Looking for help with SPS - what have I done wrong?

[Voodoo Corals]

idk if youre trolling or not...

Lol what I was referring to was the words that are tossed around on boards instead of identifying what they are referring to. In this case is was "mature tank"instead of identifying to the target audience what is being implied.

An implied task of that was having the core values on an established tank. Chemistry/balance/feeding but all that was referred to was mature tank. Not helpful or informative at all. Only assumptions can be made.

 

[FishN00b83]

Lol what I was referring to was the words that are tossed around on boards instead of identifying what they are referring to. In this case is was "mature tank"instead of identifying to the target audience what is being implied.



An implied task of that was having the core values on an established tank. Chemistry/balance/feeding but all that was referred to was mature tank. Not helpful or informative at all. Only assumptions can be made.

so me stating what I keep my tank at, suggesting to take the GFO offline, and just keep up with water changes didn't offer anything?

 

[SCreeferGuy]

I think dosing is your problem then, so lets review the maintenance.

How often do you do a water change and what salt mix (or KH or mix).

I almost never measure Calcium, it's just not that important as long as you are doing balanced dosing and making sure your magnesium stays in range. edit: I do test calcium occasionally to make sure it's staying between 400 and 500.

I test Alk and then dose both Alk and Calcium parts of a 2-part based on the Alk consumption. If no Alk is being consumed I would not dose. If calcium starts to fall Alk will fall as well as the system is going to naturally maintain some balance.

Doing this my calcium ha ssettled out to about 450 and Alk stays at 8 dosing 75ml of each part 2-part a day. I use TLF 2-part but any balanced 2-part will do.

I also suspect your Alk test kit, I would get another one to verify. I tried Red Sea Pro and didn't like it so I switched to Salifert but still use the Red Sea bottle holders and bottles.

1. I do a 10 % water change weekly - 15 gal of Red Sea Pro salt. As of 2 weeks ago, is now 2 gal daily with Apex DOS.

2. I saw Ca fall to 300 before I started dosing (just a couple frags then and wasn't doing regular water changes yet - tank still new). Now stays steady. Likewise Mg is staying put - used to have to add that too..

3. Was dosing Ca and Alk equally before the "fail". Now only having to dose Ca as Alk holding steady.

4. I can get a Salifert Alk test kit - have only used Red Sea so far...

Thanks again!

 

[markalot]

1. I do a 10 % water change weekly - 15 gal of Red Sea Pro salt. As of 2 weeks ago, is now 2 gal daily with Apex DOS.

2. I saw Ca fall to 300 before I started dosing (just a couple frags then and wasn't doing regular water changes yet - tank still new). Now stays steady. Likewise Mg is staying put - used to have to add that too..

3. Was dosing Ca and Alk equally before the "fail". Now only having to dose Ca as Alk holding steady.

4. I can get a Salifert Alk test kit - have only used Red Sea so far...

Thanks again!

No problem, leave it to me to throw all kinds of ideas out there.

I would not use Red Sea Coral Pro in an SPS tank, Alk is just way way way to high and you could be experiencing mini spikes. I would go with a salt that is no higher than 10KH or lower, but again just my opinion. I really like Red Sea Blue Bucket because it's at 8KH.

 

[markalot]

so me stating what I keep my tank at, suggesting to take the GFO offline, and just keep up with water changes didn't offer anything?

I thought it did, I would ignore him.

 

[outssider]

the fact that you're not needing to dose much anymore is telling me that we are missing something. I've had to dose from practically day one, and it's continually gotten to be more until about the last year.

If I were you I would be checking things nobody has mentioned yet. It could be something obvious , right under your nose and you just can't see it. maybe some metal rusting/oxidizing somewhere ? are you sure your sg is correct ? quality of your ro/di water? Bad batch of salt mix ?

I think you were correct when you say " I can't help feeling something is off "

I don't think leaving for 2 weeks with your son in charge is going to help this situation either.

 

[mhucasey]

Have you only used Red Sea pro from the beginning? Have you ever tested your Potassium levels?

 

[JPMagyar]

SCReeferGuy,

Who do you want to listen to?

No problem, leave it to me to throw all kinds of ideas out there.

I would not use Red Sea Coral Pro in an SPS tank, Alk is just way way way to high and you could be experiencing mini spikes. I would go with a salt that is no higher than 10KH or lower, but again just my opinion. I really like Red Sea Blue Bucket because it's at 8KH.

So how about some pictures of your tank Markalot. . .

Here's mine at it's best . . .

 

[markalot]

Joe,

he wanted help and I'm throwing out ideas. I don't appreciate the attitude, not sure why you think I deserved that. I did miss your post right above mine, sorry if you thought I was ignoring it.

 

[markalot]

So it sounds like you cycle your feeding schedule/PO4 levels up and down...is this what you're saying? Or are you saying you try to feed heavy while maintain low nitrates and PO4?

Try to feed heavy while maintaining low PO4 and reasonably low Nitrates (maybe 5 to 10?). I've finally tested Nitrates below 15 but it's been after a lot of small water changes. I am seeing my SSC finally start to show some bright green on the base so IMO it was being held back by the high nitrates.

The fact is, for me, I never had good color until I fed heavily. The coral in that progression is the first acro I was able to color up that well (I don't count the big slimer). I'm now up to 3 acros with good color, 10 or so still brown.

I guess the point I was trying to make is my acros might not be colorful but they appear healthy (puffy skin, good polyp extension, decent growth). When my tank was starved I had pale skins, very little polyp extension, and a lot of dieoff.

My limited experience does not mean other ways won't work, it's just what has worked for me so far.

