Let's talk about water quality in an SPS tank.

The only reasons I trech to north dallas is because the massive inventory,, but once i get looks at their prices I run back to my car..LOL..... I'll find out when the next meeting is their and go,, some of my frags are their.. I'll have some more ready soon,, PM me..
 
If anyone is interested, I just posted a LaMotte Smart2 Colorimeter for sale in the sale forum. I'm an individual not a commercial venture so I'm just posting this as an alert.

Mods, please remove if this is inappropriate.

Thank you.
 
I have a water quality issue I am trying to resolve and am looking for a little advice.

First set-up specs;
Up and running 1/5/04
225 glass tank
40 gallon refuge (30 gallons of water when operational)
Several different types of caluerpa and some cheato.
50 gallon sump (20 gallons of water when operational)
Euro-reef CS12-2 skimmer (5 gallons of water)
250 lbs live rock, (displaced 12 gallons)
1 1/2" Aragamax Oolitic in tank
4" Aragamax Oolitic in Refuge
MRC CR-6 dual chamber calcium reactor.
2- Tunze stream 6000 pumps on multi controller
Mak 4 return pump 1190 gph
3 250 watt DE Ushio 10k's (new with set-up of tank 10 months)
2 250 watt SE Ushio 10k's (Probably 12 months old, since replaced with hamilton 14k's.) all 5 on Ice Cap ballasts.

Parameters
S. G. 1.026
Alk 11.0 dKH (fluctuating pretty dramatically, more in a minute)
Ca 450 ppm
Po4 undetectable
Nitrate undetectable
Mag 1300
ph 7.9-8.2

Now the issue
I like the days between glass cleaning as an indicator, I had to clean every other day. In the last month or so, I have had a mild outbreak of Hair algae and cyano in the tank. Coloration of corals IMO is poor. Admittidly I had neglected the maintenance, other than cleaning protein skimmer and cleaning the glass. My lawn mower blenny quit eating aggressively after the move from the 75 after a month or two in the 225, and died about 2 months ago. (corpse was removed). Recently (3 weeks), I have stepped up the water changes, about 10 gallons every other day while siphoning the sludge from the sump and as much of the HA and Cyano from the tank as possible. I added 1 bag of Chemi-pure and 1 bag of phos-gaurd. Left them in for 2 weeks and removed them. I, 3 days ago began using Po4 minus at 40ml per day (below recommended dose). Does the fact that the water clouds up indicate a high level of Po4? If Po4 is undectable, when do I stop using as the instructions indicate? I also added 2 cups of SeaChem Matrix carbon. Protein skimmer is being cleaned every 3rd day, but not pulling alot of gunk out. Maybe 1/2" in the bottom of the 12" collection cup. I am thinking of getting an Ozone generator but haven't decided yet. I see lots of posts with the pros and cons. If long term it will be beneficial, then I will. I see the success that JB and others have had with one but I'm trying to keep in mind that what works for one doesn't work for all. The reasons for the Alk fluctuations is that I am still trying to dial in the calc reactor and having a VERY difficult time. It either way overdoses (raises alk by >1 full dKH per day) or not even close to keeping up (drops >2 dKH per day). currently running at 100 ml minute at a bubble rate of probably 120 per min (too fast to count.) 10 lb Co2 bottle is already down to 800 lbs (from 1000) after 1 month. Effluent ph 6.88

Any suggestions as to what else I can do to improve water quaility? Things have gotten better and hopefully will continue to improve. I know that I need to increase the flow in the tank and am working towards resolution with the addition of a closed loop.

Here is a pic as of 9/27 you can see the HA on the right side. Also hamilton 14k on the left side DE and SE.
P9270521a.jpg


Thanks for any help
CAReefer
 
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How long has it been since you started trying to get things back in shape? IMO it takes about 3-4 weeks to see the improvement.
 
Thanks for the quick reply JB. It has only been about 10 days. I have noticed that the dusting on the glass is getting better. Am I doing all that I can? It concerns me that my skimmer is pulling so little gunk out. I have it adjusted as high/wet as it will go. After 2 days there is maybe only 3/16th" of skimmate in the cup. The neck is completely clean but the portion in the collection cup is very dark. I also noticed you have an MRC Calcium reactor. Out of curiousty, what are your settings?

