Need help for my weird situation

[Iam]

Hi Everyone.. I have tried everything but this forum.. I am hoping someone can help me..

Here is my situation briefly..
I'd say I am advanced about freshwater and about 6 months ago I started my satlwater tanks.. I have 3 tanks.. 10g - 30g - 60g

Now here is the situation..
My 30g has 6 seahorses and one dottyback.. And they are doing great. I don't use skimmer.. I just have biofilters..that's it. It's been 4 months now.. And no loss..

But my 60g..... No matter what I do, every fish dies in two to three weeks.. (except one Damsel)
first, I didn't know and I over stacked and didn't check the nitrate and nitrite levels... After loosing about 10 fishes over night.. I realized that the levels were fatal.. I transfered my fish to 10g and started again... changed 80% of the water and this time I waited about 7 weeks.. (with atleast 75lb live rock in the tank) when my levels seemed perfect. I started buying simple and easy care fish... Clowns etc...
this time I got the white spot.. Again I lost 4-5 fishes.. right now I don;t have a white spot problem ????? but still eveymorning I wake up and one fish is gone.. even the ones that seem like no whitespot just die..
The levels are close to perfect...
Ph 8.2
Amonia 0
Nitra 10
nitri 10

I recently added rio800 power h.
and this morning again I lost a clownfish..

Okay I can accept that I am an idiot.. but one of my tanks are doing great and the other one is a killing machine,... And they are almost the same..

Can anyone please help me..

Thank you so much..

 

[scrmbld33]

are you finding thedead fish or are they dissapearing? do the bodys look wounded? is it possible you have a bad hitchiker like a crab or mantis that may be doing the killing, also are the new tank mates quarenteened as not to spread deseases?

 

[lfjewett]

First of all welcome to ReefCentral. It would be nice to get a bit more detail about your setup. Here are some good things to help us help you. ( Lights, Skimmer, Filters, Pumps or Powerheads, current bioload, Water source, and husbandry practice. )

So lets start with the obvious, if your still reading Nitrites in your water something is not quite right. Generally your looking for Ammonia and Nitrite to always be ZERO.

How quickly did you stock this tank and whats in it? Generally you should only be adding one or two fish at a time. Allow the bacteria in the tank to adjust to the new load, usually a couple of weeks. Are you putting your animals through QT, Freshwater dips, etc?

It sounds like you put a bunch of fish into the tank a the same time and did not allow the biological filter time to adapt. Also if your following good husbandry you should be putting every animal that will go into your tank into QT for 4 weeks. The white spots could very well be "ich". This parasite once in your tank will stay for a very long time. Take some time and research this in the Desies forum.

One last question, are the dead fish found floating, eaten, or just missing?

 

[Randall_James]

[welcome]
and I would concur with lfjewett

 

[Iam]

thank you for quick reply..
Let me try to answer your questions as much as possible..
60g
two biofilters
one rio 800 powerhead
75lb liverock

---
Two clowns
one damsel
one yellowtang
one anemoni
one sponge
several crabs
70-75lb live rock
---
before adding anyfish I waited about 7 weeks... after my mistake (adding 10 fishes in same week) now I am adding only one fish at a time..
---
I have a qt tank, but i tursted my fishstore (he has amazing reviews even on the internet that his fish is well rested etc) therefore I never used my qt tank...I guess using the qt tank would be the first smart step...
---
My dead fish are floating..
---
My levels are close to 0 but not really nitrite is about 20 and below and it changes.. sometime 10-15-20 but never been 0...

 

[Randall_James]

I know it sounds unlikely but maybe you should try fish from a different store? The rest of your setup sounds just fine IMO.

I would say the Anemone is a terrible choice for any tank under 1 year old however. ( a bad choice for most tanks overall that are not species)

 

[angelsj247]

nitrites are pretty high, did you ever go through a cycle? could be still cycling

Here is some good information i found from this site about nitrites:
http://www.aquariumpros.com/faqpro/chemistry_2.shtml#05201491

How do we get our nitrite levels to stay low? We have a 55 gallon saltwater tank with an Ehiem filter and a protein skimmer, and we have 8 fish. It spikes during the day and is lower in the morning. Is this normal?

Nitrite should always be ZERO! In 99% of the cases where nitrite is present in an established marine aquarium, either there are too many fish, not enough filtration, or the aquarium is not receiving regular water changes every four weeks. In your case, we can only guess, and our guess is that you have more than 12 inches of fish, and that is the cause of your problem. The rule is 3 inches of fish per square foot of surface area, and you have 4 square feet of surface area in a 55 gallon tank. If that is not the case, then email us at support@aquariumpros.com, include a complete description of the fish and the tank, and we'll be happy to try and help you.

 

[Iam]

Thank you all... it's been helpfull...
Now I want to add one question... should I use a protein skimmer??????? and if it's yes... any brand that you recommend?

 

[lfjewett]

Doesn't seem like much flow. Your live rock needs a good ammount of water moving in and around it to work properly. and the fact that you still have nitrites seems to indicate your biological filter is not working. May seem like a silly question but do you know if this tank was cleaned with an anti-bacterial soap at any time?

