LED's are bad for our Hobby

[CHSUB]

I've spent no less then 25k+ on different lighting systems all to find the perfect system. Never in that time did I have the simplicity, colors or growth then I did with my very first MH system.


Ecotech Gen 5 Super-Pro are going to blow you away... you will be going back to LED's soon.

 

[b7fig]

Lighting

Lighting

I hope you took no offence to my comment about needing a drink. Was just joking there.

I agree with you that with MH things just work. I remember my 2nd reef tank was run with a 250w halide: I didnt use GFO/GAC/Carbon dosing...nothing. Just a skimmer and water changes. Corals were colourful still. I used to manually dose kalk each night. It was easy to get colours in the acros.

None taken at all. Anytime you put something out there like this, you expect to take some crap.

 

[b7fig]

Gen 5

Gen 5

I've spent no less then 25k+ on different lighting systems all to find the perfect system. Never in that time did I have the simplicity, colors or growth then I did with my very first MH system.


Ecotech Gen 5 Super-Pro are going to blow you away... you will be going back to LED's soon.

LOL. Now that's funny!

 

[1MP3R1AL]

Just the hype that got most of us in trouble.

I've spent no less then 25k+ on different lighting systems all to find the perfect system. Never in that time did I have the simplicity, colors or growth then I did with my very first MH system.


Ecotech Gen 5 Super-Pro are going to blow you away... you will be going back to LED's soon.

 

[ChrisKirkland]

I dont typically comment on these rants but this one I disagree with to a point. LED's are not bad for the hobby. What is bad for the hobby is vendors telling you LED's are just like MH but use less electricity and create less heat.

I have 6 EcoTech Radions on my 300DD (3 - g2's and 3 - G3's) running at 16K 70% output. I can grow SPS on the sand bed and have good overall color. I have a radion on my 60 cube that I can do the same thing running at 16K with 60% output.

I think saying LED's are bad for our hobby shows a resistance to change. If I ever were to create a thread similar to this one I would rather focus on that fact that MFG's and LFS's are over selling LED's. LED's can work for SPS systems if you have the money and time to make them work. When I first got my 300DD I was told 3 radions are all I would ever need. That may be true if they were run at 100% on 10-12K. I have since gotten 3 more and that has made a world of difference on my growth and coloration. Thats my .02.

 

[reef bloke]

Whilst not the best aquarium in the world LED's work for me (Hydra 52's) .
Despite the fact that i have no problem with LED's the other issue that needs discussing is that MH/T5 although still great light sources have a bit of a finite life span now so like it or lump it we have to move forward.

My tank under 52's

 

[Paul B]

During that time with the LED's, I always thought it was something else. Chasing numbers! My phosphates and nitrates were to high, my alk was to low, magnesium was off, my PH was to low. Now I need a CO2 scrubber, dose carbon, this and that.

My reef was started just after Nixon was President (he was after Lincoln) it started with whale oil lighting then incandescent, fluorescent, PC, quartz, MH and now for the last five years a home made LED system. All of my SPS and LPS are growing up the walls and almost all my fish are spawning. I really can't find any problems with my LEDs except they seem to last forever, don't put out much heat, are very bright, light, cheap and don't use much power. Maybe I am missing something.

 

[reef bloke]

Thats as old as me Paul!!

 

[Paul B]

My hermit crabs have canker sores on their lips older than you.

 

[Bilk]

LEDs arent causing the issues you're addressing, it's inexperience. There isnt a single aspect of reef keeping that you can blindly enter and hope to have positive results. Add some hungry salesmen, a huge knock-off market, and a desire to try something new and you have a recipe for trouble but to blame it on LEDs just isnt accurate.

Ignorant hobbyist, place blame where it belongs.

Why would you call out someone that has more experience than you do? He says he has 13yrs of keeping reef tanks. After looking at some of your history, I see you couldn't identify majanos or mantis shrimp that were hitchhiking on some rock you purchased. After 13 yrs of keeping saltwater, I'm pretty sure the OP would know how to identify those two critters, so I have to assume you are not doing this that long. Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't see it.

I feel that when someone has a strong opinion and takes another poster to task, they should post up some pics of what their success is like so we can judge their opinion against their results. You use LED, so why not post up some pics so we can see how well they're doing for you?

 

[muttley101]

Whilst not the best aquarium in the world LED's work for me (Hydra 52's) .
Despite the fact that i have no problem with LED's the other issue that needs discussing is that MH/T5 although still great light sources have a bit of a finite life span now so like it or lump it we have to move forward.

My tank under 52's

Wow you grew those from small frags with Hydra 52's? Impressive..

 

[Bilk]

Whilst not the best aquarium in the world LED's work for me (Hydra 52's) .
Despite the fact that i have no problem with LED's the other issue that needs discussing is that MH/T5 although still great light sources have a bit of a finite life span now so like it or lump it we have to move forward.

My tank under 52's

Now that's a beautiful tank that shows what LED and a good reefkeeper can do with them. I just want to know how you keep the sand from blowing around LOL I'm having a devil of a time finding the right flow without causing a sand storm.

 

[reef bloke]

Wow you grew those from small frags with Hydra 52's? Impressive..

Some are wild but 50% were grown from frags or 30% small mariculture.