Thanks again.
CAReefer
 
I have a MTC calcium reactor, different than the MRC reactor. I run mine at 85ml/min, effluent pH at 6.55 using ARM media.

Yeah give it a few weeks. One thing that can happen when dramatically cleaning up your water is bleaching, so be careful of that.

Not sure on the skimmer though, sorry.
 
6.55 after the dual chamber? Wouldn't that make the first chamber about 6.2? I thought that the ARM media turned to mush at 6.5. I have had the setting as low as 6.65 and that definitely shot up the tank levels. You mention stability in alk and calc, IYO, what are stable levels? no fluctuation, .5 dKH? I think once the reactor is dialed in, it should not fluctuate more than .05 or so.

CAReefer
 
I'm in the process of trying to regulate my tank temperature right now. Chiller comes on and the tank gets too cold, heater comes on and the tank gets too hot. Actually it's the two degree swing from 81.0 to 79.? . And I don't want to waste extra electricity to have the chiller and heater battle each other all day and night. This is frustrating because I had everything perfect two years ago with the same setup and equipment.
 
i swing about 3.5 which is normal swing for ocean water, anything more than that would start to get touchy with some corals.. depends on what kinda you are keeping..
 
CAreefer said:
6.55 after the dual chamber? Wouldn't that make the first chamber about 6.2? I thought that the ARM media turned to mush at 6.5. I have had the setting as low as 6.65 and that definitely shot up the tank levels. You mention stability in alk and calc, IYO, what are stable levels? no fluctuation, .5 dKH? I think once the reactor is dialed in, it should not fluctuate more than .05 or so.

CAReefer

Sorry I missed your question earlier. :(

My first chamber is 6.35. That make the effluent 6.55. I have no problems with the media turning to mush.

My alk is at 9.6 dKH, it rarely fluctuates at all. If it does only about 1.0 - 0.5 in a month or so. It's always around 9-10 dKH.

reefdood, My swing is 1.1 degree above the target temp and 0.8 below the target temp. Meaning if I have the target temp at 79 the chiller turns on at 80.1 and the heaters turn on at 78.2.

HTH
 
Following this thread, and getting my tank ready for SPS.

When you talk about phosphates, I've heard that using Kalk and directing it to the intake of your skimmer pump can remove PO4, due to the high localized pH, and also because the skimmer will remove the preciptate particles out of the water column.

However, I don't remember anyone mentioning using Kalk as a tool for removing PO4 in this thread. Is it becuase it does not work in real life, or that you can't get PO4 low enough using this method?

All feedback welcome; thanks!

- Michael
 
Kalk will bind with PO4 and the PO4 will precipitate. Then it can be removed by the skimmer. I've never heard of adding it so it can go right into the skimmer. Typically kalk is added to the return section of the sump.
Chris
 
I think kalk might help a little. I've seen no real proof that it does reduce PO4 though. If anyone has done a study I've not found it.

Anyway, while I think kalk can be helpful in a reef tank, I don't think the primary reason should be the reduction on phosphates.
 
Kalk does precipitate the PO4. I have and still to this day drip my kalk into the air intake on my ETS and never have an issue with po4 unless my RO cartridges get really gunked.

What fishdoc is saying about it binding is correct,,, I guess randy may be a better person to ask on this.. I will start a thread their ..

Nathan
 
Thanks NuclearReefs

So it has been experimentally proven to reduce PO4(which backs up what I have had happen in one of my tanks) but the mechanism is not known. So it may or may not bind PO4:-)

Chris
 
Chris.. it looks like more work needs to be put into it. But what randy was saying about the calcification of PO4 making that Gunk that builds up on our pumps etc,,, makes alot of sense..it seems when I dose kalk the way I normally do I have top clean my pumps more.. could this be from the Limewater knocking the orthophosphates out? hmm,,, I'll start this testing after I get moved,,,,,,,,,

Nathan
 
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