Let's talk flow

[Gary Majchrzak]

when it comes to flow discussions there are two main breakdowns:
1) what is desired
2) how to accomplish what's desired

Aquarium size and biotope (environment being re-created) affect both. There are several devices I wouldn't use to create flow in any aquarium simply because (after researching/experimenting with them) they're

*more prone to failure over time than others
or
*produce undesirable/unsatisfactory results


Gimme a bunch of MaxiJets on a wavemaker (or controller) and I can set up a good alternating gyre in almost any home size aquarium. MJ's are inexpensive, reliable and practically indestructible. Penductors on returns of a 72" long (or larger) high flow aquarium can provide unbelievable massive current. I like Tunze Streams.

These are the three flow making devices I'm using in my aquarium right now.

 

[MarkKlier]

In my 220, one wave box and a sea swirl on my 1 return. So far I'm very pleased. I have some colonies that are getting large with no recession on the bottom.
In my 180 LPS I have virtually no flow!!!! Just the one return. Planning on setting up a wave box...but then I look at it and wonder why...
MK

 

[KurtsReef]

The thing I like about both the Vortech and closed loop is the small footprint inside the tank. Many of the other options look like large hair dryers inside your reef, if your able to hide them I guess it does not matter.

 

[puter]

Thanks everyone! Lots of great information here.

How about the second part of the question? Besides varying the direction of flow, do you think it is important to vary the strength as well? Seems like the VorTechs have that covered... most of the others, not so much.

Mark

 

[tmz]

The seio controller varies the strength and direction providing 100% and 50% alternately on preset timed cycles.

 

[magdelan]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14142454#post14142454 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by KurtsReef
The thing I like about both the Vortech and closed loop is the small footprint inside the tank. Many of the other options look like large hair dryers inside your reef, if your able to hide them I guess it does not matter.

:lol: I almost choked on a cracker :lol:

 

[RandyO]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14141309#post14141309 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Gary Majchrzak
when it comes to flow discussions there are two main breakdowns:
1) what is desired
2) how to accomplish what's desired

Aquarium size and biotope (environment being re-created) affect both. There are several devices I wouldn't use to create flow in any aquarium simply because (after researching/experimenting with them) they're

*more prone to failure over time than others
or
*produce undesirable/unsatisfactory results

I think Presentation should be on this list Gary. As Kurt said with the hairdryer response. You can accomplish the desired water flow with lots of pumps. Which brings up another point on electrical consumption. A closed loop with a Barracuda can create a lot of flow, but with a high energy cost. MaxiJet 1200's produce 20 watts and 295gph. Six of these pumps produce 120 watts and 1800gph. With a decent wave maker you are probably looking to spend 250.00 for a six pump setup. A Vortech produces 3200 gph at 28 watts, and this energy is not transmitted as heat into the water. It can slowly increase and decrease it's velocity making giving you amazing wave making control.

As you said, there's more than one way to create waves in a tank. And Vortechs are not for everyone. But they are exceptionally great on peninsula tanks and tanks built into walls where you will not see the pumps sitting on the outside of the tank.

 

[Gary Majchrzak]

duly noted. Vortech is on my bucket list

 

[RandyO]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14151228#post14151228 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Gary Majchrzak
duly noted. Vortech is on my bucket list

 

[puter]

So, here's why I'm asking:

For years I've used these "very expensive" surge devices on some tanks:

I'm typically feeding them with a Mag 5 pump which runs at 45 Watts so it's a pretty cheap way, both in terms of acquistion and operational costs, to get a fair amount of flow. With some simple modifications (bucket size, pipe heights, two buckets, etc.) you can vary the flow provided tremendously.

Surge buckets provide no flow for a period of time, it then starts out slow, increases to pretty fast, tapers off and then repeats the process again. So, I just got to wondering if that's "good" flow and if there is any reason to investigate some of the "newer" alternatives?

Mark

 

[TellyFish]

I have tunze 6100s and I still want a huge surge tank. I love the feeling like its a real wave crashing and throwing bubbles around.

Im not if that's the best way to provide realistic flow, but it seems pretty good to me.

 

[MarkKlier]

Very nice Mark. Have you seen Kent E's set up. Using the same surge method, just a larger set up.
MK

 

[thriceanangel]

I was wondering when someone was going to mention surges as being a cheap, reliable, non intrusive method to produce random chaotic flow. The only downside is some noise, and bubbles. Looks like a good design you're using that should reduce bubbles and I've created a similar design using an 18 gallon surge. What are the dimensions of your plumbing, and do you have a diagram? I am assuming you're using a carlson type device?

 

[Gary Majchrzak]

I've seen several (reverse) Carlson surge type devices in operation.

good flow but quite unlike many other types of water flow. Good thing reef critters are remarkably adaptable!

 

[puter]

thrice, I change the dimensions around on each unit based on the flow I'm trying to achieve. In this case, the siphon pipe is 1 1/2" and the bubble reducer is 3". The bubble reducer cuts out 95%+ of the bubbles. If you want to completely eliminate them, you can hook up multiple reducers in series.

Gary, that has to be a Calson surge as opposed to reverse Carlson isn't it? I thought the whole point of using a reverse Carlson (pump air into a sealed chamber to start the surge) is that it eliminates the bubbles?

I think the surge devices work pretty well... but it sure would be fun to play with a couple Vortecs.

Mark

 

[Gary Majchrzak]

I'll have to search back to see exactly what the heck that surge device was. Bubbles or not- isn't the end result very similar with surge devices?
(I don't really know much about them!)
FWIW I believe a lot of my corals grow horizontally because of the way water flows in my aquarium.

 

[puter]

...Bubbles or not- isn't the end result very similar with surge devices?

You know, I really don't know. I suspect I've continuously run surge devices longer than just about anyone in the club except Guy, but I mess with things enough that I really don't have a good way to do long term comparisons. That's really what inspired the question.

One thing I am confident of is that S. haddoni anemones are typically not big fans of surging flow. With this new surge bucket, I figured I'd try running the output through a manifold and see how that works out.

The other obvious answer would be to bag the surge bucket and employ some other flow making device... which leads to where this whole thread started.

Mark

 

[gary greguire]

I am a big fan of the tunze wave box & the tunze power heads with a multiple controler.

 

[Gary Majchrzak]

it would seem obvious that surging flow can (somewhat) be controlled by manifolds. No doubt haddoni don't care for a lot of water flow (mine moved to one of the quietest spots in my aquarium).

 

[thriceanangel]

How much (if at all) does the reducer tame the flow? In my head it would reduce it some, but OFTEN whats in my head and reality aren't the same (THANKS ALOT 1990's!).