outside are. The basement is finished but I can add the supply and return ducts to the tank room easily and use the current set-up for redundancy. What I wonder is, what about the heat from the lights? How do you handle it? Blow it outside? Blow it to another room where the heat isn't a factor . Or just let it stay in the tank room? Anybody got a diagram they could post?

Mike

 

[skippyreef]

Well if the room is not air tight the heat should move up and hopefully to another area.

What I have is a ceiling vent just behind the lights to drop cold air in the summer. The room is like 70 SqFt adn that vent will cool the area. But I also dropped in another vent in the viewing room to keep that area cool as well. this will also impact the tank temp. The fan will kick on when the humidity rised to abouve 45% (this is what I thnk is reasonable) or teh room temp hits 78

the air that is pulled in through the other room will be cold and dry. the vents into the room are going to be placed at teh bottom of the wall to pull in the coldest air near the floor.

the cold air returns are up high to exhaust the warmer humid air that will be neat the ceiling in the viewing room. there is no way for me to make the fish room behind the tank 100% airtight because of the way the tank is to be viewed so this will all work in tandem to keep things comfortable.

 

[Whaledriver]

Why not have a air tight hood over the tank. You could have outside air in one side and hot air out the other side. Just get a fan on a thermostat

 

[ostrow]

My display is above my basement in living room. Don't notice any heat from the lights. Must dissipate fast on its own.

I'm now leaning towards air intake vent + dehumidifier and skip the exhaust fan. Too many complications that I can see. Negative pressure/CO risk, bringing in the unwanted outside air that is too cold in winter, too hot in summer, etc. I can't get a handle on how to do it safely.

I figure with the air intake on the furnace/ac system, that the dehumidifier only will be needed on days when that system is off, primarily spring and fall days.

 

[capncapo]

The exhaust fan would be much more cost efficient than a dehumidifier provided that an outdoor source of air is included.

 

[Whaledriver]

If you dont want outside ventilation why not run a chiller and a closed top tank. Get low iron glass tops made and dont worry about the humidity. Just use a good skimmer to help with O2. Instead of kalk use Calcium chloride. You might have problems with low PH but you can just keep you ALK at 10-11 and you should be ok. A refuge on a reverse light cycle would also help with the PH.

 

[Gudwyn]

In a tank room with easy access to exterior walls, I'd recommend self installing an HRV. When the HRV is stand-alone, the install is simple (mine was pro installed in the duct work and is a complex job).

HRV's equalize humidity with the outside and don't lose a lot of heat. In a stand alone install, they also can't create any problems with your HVAC system.

 

[clamdigr]

capncapo- I currently vent my basement fish room outside, the light hood is vented to outside as well. I bought the supplies to add a cold air return and supply vent to the fish room and plan to use the outside vent as a back-up and not vent the light hood outside anymore. I'm concerned about the heat from my light hood building up in the room between heat/cold cycles as the room is small. So...do you see a problem if I put, say, an ice cap 4" fan on the hood and run flex hose to the cold air duct so the heat dissipates in the duct between cycles. This would mean two cold air returns in the room, the normal one and one that is force fed.
Or is this crazy talk.

Mike

 

[capncapo]

Mike,

No, it's not crazy talk.

It will help prevent a build-up of heat in your fish room.

Something to consider though is that the heat will not remain in the cold air return ductwork. It, like all heat, will rise which means that it will eventually make it to your upstairs living spaces. In winter it would be no problem but you may not want that to happen in summer as the heat will cause the A/C to run more. Along with that, the added humidity may necessitate the lowering of the thermostat setting to retain the same "comfort level'.

If your cold air return happens to be located in the floor beneath where your thermostat is mounted on the wall ( which should NEVER happen but often does ), it could also give a false temperature reading and make your A/C run more than needed as well as make your furnace run less than needed.

The bottom line is that it will not "harm" anything if you do it. Whether it would be something you want to do can only be determined by trying it and seeing if you like the results.

 

[clamdigr]

capncapo,

Thanks for your help, I'll try it and see how it works.

Mike

 

[ostrow]

Gudwyn: yeah, but where limited resources are in play, which for some they are, that is a fairly expensive option as far as I understand it. I'm looking to spend a hundred or two, not a thousand or two.

