looking for list of copper sensitive fish

[csarkar001]

is there a list on this forum of all the fish that should not be treated with copper/cupramine?

i know that all invertebrates, sharks, and rays would be on this list. but i have also read that lionfish, wrasses and several other species are highly copper sensitive.

is there a comprehensive list somewhere?

i'm still debating using 1/2 strength copper as a prophlactic in my QT and this list would come in handy.

 

[sea of cortez]

I am also interested in this list
And for the fish on this list what would you treat them with besides hypo
I am not home enough to watch for PH swings with hypo
Looking at F/S site RID ICH looks interesting for a QT Contains formaldehyde and a zinc-free chloride salt of malachite green (has anyone had any experience with this)
I myself just had good luck with ICH ATTACK but am not 100% sure my reef tank is ICH free and want to let it sit fallow

 

[csarkar001]

formaldehyde?

formaldehyde?

just say no.

 

[JHemdal]

In my Advanced Marine Aquarium techniques book, I list: sharks, rays seahorses, mandarin dragonets and jawfish as being very sensitive to copper. I also discuss the issue with Centropyge angels, where ramping the copper level up too quickly can prove fatal, when they can tolerate the same dose brought up more slowly (unless they have an active disease - then brining it up slowly would allow the disease to kill them).

To add to that - eels will often go off feed when exposed to copper. Flashlight fish always lose their lights if treated with copper.

Dosing at half strength has absolutely no clinical studies to back up its efficacy - so don't use copper at low doses if the fish cannot tolerate the normal dose....

Jay

 

[sea of cortez]

So what would you treat (lets say) VELVET or ICH with if copper is not a option

 

[JHemdal]

Chloroquine at 10 to 15ppm - but this has not been available to home aquarists recently (It used to be sold under the brand name Marex).

I've tried malachite green / formalin on Cryptocaryon before, but didn't have much sucess.

I'm not a big of Hyposalinity due to Uronema problems.

Coppersafe, used a preventative, has very low toxicity to fish, but it is not fast-acting enough to use in a full-blown outbreak (IMO).

Jay

 

[sea of cortez]

Will the malachite green / formalin work on the uronema???
And if you think you have had uronema in your reef (I had a potters that I think died of this)
will it also die off by letting you tank go fallow???

 

[sea of cortez]

We are still looking for list of fish
anybody

 

[csarkar001]

i'm beginning to think such a basic thing may not exist.

 

[LargeAngels]

In my Advanced Marine Aquarium techniques book, I list: sharks, rays seahorses, mandarin dragonets and jawfish as being very sensitive to copper. I also discuss the issue with Centropyge angels, where ramping the copper level up too quickly can prove fatal, when they can tolerate the same dose brought up more slowly (unless they have an active disease - then brining it up slowly would allow the disease to kill them).

To add to that - eels will often go off feed when exposed to copper. Flashlight fish always lose their lights if treated with copper.

Dosing at half strength has absolutely no clinical studies to back up its efficacy - so don't use copper at low doses if the fish cannot tolerate the normal dose....

Jay

Jay, are you referring to coppers like Coppersafe? I've found that Cupramine is very well tolerated by dwarfs, wrasses and eels with not issues. I should clarify that I only have experience with dwarf golden eels and they handled it extremely well and were eating.

 

[JHemdal]

LargeAngels,

No, I wrote that based on the presumption that the person was putting the fish directly into 0.20 ppm ionic copper / citric acid stock solution.

Using amine-based coppers, or ramping it up slowly is much less of an issue, except flashlight fish will still lose their lights and sharks and eels may go off their feed for a bit.

Actually, I figured out a way to monitor levels of coppersafe using a commercial API test kit and my spectrophotometer, so now that I can accurately monitor coppersafe levels in our tanks, (instead of guessing) we've gone to just using that all of the time in our quarantine tanks, I haven't had to use ionic copper for some time now...but we also have chloroquine handy if the coppersafe can't handle something....

Jay

 

[sea of cortez]

So no one knows which fish cannot handle copper treatments

 

[JHemdal]

I gave you a list of commonly recognized sensitive species in my previous message on 9/5, not quite sure what else you are looking for. The problem is that copper takes a bit of finesse to use; if you use it improperly, you'll find that the list of sensitive fish is going to be a whole lot longer (grin).

Jay