My suggestions based on your post are the following.
1. Increase your flow.
2. Return or get a friend to care for the Anemone.
3. Make sure you are using good water RO or RODI.
4. Do a 25% water change, be sure to match SG and temperature with your tank first, and mix the water well to bring up the oxygen level first.
5. STOP ADDING LIVESTOCK. Read up in the forums on how best to run a QT tank and stick to a procedure of 4 weeks for each new animal.

One last question for others that might know more than I.. How are your fish acting? Do they swim around? Are they hanging out on the sand all day? Are their any noticable signs of external parasites or cuts?

 

[Iam]

Ok lfjewett.. Let's see
My suggestions based on your post are the following.
1. Increase your flow. (Got it.. I'll add another powerhead)
2. Return or get a friend to care for the Anemone. (OK)
3. Make sure you are using good water RO or RODI.
(I am using two different types of water.. Either I buy from a fishstore. it's about $0.50 per gallon.or I use sparklets - the ones that they deliver) is that a bad thing???
4. Do a 25% water change, be sure to match SG and temperature with your tank first, and mix the water well to bring up the oxygen level first. (OK)
5. STOP ADDING LIVESTOCK. Read up in the forums on how best to run a QT tank and stick to a procedure of 4 weeks for each new animal. (Yeap got that too)

to answer your question.. No never used antibacterial soap at anytime..

and the fish are acting normal... swimming around and dying.. they are the most happy and dead fish I've ever seen..

 

[angelsj247]

i dont use a protien skimmer for my 20 gal.. but i think you should for your 60 gal because its much bigger. helps with the nitrates in the water

 

[lfjewett]

A protien skimmer is used to remove disolved organic protiens from the water column before the natural nitrogen cycle begins to work on it. A skimmer is a great way of removing what normally ends up as Nitrate in our tanks. If you do not want to run a skimmer then I suggest you try your hand at a refugium. A refuge will use also help remove waste from your system.

Is the sparkletts water distilled? If this is some kind of drinking water I do not suggest using it. If it's plain RO water like you can get from the LFS or Wallie world then your fine.

Being as your fish don't show signs of a preditor, and are not gasping for air swimming slowly this kind of narrows the options a bit. After things in your tank have been stable for a couple weeks and you have your next critter in QT waiting for it's trip to the display you'll know more. If the fish die while in QT you might try a different source of livestock.

I've only got 1 1/2 years under my belt so let see if anybody else chimes in with ideas. Good luck.

 

[Iam]

Thank you lfjewett...
I am aiming for a protein skimmer..
my budget is about $200.. I hope i can get something ok for that price.. any recommendations

The water I use is not distillled.. It's bottled water.. not tap..
how about the ocean water from the LFS

 

[Iam]

and one more quick thing..i just noticed.. My clown fish are loosing their white stripes... They are turning gray??????
does this give you any clue???

 

[lfjewett]

Don't use the bottled water. LFS water is most likely RO water with artifical salt added and that is great to use. OR pick up a nice RODI unit from filter direct (ebay) for about $100 and never buy water again.. Till you get an RODI unit the LFS water is best.

At that price range there are several options, do you have a sump? If you need a HOB skimmer I believe the Aqua C Remora are about the best in that price range.

Post your last message in the "Fish Disease Treatment" Forum here on reef central. You'll get better advice on that topic there.

 

[Symone]

Just a thought....

If you are using prepared water from the LFS, what are you topping off with for evaporation? Any chance you're topping off with the same saltwater?

I notice you didn't give your SG when you listed your parameters, so just wondering now.

It's the only thing I can think of that hasn't been addressed already.

Good luck!

 

[Iam]

Hi Symone,
I top off with either filtered water (I guess just like rodi) or bottled water.. Because I was told that after evaporation the salt level increases.. so I don't add saltwater at all..
My levels are little less than the "green zone" (Floating meter) which is about 1.015

 

[Sk8r]

Your salinity should be 1.024 to 1.026. Use a refractometer properly calibrated, if at all possible: if those beads get loose from a float, they're a real pain. Floating-arm meters are too subject to error. Your temperature should be 78-82: do not trust your heater thermostat; use two different types of thermometer and check more than once a day for starters.
You are correct to add fresh water. What is your daily evaporation rate? Is it getting too low before you add? If so, there could be salinity rises and falls.
Note: some sources use fish caught by cyanide dosing. Such fish will fail and die mysteriously---and it is a very bad thing. You might try changing your source of fish.

 

[Iam]

Hi Sk8r,
I agree about the saltinity level.. I was just told by my LFS that keeping the saltinity low, would help to prevent white spots..
My evaporation rate is not to fast... I have a 60g, and I ussualy wait until one inch below the top (about one week) and add my water.. which is about 3-4 gallons..

 

[Randall_James]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7286925#post7286925 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Iam
Thank you lfjewett...
I am aiming for a protein skimmer..
my budget is about $200.. I hope i can get something ok for that price.. any recommendations

Do take a peek at the "Used Equipment" forum. You can do much better on a skimmer for the money (a good skimmer does not wear out) as many upgrade to larger models as they get further HOOKED on this hobby.

Word of caution (actually word of my own experience) make sure of whom you are doing business with. Phone number, address etc and pay with a credit card. You need to have some recourse if the guy/gal trys to stick it to you. (I had a guy send me a bunch of broken plastic one time and it was most upsetting). 99.9% of the guys selling are on the up&up but that .01 guy will kill you.