A before shot when i started out with a mix of SOL,Hydra and Vega:bdaysmile:

 

[reef bloke]

Now that's a beautiful tank that shows what LED and a good reefkeeper can do with them. I just want to know how you keep the sand from blowing around LOL I'm having a devil of a time finding the right flow without causing a sand storm.

I got lucky the sand hardly moved or heaped, i pointed the pumps at the surface for the most part to help prevent it.

 

[Bilk]

I got lucky the sand hardly moved or heaped, i pointed the pumps at the surface for the most part to help prevent it.

Really? You're obviously giving the corals the flow they need even doing it as you described.

I don't want to take the OPs thread adrift, but beautiful tank. First rate! You have a build thread?

 

[madweazl]

Why would you call out someone that has more experience than you do? He says he has 13yrs of keeping reef tanks. After looking at some of your history, I see you couldn't identify majanos or mantis shrimp that were hitchhiking on some rock you purchased. After 13 yrs of keeping saltwater, I'm pretty sure the OP would know how to identify those two critters, so I have to assume you are not doing this that long. Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't see it.

I feel that when someone has a strong opinion and takes another poster to task, they should post up some pics of what their success is like so we can judge their opinion against their results. You use LED, so why not post up some pics so we can see how well they're doing for you?

I've had a reef setup since '95 or '96. I started with VHO on an IceCap 660 and they worked well. Lots of people moved to power compacts but I resisted the temptation. I stuck with this setup until switching to T5s in '09. I ran those for roughly a year with great results. After about a year I switched over to Ecoxotic Panorama Pros (4 white/blue with 2 blue/magenta) on a small 26g reef (pictured) with great results. After moving again (military so I moved a lot and tried a number of different things). On the last tank (50g) I tried a Photon24 and again, had good results but only had the tank setup a few months before I decided to retire.

As for your investigative skills, I certainly did ask about mantis. Not if it was a mantis but rather, what species of mantis. I suppose that would have required you to read way too far into the original post though. Continue on with the intwebz policing though; I've posted plenty of dumb questions and will continue to do so in the future because as much as I'd like to think I know everything, I just dont.

 

[reef bloke]

Really? You're obviously giving the corals the flow they need even doing it as you described.

I don't want to take the OPs thread adrift, but beautiful tank. First rate! You have a build thread?

I have but not on RC I'm afraid, on a U.K forum.

Id link to it but RC will more than likely remove the address ,sorry.:sad1:

 

[Bilk]

I've had a reef setup since '95 or '96. I started with VHO on an IceCap 660 and they worked well. Lots of people moved to power compacts but I resisted the temptation. I stuck with this setup until switching to T5s in '09. I ran those for roughly a year with great results. After about a year I switched over to Ecoxotic Panorama Pros (4 white/blue with 2 blue/magenta) on a small 26g reef (pictured) with great results. After moving again (military so I moved a lot and tried a number of different things). On the last tank (50g) I tried a Photon24 and again, had good results but only had the tank setup a few months before I decided to retire.

As for your investigative skills, I certainly did ask about mantis. Not if it was a mantis but rather, what species of mantis. I suppose that would have required you to read way too far into the original post though. Continue on with the intwebz policing though; I've posted plenty of dumb questions and will continue to do so in the future because as much as I'd like to think I know everything, I just dont.

You posted a strong opinion so it was natural for me to see what you had to offer other than your opinion. Can't blame me for wanting to see if you knew what you were talking about, now can you?

Very nice looking tank, but you do not have light demanding corals. The closest you get is the clam. So with that in mind, how can you judge the effectiveness of LED for light demanding corals? I'm not saying they can't work. I have them over my tank. Just asking how you arrived at your judgement of the OP and the effectiveness of LED.

 

[madweazl]

I kept acro, monti (grew like a weed), a stylo, and a mystery SPS under the Photon and they did great. There is a little birdnest in that 26 but I think they'll grow like weeds under just about anything.

I dont recall judging the OP, just the statement that LEDs cant work.

Edit: found an early pic of the birdsnest. I imagine this was taken within the first three days of arrival. Couldnt tell you how much time had elapsed between the two pics but it was growing.

 

[Bilk]

I kept acro, monti (grew like a weed), a stylo, and a mystery SPS under the Photon and they did great. There is a little birdnest in that 26 but I think they'll grow like weeds under just about anything.

I dont recall judging the OP, just the statement that LEDs cant work.

These are the first and last sentences of your post I responded to.

LEDs arent causing the issues you're addressing, it's inexperience. ........
Ignorant hobbyist, place blame where it belongs.

You don't see how they were pretty direct and pretty judgmental?

It's obvious the OP became frustrated. He's not the first and won't be the last. I have quite a few LED over my tank and have switched out some as well.

My last tank was running for just shy of 10 years. A 110 tall. Not even sure they make that any more So I too have experience. Back then it was fluorescent and MH and I really didn't have to think about the lights other than how high above the tank they needed to be. I'm not so confident with LED and to make matters more difficult, light measurements don't help much either.

So the OP isn't alone in his questioning the viability or utility of LED. And to state his lack of ability was the reason for his discouragement was way off especially if you don't know the OPs experience.

We post here to share info, learn from one another and to sometimes vent. We generally don't expect to be attacked, though it's common knowledge it happens from time to time :twitch: