Lowering Nitrates.

[Neoz]

I seem to have my Nitrates on the rise. I'm testing using a Hagen Test kit. Its one that was given to me. The expiration dates are good. I'm just using it up and then switching to Salifert. I did order a Salifert test kit but won't be here till next week. The actual test in the kit is by Nutrafin. The test reads Nitrate (0.0-110.0 mg/L) Test. My Nitrate test results read 5, Not sure if that means .5 or 5.0 the test isn't very good. My options on the color chart are 5 , 10 , 20 , 50 , and 110.


I do feed more on the heavy side but the fish are plump and happy. I use New Spectrum Thera +A Pellets, Cylopeeze and PC Mysis. Pellets get feed 2X a day and the frozen gets once a day. The Mysis gets thawed and rinsed very well prior to going into the tank.

I try and do a 30 gallon weekly water change using Reef Crystals once a week. Not always a week sometimes 10 days or so.

My Stocking List

2-True Percs
Blond Naso Tang about 4" still small
Powder Blue Tang 5"
CBB 5"
Lawnmower Blenny
Watchman Goby
6 Line Wrasse
Yellow Wrasse
3-Lyretail Anthias
4-Green Chromis
Cleaner Shrimp
Peppermint Shrimp

I run a NW200 Octo Skimmer. Not modded in any way.

To combat my Nitrates what are some options for me?
Reading up on a few things one suggestion obviously was less feedings.
But what are some others. Would buying a bigger skimmer help?

Also read the benefits of having more live rock in the tank. I do plan on adding about 100lbs more of Marco Rock. Just trying to figure out my plan of action without having the tank re-cycle.

Also haven't read up a whole lot about this Vodka dosing. Is that something I maybe should look into more?

I'm just trying to really stabilize my system. Trying to get rid of some of the swings I see in the tank. If I can learn that and make my system more stable I believe I can really get the tank to take off. I'm willing to put the time, effort and money in to learn this hobby and take my tank to the next level.

Like an example how can I grow Palys, Zoas and Duncans in my system like crazy but I'll be damned if I can grow Monti Cap! Green, Orange makes no difference they all die.. :spin2:

 

[Gary Majchrzak]

as you already are aware

as you already are aware

feeding less and a larger skimmer can help lower nitrates. So can larger (or more frequent) water changes. So can more liverock. Get rid of any wet/dry biomedia (bioballs) if you have any.

I'm not a Vodka doser.

Other "more natural" options include: remote deep sandbed, lit refugium growing macroalgae, grow Xenia, big azz Tridacna clam, etc.

 

[Neoz]

My sump dosen't have a place for a refugium or sand bed. I wish it did. I love clams. Think I'll look into one of those Tridacna clams. Never heard of one.. Off to research...

 

[Jedistphn]

I do feed more on the heavy side but the fish are plump and happy. I use New Spectrum Thera +A Pellets, Cylopeeze and PC Mysis. Pellets get feed 2X a day and the frozen gets once a day. The Mysis gets thawed and rinsed very well prior to going into the tank.

That's some heavy feeding...

As Gary Stated, lowering the feeding and increasing the skim will help lower the Nitrates.
Increase the water changes a bit and make sure to siphon from the SB. I do not dose either. Rather keep it natural.
Clams are a great nitrate removal factory, love them and am planning on getting a bunch for a small clam garden in my display.

Good Luck,
-Jedi

 

[Neoz]

Jedi thanks for the tip about siphon from the SB. I have never done that because its never dirty. I have sugar grain sand that consent moves and stays clean. But I will start with my next water change.


Seems some of the giga clams are hard to find. Gary I have a Maxima clam that I purchased at Macna. But it isn't that big maybe 4inches. Anyone know a good online vendor to purchase some bigger clams. I tried Clams direct but no luck there.

 

[piscivorous]

They have a spotted gigas up at ABC Reefs...along with croceas and deresas...

 

[sedorusc]

I did see some bigger clams at ABC reef. think they were around $120-125

 

[Neoz]

Damn and I was going to go up there today too. Its about an hour one way for me. Might make the trip tomorrow. Thanks for the heads up.. Think I'll give Tim a call now.

 

[Gary Majchrzak]

fwiw derasa or squamosa would be better choices for a 180

 

[Neoz]

Gary what is wrong with a giga? Will it get too big for my system? I'm wondering what kind of effect having a bigger clam will make on my Calc usage? I would probably have to start dosing for that.

