Madarin with poison ivy? (no pic)

[thatguy]

I can't take a picture that is good enough to show what I mean but the title says it all.

I have a Mandarin that has been in my tank for 2 months. She is doing well and has even gotten a little fatter since I got her.

Two days ago I noticed that she has bumps on her head that look exactly like a mild case of poison ivy.

She acts like there is no issue and swims and eats like normal.

Ammonia - 0
Ni - 0
Na - 7
Ph - 8.2
Salinity 1.025


I haven't added anything to the tank in a few weeks. All other fish are fine, even my other scale-less fish Green Spotted Puffer.

 

[White Tiger]

What color are the bumps?

 

[thatguy]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8534062#post8534062 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by White Tiger
What color are the bumps?

The bumps are the same color as the skin, just a little lighter. She still doesn't seem to mind.

 

[White Tiger]

It sounds like a case of hole in the head disease. Hole in the head disease can be caused by a stray electric current in the water and or vitamin dificiency in the fish's diet.

 

[thatguy]

Would stray current affect all the fish or only some?

I need no get a volt meter, or a ground probe.

 

[White Tiger]

Stray current can sometimes affect just some fish in the tank. Other times, it can affect all fish. You should get a voltmeter to test for stray electricity and get a grounding wire. Have you considered vitamin diffiency as a cause?

 

[thatguy]

I wouldn't think it would be vitamin deficiency because she only eats pods. I know I have tons of those and I dose the tank with phyto to make sure I keep having them.

To increase flow for some SPS I added another power head, right before I noticed the problem. Grounding wire will be purchased tomorrow afternoon. That should take care of any stray voltage, but what do I do for the disease?

 

[White Tiger]

You should make the water conditions as clean/good as possible. Keep her on a healthy diet. Continue to monitor the fish and continue posting here to keep me updated. If all goes well, she should be able to defeat the disease by herself.

How many fish do you have in your tank and what types of fish do you have?

How large is your tank?

 

[thatguy]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8541362#post8541362 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by White Tiger

How many fish do you have in your tank and what types of fish do you have?

How large is your tank?

I have 7 fish: Pair of Maroon Clowns, Yellow Tang, Green Spotted Puffer, Scooter Blenny, Yellow Watchmen, and the Mandarin.

The tank is 55g


I added the grounding probe a few days ago. Last night I checked the Mandarin and she was looking much better. The bumps are almost gone. I can't say that the probe was the answer but I'm positive I will always use one from now on.

 

[mwp]

I have to say I saw very similar symptoms on one of my mandarins and I KNOW it was caused by Ich, the transluscent blister...sounds exactly like how this mandarin looked.

FWIW,

Matt

 

[White Tiger]

mwp, the ich more then likely caused the white/translucent blisters, but the ich and blisters are not the same disease...

Hole in the head disease is kind of like cold sore blisters that we get. Hole in the head disease is triggered by stressful situations. For example, getting ich will is definitly a stressful experience for a fish, thus triggering hole in the head disease. Stray electricity and overcrowding are also problems that trigger cause hole in the head disease.

 

[mwp]

Quite simply, the blisters are a symptom of the ICH...unique to Mandarins, which only rarely get Ich to begin with due to their thick slimy coating.

Hole In The Head, if you've ever really seen it, is anything but a blister...it is a HOLE in the head, just like the name says - here's some pics of FW and SW HIH/LLE to give you an idea what that looks like - http://www.worldcichlids.com/diseases/Adamhith.html. In marine fish, though to be caused by Stray Voltage, Vitamin C Deficiencies, excessively high nitrates and infections as well. Holes, not "blisters".

Thatguy, watch your mandarin and other fish for ICH, this is speaking from experience (2 breeding pairs of mandarins and a breeding pair of RSBs). The moment I read your initial description I knew EXACTLY what was going on.

FWIW,

Matt

 

[White Tiger]

Doesn't hole in the head disease start as a translucent/white blister and then gradually becomes a hole if left untreated?

 

[White Tiger]

Also, what does FWIW stand for?

 

[mwp]

I've seen plenty of HITH / LLE in my day, never saw it start as a "blister". It's mostly associated with fish that have high herbivorous dietary needs, i.e. Tangs...seems to just start as a little tiny pit and work it's way from there, or as a spot that gradually fades and then erodes. Vitamin Supplementation along with improved diet and water quality can reverse HITH in such fish, but it takes time.

The reason I'm so certain that Thatguy's mandarin had ICH? Well, for starters my UV wasn't running (unbeknownst to me) and I added in a new male mandarin to pair up with a female. 24 hours later, he was relatively "covered" in these little protruding transluscent greenish blisters. I've never seen anything like it on any other fish; it's very distinct. Within the next 24 hours the female showed some signs of this as well, but the kicker was the fins, a couple ich cysts here and there. Without a doubt, ICH. Afterall, it's probably the most common disease that any marine aquarist is going to encounter to begin with, and although rare in Mandarins, they obviously do get it.

Regarding Grounding Probes, they're definitely a good idea, I run one on every broodstock aquarium, but I honestly don't think that the probe addition had anything to do with the recovery. Based on the very unique symptoms Thatguy presented, if the tank doesn't have a UV, now might be a good time to get one.

Like I said before, I'd watch for ICH - it can be "cyclical", as it is with one of my Wild Caught Neon Gobies..seems like he has it every 10 days or so for a couple days and then it goes away, only to come back in another 10 days (different tank - thought we had the problem licked, but with the introduction of this mandarin that obviously had overlooked ICH, it's slowly spread into all the broodstock tanks which happen to be reefs...funny that the only tank I was running UV on was to help prevent clam perkinsis in Tridacnas, and of course it breaks down the one time a sick fish slips in and viola, ICH EVERYWHERE despite good sterile practices on utensils that have to share tanks).

FWIW = For What It's Worth

Ah, GD ICH.

Matt