New Deodronephthya sp. study group?

[MadTownMax]

any comments about the use of phosphate removers - I started using some phosban (aluminum-based) mixed w/ my carbon and noticed that my dendro was "deflated" more often.

I have now removed the carbon/phosban mixture, using a carbon filter pad in it's place; and am closely watching my dendro for better inflation.

I've read similar reports of those w/ softies retracting their polyps when using phos-ban, and was just wondering if anyone was using phos-ban (or other aluminum based phosphate removers - the white kind), or rowaphos (Iron-hydroxide based - black) and noticed similar effects.

I also have some SPS corals in the tank - hence the want for a phosphate remover - in addition to trying to eradicate the grape caulerpa I have growing like a weed .


If some of you are using rowaphos with success, I'd gladly switch.

-Nick

 

[graveyardworm]

I am currently using phosguard and I use it regularly, small amounts dont seem to create any distress in corals 1 - 1 1/2 cups in my 90 seems okay. I recently put alot in (about 3 cups) to kick a dino outbreak, and I started to notice the pulsing xenia didnt pulse quite as much and they just didnt look right, there were no other immediate effects, after about two weeks with it in it came time to change my MH, I properly acclimated everything but I noticed some LPS, and softies starting to turn brown, I dont think its the lights. After reading an article in Coral magazine I belive whats happening is phosphate limitation so yesterday I cut back on the phosgaurd. We'll see what happens.

Excellent pics reefclown.

 

[DonJasper]

nearly 200 times turnover per hour. Wow!

(Thanks for the error catch!)

Yea kinda caught me off-guard to.

Feather dusts are prodigious feeders of phytoplankton. So if we apply the same idea to Deodronephthya sp. and speculate that they are heavy feeders. (Why wouldn't they be?) With our new found realization about just how much food a 12"/second current flow could bring in (and waste removed). And what it takes to achieve 12"/sec. We can perhaps realize that we ainââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢t in Kansas no more.

So if the 'secret' to keeping Deodronephthya sp. isn't some potion added to near stagnant water (stagnant from the Deodronephthya sp. point of view) - are we still serious about Deodronephthya sp.?

 

[DonJasper]

200x turnover is absolute madness, it would strip the specimens from the rock IMO, a lower volume more linear flow as per graveyardworm would be more feasible.

Get real! 200x is about 3"/second (which is what I've got).

The sand at the botton of my tank can been seen shifting around a very little. I mean very little. So given that 3"/sec barely registers on real life current velocities - how much is the sand shifting around in real life?

If you stick your hand in the water - you can tell which way the flow is only if you concentrate. Hardly enough to start blowing life off rock.

The trick, of course, is to convert the "super sonic water jets" put out by powerheads and pumps into a laminar-like flow. Manifolds are one way, but there are others.

 

[MadTownMax]

in real life, tidal and seasonal changes can move a sand bar from one part of the reef to a completely different part - but I don't think that dendro's are in that type of biotope.....

With this kind of flow expected I think I may try getting more flow to mine - I'll see what I can do, we'll give those SPS reefers a run for their money if we're aiming for 200X .

 

[rcmike]

I am interested in all this as well. I got a frag at the Cincinnati Ohio frag swap from mcox33 I think. At first I was skeptical about getting it but after she told me of the success she was having I figured I would give it a shot. I am sure it is possible to have success with them. Possibly some factor we haven't even thought of yet.

 

[graveyardworm]

I'd just like to point out an observation. If you look at the pics posted by reefclown, all of the corals except one appear to have feather-like polyps. In this pic

there is an orange one in the front a little out of focus, but it's polyps appear to be more like little hairs. This one looks identical to mine and I believe it to be suited to a different type of prey which I have yet to identify.

A couple questions for reef clown. Would it be possible to get a better pic of this one? If not am I correct about the polyps?

It appears to be deflated, how has it been doing compared to the other ones, and how long have you had it?

 

[craab]

i think it might be part camera/part deflated to give that hair like appearance, imo

 

[DonJasper]

but I don't think that dendro's are in that type of biotope.....

I didn't mean to distract the thread, but wanted an example to highlight just how pathetic the water flow is we have to work with.

And it follows that maybe Deodronephthya sp. is more sensitive about water flow than the corals we can keep in our tanks. Perhaps if we could provide it a moderate amount of water flow - maybe a foot or two per second - it might do better.