 

[Cptn Spaulding]

if you do that frequent water changes i wouldnt worry too much about your calcium unless you have crazy amounts of sps or something as well. try only feeding pellets once a day and see what happens.

as for the vodka dosing, ive seen a tank with nitrates 60+ppm, and within a few months nitrates are undetectable with no adverse effects on the tank (even less algae growth than before even!). but i definitely understand the whole doing it naturally mindset. if you cant seem to get them down and you dont wanna spend a few hundred on a new bigger skimmer i would just try the whole vodka dosing thing, but thats just me.

 

[Gary Majchrzak]

Gary what is wrong with a giga? Will it get too big for my system? I'm wondering what kind of effect having a bigger clam will make on my Calc usage? I would probably have to start dosing for that.

a gigas will quickly grow much too large for a 180 AND it will suck up calcium and alkalinity faster than you can imagine. There would be no "probably" about the need for dosing calcium and alkalinity!

 

[Neoz]

Cptn I do intend to scale back some feedings until I can at least get a new skimmer. I have inquired about some and all three of them I was told would be way too much skimmer for my 180. Go figure. So my search still continues there.


Gary thanks for tip on the Gigas. Kind of figured that after I got reading up more on them. But they are nice looking aren't they.

 

[RandyO]

Instead of doing a 30 gallon water change a week, doing a 120 gallon water change once a month would have a bigger impact on reducing nitrates.

If you attended the zoo event in Rochester a few years ago, Anthony Calfo did a talk on this subject. He said he would drain his entire tank/vats and then replace all the water.

Since then I've taken the stand of larger water changes rather than frequent changes.

 

[Cptn Spaulding]

interesting randy. i never would have assumed that. i always thought that..for example, you do a 50% water change, nitrate would reduce 50%. am i missing something with this hypothesis? how would corals and livestock fare with a somewhat frequent giant water changes? i would assume that would send the system into a small shock for a bit, but i dunno.....

 

[Neoz]

Randy that is an interesting theory. Only problem is I would need lots of more water tubs. Not sure I have the room for that. Have to look into that. I do know I should be doing bigger water changes for my system.

 

[johno4]

So can more liverock.

QUOTE]

Is there any actual study that shows this? I have run some tests on this myself and have found livreock does virtually nothing to lower nitrates.

Large water changes seem to be the best/quickest way to lower nitrates in a system.

 

[dreaminmel]

interesting randy. i never would have assumed that. i always thought that..for example, you do a 50% water change, nitrate would reduce 50%. am i missing something with this hypothesis? how would corals and livestock fare with a somewhat frequent giant water changes? i would assume that would send the system into a small shock for a bit, but i dunno.....

The reasoning behind it is that if you change out smaller amounts over time, during the following water changes you're actually removing some of the "clean" water from the last water change so five 10g water changes over time will not equate to the same reduction in nitrates as one 50g water change. The difference will not be huge though... I personally am now on a schedule of changing 1/3rd every two weeks. Water volume is 150g and I'm changing out 50g twice a month. As long as temp and parameters match it does not shock the system at all.

 

[block head]

lots of good ideas. i'd make sure you have good numbers ,before i got to worried. tom's 180 is a great example of big water change/modest equiptment route. i'd take it easy with the sand bed. i like to remove small sections and replace the sand a few times a year.

 

[tmz]

A few thoughts and opinions:
Nitrate( NO3) under 10ppm isn't a worry.
Remote deep sand beds are very limited in denitrification.
Extra skimming will help.
Running granulated activated carbon will help.
Less food and pre thawed /pre rinsed will help.
Regular cleaning including blowing out the rock to remove built up detritus are necessary.
Macro refugia are very good.
Clams do use nitrate but not enough to make much difference unless you have a lot of them or a really big one.
Small frequent water changes provide less chance of shocking the system( changes in sg, alk ,calcium ,metals ,etc) with very little loss in efficiency vs large ones.
Carbon dosing (vodka,vinegar, ascorbic acid, glucose, etc) works over time for NO3 and PO4 reduction but has significant downside if not carefully managed and understood.
Sulfur dentirators work very well .
Nitrate reducing pellets seem to work well from recent \accounts but they are very pricey.