Whaledriver: the humidity is from my 5x2x2 sump. Covering it is not really an option as I have an ASM G5 skimmer, and the drain pipes into the sump. Not realistic as far as I can see. I have no need for the expense of buying or running a chiller with 50% of my water volume underground, so that's good. But the humidity is a threat to the studs and floorboards above!

This is a truly informative thread and thans capncapo for all the advice! Gonna take it step by step and do what I have to when I need to! Will probably be doing the vents to outside in spring...

 

[skippyreef]

with the cold air returns in the basement this should help in the summer / winter. In the fall / early spring I think the exhaust is a good option. I finally mounted my fan and it is just behind the tank. I have the supplies to cut in the duct work and the wall vents. I have waited to cut in until the drywall is hung (the furnace room is right behind the wall and so is the cold air trunk line) so that I get teh best position. My ceiling is sealed with greenboard as well to prevent damage.

I think this thread is a great resource and offers some great ideas.

Here is a link to my thread with photo's of my project to date. MAybe that will help with some ideas because the entire basement has been planned to deal with potential humidity issues and strategies to mitigate the humidity if it becomes an issue.
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=654443

 

[kwl1763]

lots and lots of good info in this thread. I am in the plaaning stages for a 400G in my basement and looked at my unit down there yesterday. The good news is that I locted my cold air return. The bad news is all the ducting is that flexduct soft stuff. There is plenty of room where they all meet to add something thoug.

So here is the question do I just cut a hole as high as I can on the intake part at the unit and add the register or would it make sense to cut a hole and run a duct up to the close to the ceiling and put a duct there? I'll try to get some pics up tommorow.

 

[capncapo]

If it were me I would run the duct. That way you wll be taking the air from the most humid area and you will be getting it before it has a chance to become "diluted" by less humid air.

I would also make sure that your existing ductwork is flexduct and NOT ductboard. If it's ductboard, I don't think that I would do the mod without asking a local professional if there will be any negative consequences.

 

[kwl1763]

Ok here goes. Purpose of the post is two fold. Documentation of what I'm doing with pics but more importantly to run what I'm going to do by people who actually know what they are doing

First here are the pics of the unit itself. First is from the front. I'm actually standing in the room where all the equipmen tand sumps will be.

Here is the right side still in the fish room

Now here is the back side which is where I'm planning to tap. It is actually under the stairs. In this pic the fish room is in front if you look "through" the AC but the actual tank is behind on the other side of the stairs.

The right side there is the return side. Hopefully someone can look and verify but I'm 99.9% sure. The plan is to tap the back and then run 6" flexduct up and split it with one register over the tank and the other over the fish room. Does this sound reasonable. Any pitfalls I should watch out for?

My other question regards pressure. If I'm sucking from the basement and distributing to the first floor are ther any pressure issues to be concerned about?

 

[capncapo]

While looking at a unit , the return drop is typically the one that extends closest to the floor BUT if you happen to have a downflow furnace, that would not be the case.

The easiest way for you to determine which side is which would be to follow one of the flexduct run from each side to see where it goes. One of the sides will go to your registers. Registers blow air out. The register side is the supply side and NOT the return side.

The return side also typically has considerably fewer ducts going into it. The return sucks air in.

There wll be no pressure issues and the plan sounds reasonable.

 

[Chris Witort]

capncapo, I had a question about HVAC systems. Could a system that has air conditioning and heating have a humidistat installed that would turn on the AC when humidity gets above a certian level but also run the heat side to keep the temperature in the space where we want it? Sort of like the defrosters work in a car?

 

[capncapo]

Yes, it could be done.

Never havng done something like this, I would guess that it could possibly be very difficult to control exact temperatures and would most likely affect the life of your A-coil.

It would be even more dffiicult to pay the energy bill.

Why not use a dehumidifier or HRV intead?

 

[Chris Witort]

Wouldnââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢t it be accomplishing the same thing without having to buy the dehumidifier? I'm guessing that it would also consume the same amount of energy either way, assuming equal efficiencies. Does a dehumidifyer use the same method of extracting water from the air as the AC coil by condensation.