New found fish (Gramma dejongi)

[copps]

Like I said on RB, how can they say they are endemic if they are a deepwater fish? I bet we still haven't discovered their full range yet...

Also aren't there restrictions for collecting deep in the Caribbean/Florida? Pretty sure you can't use a rebreather to collect in Florida. I'm not sure if that is the case for the Caribbean too. Either way I bet they could be found somewhere else besides Cuba.

Tim, this fish is deep, but not Lipogramma deep or rebreather depth (or Lipogramma price)... and just because people think it's probably found in other locations doesn't mean it cannot be called endemic... Centropyge boylei is listed as endemic to the Cooks, although most people believe it isn't... until a new specimen has been found outside of that range that's how it is listed... C. narcosis has been documented outside of the Cooks now!

Rebreather collection is only illegal in Florida, not throughout the Caribbean. There are many things collected in the industry on rebreathers outside of Florida in the Caribbean...

ive seen them in the FL keys.not rebreather deep but deep... and never with any regularity. maybe once or twice and ...i cant even imagine how many dives ive done, alot though.

Really? Those reefs have been dived a ton and never anything on this fish... did you realize this was a new fish when you saw it, and how far back did you see it? I need to touch base with my deepwater buddies in FLA to see if they've ever seen such a fish. How deep approximately did you see these?

Thanks,

Copps

 

[tcmfish]

Ok, wasn't sure on the diving thing.

As for the endemic thing, I understand until it is found elsewhere it is considered endemic, but I was just trying to say that I'd be willing to bet they could be found somewhere else besides Cuba, solving the issue of people here being able to get them.

Basically saying I'm not convinced they are endemic to Cuba, just like people not being convinced about C. boylei.

 

[Sheol]

Well, there is still talk of ending that pointless boycott of Cuba ( guys, Cold War has been over for 15-18 years now & Fidel is defunk!). Love to see those in the US!

Matthew

 

[NexDog]

Sweeet, want more info.

 

[The Reef Expert]

They're from Cuba, if your in europe or your just a persistent hobbyist I think you'll find a way. Chingchai, maybe try and get in contact with some Carribbean wholesalers/divers.

 

[rekn]

i was young, i could tell it was a gramma and when ever i spoke about it i refered to it as yellow gramma. it never really came up now that i think about it and the last i can remember seeing 1 was 15 maybe 20ish years ago.

Tim, this fish is deep, but not Lipogramma deep or rebreather depth (or Lipogramma price)... and just because people think it's probably found in other locations doesn't mean it cannot be called endemic... Centropyge boylei is listed as endemic to the Cooks, although most people believe it isn't... until a new specimen has been found outside of that range that's how it is listed... C. narcosis has been documented outside of the Cooks now!

Rebreather collection is only illegal in Florida, not throughout the Caribbean. There are many things collected in the industry on rebreathers outside of Florida in the Caribbean...




Really? Those reefs have been dived a ton and never anything on this fish... did you realize this was a new fish when you saw it, and how far back did you see it? I need to touch base with my deepwater buddies in FLA to see if they've ever seen such a fish. How deep approximately did you see these?

Thanks,

Copps

 

[H.Tanaka]

Wow ! What a beautiful new discovery it is !

Who has described it ? No data on Fish Base, USA.

copps,
Do you know the locality of Centropyge narcosis outside the Cook Islands ? I have not known, and it is VERY interesting.

 

[chingchai]

They're from Cuba, if your in europe or your just a persistent hobbyist I think you'll find a way. Chingchai, maybe try and get in contact with some Carribbean wholesalers/divers.

Thanks for the input.
I may get this fish if everything is on plan.

 

[copps]

Wow ! What a beautiful new discovery it is !

Who has described it ? No data on Fish Base, USA.

copps,
Do you know the locality of Centropyge narcosis outside the Cook Islands ? I have not known, and it is VERY interesting.

A couple of years ago in Hawaii when I was at the Bishop Museum Rich Pyle received an e-mail from a rebreather diver with a photo he had taken of an unidentified fish... it was Centropyge narcosis, and the diver was nowhere near Rarotonga in the Cooks, but rather at Rangiroa in the Tuamotus of French Polynesia!!!! Amazing considering the fact that there are a thousand islands in between... narcosis is very deep though... deeper even than boylei. I spent the weekend a couple of weeks ago with Rich again when we both spoke at a conference in Michigan... he confirmed that boylei has still not been found elsewhere.

And on the topic of the Bishop Museum the great Jack Randall is describing this Gramma... he and Arie Dejong (the Dutch wholesaler and namesake of the fish) go back decades... and they are both hard core fishnerds (like anyone reading this sentence this far into this thread)! :spin1:

Copps

 

[H.Tanaka]

Copps,
Many thanks for your comment in detail, and I was astonished to hear such a story. It is apparent that many undescribed spp. and endemics will be found in some limited or vast areas from now.
Hiroyuki

 

[titoreefs]

Not to hijack this thrread but I read above that collecting fish with rebreathers is illegal in florida and what i would like to know is WHY??????????

Im a collector in Puerto Rico and all though I dont use rebreather tecnollogy it certainlly does sound like nonsense to me.
Here we have a VERY STUPID LAW that states that hooka diving is illegal.

Damn law makers and their quest to make the stupidest laws.

 

[ChemLife]

Can anyone give the journal the original description will be published in? The full list of authors besides J.E. Randall and A. Dejong? I have a feeling that I'll be doing a few searches in the usual databases....

 

[Kroonos]

.....and some new,recent pictures, made by Dietmar Schauer from Germany.

Paul Kroonen
Geleen.

 

[Ooulophilia]

Breathtaking...

 

[copps]

Not to hijack this thrread but I read above that collecting fish with rebreathers is illegal in florida and what i would like to know is WHY??????????

Im a collector in Puerto Rico and all though I dont use rebreather tecnollogy it certainlly does sound like nonsense to me.
Here we have a VERY STUPID LAW that states that hooka diving is illegal.

Damn law makers and their quest to make the stupidest laws.

I am not sure of the exact reasons that rebreathers are illegal, but I could bet it has nothing to do with deep diving. A rebreather diver could stay down all day collecting shallow... unlike the limits of compressed air SCUBA. Also, no bubbles are given off, so finding divers in protected areas from the surface would be impossible with rebreathers.

Can anyone give the journal the original description will be published in? The full list of authors besides J.E. Randall and A. Dejong? I have a feeling that I'll be doing a few searches in the usual databases....

Ben Victor is the first author... the great Jack Randall is the second author. Arie de Jong is not an author but the namesake of the fish that first saw it decades ago in Cuba. When I know the journal I'll post it, but Ben is still playing with the DNA... interestingly this fish is morphologically identical to Gramma loreto, but grows to just half the size!

 

[LemonLemon]

there 1 being offered for sale if there's interest in my country.

 

[Outerbank]

Man, those are stunning fish!

 

[michael_cb_125]

LemonLemon- Pricing?

~Michael

 

[copps]

Asia is offering huge bucks for these at the wholesale level... and it doesn't surprise me one bit...

 

[rekn]

even in their native water they are rare, i bet the big dogs in japan get these.