Could it be that the water flow that Deodronephthya sp. needs is more than our glass boxes can stand (before the force of the water breaks them apart)??
:lol:

Consider keeping a high-light coral alive using NO fluorescent bulbs - not gunna work out too good. So maybe instead of high-light Deodronephthya sp. is a high-flow coral.

 

[graveyardworm]

I'm pretty sure DT's changed their phyto so that people could not use it to start their own cultures - has something to do w/ using three different types of phyto so that they out-compete eachother and cause cultures to crash. I know I was never successfull in getting anything started using DT's - and my system is so small it does not make it economical to make my own - I only use about a tablespoon a day....

You could be right, so far the threads I searched which indicated it could be done were fairly recent I believe. I started the culture 2-2 liter bottles on 2-27 at 3:00 pm. I've never done this before so I dont know how they should look at this point, they dont appear to be much greener, but it is a little bit. I know it takes about a week for it to run out of food and become really green. I'll be sure to let you know how it goes.

It has now been 9 days since I started my first phyto culture with Dt's and FAF micro algae grow. The bottles are much greener, but not quite as green as the mature bottles pictured on Flame Angels site. I can also see some spots where particles have begun to settle. I am going to attempt to split one bottle in half to start two new cultures and see if it gets greener this time.

 

[graveyardworm]

Chek out the pic that was just posted in the newbie forum.

To bad its not their own tank, something just doesnt look right about it though.
I'd like to know what their secret is.

 

[mcox33]

I want orange and yellow and why not the red, I just have pink and purple.

 

[craab]

Where are your dendro's placed in reference to light recieved? Are they in the shade? in light?

I have mine hanging from an overhang but it has begun to crest straight out and into light. I recently added a 70 watt halide to my nano tank, went from 56 watts to 126watts and now my carnation is starting to not look as healthy. Do you think the light that it is getting is too much now?

I know they are non-photosynthetic, but maybe they have a preference for the light they do recieve as in they prefer shade, or just have no general preference at all.

 

[TaterInTheSouth]

I have mine just inside a cave, They get about 50/50 light. I have
been feeding DTs, Marine Snow and PhytoPlex as well the Fallout from
feeding fish and LPSs. I have all of my rockwork supported by a
manifold with a moderate flow underneath.

<img src="http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y23/TaterInTheSouth/Shadows.jpg" alt="Image hosted by Photobucket.com">

 

[TaterInTheSouth]

Hey!!! It WORKED!!

 

[graveyardworm]

I think as far as lights concerned you wouldnt necessarily be talking about shade from the light, but more in terms of light spectrum. The deeper you get the more violet the light becomes, so while shade from the light might be important I would think shade from actinic bulbs, or just some low watt actinic bulbs.

 

[MadTownMax]

Chek out the pic that was just posted in the newbie forumTo bad its not their own tank, something just doesnt look right about it though.
I'd like to know what their secret is.

That's from an old "Japonese Tank" thread, looks strange b/c they use an array of lighting to accent each coral's specific color - I think there are about 12 Halide lights on that tank - if you search for it there is a diagram showing how the lights are arranged, and what the relative wattages are (70-250W)

I'm not totally sure, but I think that specific tank was put togather by a store for advertisement purposes - probably just pulled corals from their separate tanks and arranged them like flowers in a boquet - it's a beautyful tank though.

 

[reefclown]

Love to send you folks some frags, but don't think they like travelling cross continent much.

I need to get hold of a better macro to get some closer shots, as most of the specimens are mid tank.


AFAIAA, some species of dendro grow in full light whilst the majority thrive in subdued overhangs. There is probably a wealth of literature posted during the 80's/90's but for some reason this seems to drop off in the new millenium

FWIW, I use 70W halides primarily, but attempt to employ shading wherever possible, 140w of philips 03 actinics are on 14hr daily though (primarily aesthetic).

Would be great if all could share some of the more usefull references that they have uncovered as well as maybe produce a species reference somewhat more expansive than the wetmedia one which reefers could add their comments to. A forum would probably best suit this purpose.

here's a few oldies to get the ball rolling , some interesting observations re phyto feeding and flow.

some earlier thoughts from EricB

http://www.reefs.org/library/aquarium_net/1296/1296_4.html

more recent from from charlesB

http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/jan2002/feature.htm

wetmedia ref

http://www.wetwebmedia.com/nephtheids.htm

It's at times like these that I wish I had more time and money and extensive diving experience.:mixed: :rollface:

 

[craab]

good reading

 

[craab]

anybody elses cresting like mine? I glued it under the overhang when I first got it, and about a month later it grew out under the overhang.