Ramble ramble ramble.

 

[SCreeferGuy]

Have you only used Red Sea pro from the beginning? Have you ever tested your Potassium levels?

Have not tested Potassium - do not have a kit for that (yet).

I started using the regular Red Sea and started switching over to a combo of both, and then just the Pro version.

 

[SCreeferGuy]

the fact that you're not needing to dose much anymore is telling me that we are missing something. I've had to dose from practically day one, and it's continually gotten to be more until about the last year.

If I were you I would be checking things nobody has mentioned yet. It could be something obvious , right under your nose and you just can't see it. maybe some metal rusting/oxidizing somewhere ? are you sure your sg is correct ? quality of your ro/di water? Bad batch of salt mix ?

I think you were correct when you say " I can't help feeling something is off "

I don't think leaving for 2 weeks with your son in charge is going to help this situation either.

I agree that I would not expect the tank to maintain Alk levels on its own - especially when Alk needed dosing before.

The only metal that could be in the system would be from one of the pumps..? Is that common? And where would I begin to look for that?

SG is per Milwakee meter and by refractometer - both always agree.

RODI water TDS is always zero - having to replace DI membranes fairly often due to my well water (?).

What would I look for to determine if salt mix is bad? Just try a new batch?

THANKS for the suggestions - it's what I need to help figure this out.

And my son is 18 yrs old - pretty responsible and has watched the tank for a week before with no problems :thumbsup: He's my best option. I expect things to maintain, but fingers crossed!

 

[SCreeferGuy]

I guess the point I was trying to make is my acros might not be colorful but they appear healthy (puffy skin, good polyp extension, decent growth). When my tank was starved I had pale skins, very little polyp extension, and a lot of dieoff.

My limited experience does not mean other ways won't work, it's just what has worked for me so far.

Ramble ramble ramble.

Thanks for the help - I started feeding some Oyster Feast last night. We'll see if that helps.

AND I may have figured out why I have so little algae on the rocks... I have developed a robust population of stomatella snails! I was looking last night and small ones are everywhere. I knew I had a larger one or two in the past, but they must have reproduced... "Reef safe" from what I can read.

 

[spoofer]

Have you tested output on lights? Just trying to see what else is missing.

 

[SCreeferGuy]

Have you tested output on lights? Just trying to see what else is missing.

Don't have a par meter...but if anything have turned lights up from what I was using when things were happy. Now at Blue 55 % and White 30 %. Run them for 12 hrs a day.

I may have forgot to mention that I do have 1 stylophora that has recovered from the "hit" and looks as good as ever - with great PE. It just all the other survivors (mostly LPS, another stylophora, green spongodes, and leptoseris) that don't have PE and the new birds nest I added to see how system was recovering.

I do have a small aquacultured blue clam that has been in the tank for about 2 months. Is halfway up the rock in the center of the tank and looks good. Believe I seem some growth from it...but I know they can be starving and it can be hard to tell until they die.

 

[markalot]

Have you tried renting a PAR meter from a local store or club?

It's possible lights are too bright, especially if LED. LED can be tough because they put down a lot more light than our eyes see. One of the reasons I switched back to T5 is because at the "correct" PAR my tank looked dark. T5's and MH have a nice narrow peak in the green spectrum that makes the light look a lot brighter to our eyes.

I mention this because you say it's running brighter than before. Maybe dial it back to what it used to be? Can you provide any clear pictures of the sickly corals? This might help diagnose the issue as well.

Just more ideas, nothing definitive.

One more idea. Your custom sump, did you make it yourself? What kind of silicone did you use?

 

[SCreeferGuy]

Have you tried renting a PAR meter from a local store or club?

It's possible lights are too bright, especially if LED. LED can be tough because they put down a lot more light than our eyes see. One of the reasons I switched back to T5 is because at the "correct" PAR my tank looked dark. T5's and MH have a nice narrow peak in the green spectrum that makes the light look a lot brighter to our eyes.

I mention this because you say it's running brighter than before. Maybe dial it back to what it used to be? Can you provide any clear pictures of the sickly corals? This might help diagnose the issue as well.

Just more ideas, nothing definitive.

One more idea. Your custom sump, did you make it yourself? What kind of silicone did you use?

Can check to see if par meter available - lights were max 50 % blue 30 % white before so the increase was not that much...

Can put up a pic of the new birds nest tonight.

Sump was purchased online - found the guy on ebay.. Still there, seemed to have experience making these. Not sure what kind of silicone. Could probably check w him and find out if nothing else pans out.

 

[mhucasey]

The only reason I asked about Potassium in regards to red sea coral pro is that I started my tank with that stuff and it was very low in potassium, I saw some of the same issues you do, until I corrected it. Once its in range it stays pretty stable, but it is often a forgotten element. The Salifert test for it is easy to use and is one of their cheapest tests.

 

[SCreeferGuy]

The only reason I asked about Potassium in regards to red sea coral pro is that I started my tank with that stuff and it was very low in potassium, I saw some of the same issues you do, until I corrected it. Once its in range it stays pretty stable, but it is often a forgotten element. The Salifert test for it is easy to use and is one of their cheapest tests.

Sounds like a good idea - thanks!

And your tank looks AMAZING...checked out your build thread. :beer:

 

[jimrawr]

SCReeferGuy,

Who do you want to listen to?




So how about some pictures of your tank Markalot. . .

Here's mine at it's best . . .

DROOL! I think everyone in the forum should be required to post their best tanks shots so we can filter on whos advice to listen to and whos to ignore. Mine, unfortunately would be on the "whos to ignore" for the most part