New outlet being installed. Regular or gfci??

[michael43]

So the wall where I am putting my reefer 450 lacks a power outlet. The electrician is coming today to put one in. Is a regular outlet with a good quality surge protector ok? Should I have a gfci done? I know gfci can trip and shut the power down easier. I guess that's a safety feature but.. The electrician recommends a regular outlet with a good surge protector. What do you guys do? I also could do a regular wall outlet with a gfci surge protector like this:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B000W...ector+gfci&dpPl=1&dpID=41d-MsenEAL&ref=plSrch

 

[davehead86]

If hes in there working have him put in a GFCI. Thats what you are supposed to use within a certain distance of sinks etc because of the water present so it makes perfect sense to have it for your aquarium stuff.

 

[SoloGarth]

Definitely install a GFCI.

 

[A.Astore]

Don't even question yourself about it being a GFCI! Mine stopped a lot of damage by stopping the issue at the outlet rather than needing to go the whole way to the circuit breaker in the garage. Hopefully it never shows its worth to you but I know mine did within a few days!

 

[Sk8r]

Oh, yes, GFCI. There will be the day you bless your lucky stars you did.

 

[firemountain]

If your electrician is recommending a regular outlet near a water source, I would seek out another electrician. It's code to have GFCI's near a water source, and it's the proper installation. It's more $$$ to install but worth it. Better yet...have him install two 4 bay GFCI outlets that are on separate circuits...if you have the space on the panel.

It's very easy to overload a tank, and the last thing you want to do a have a circuit trip and while you are not home or away...to come back to a tank that has no heat, water flow, or gas exchange. Yes....GFCI's can trip but only when they are overloaded.

I have one of those plug in GFCI adapters in a regular, but only because I already have the tank installed. With an electrician doing work already... Have him do the GFCI.

 

[Hitch08]

Does the electrician know that this is for a fish tank? I'd be a little concerned if he did.

EDIT: OK. I took too long to post that.

 

[michael43]

Thanks guys. It's a friend who is doing it but is an electrician by day. He knows it's primarily for a tank. He has one himself. I think he was just trying to save me money and he said his has been fine like that for quite a few years. But I'll def go gfci.

 

[Rx79394]

hmm... they say that if there is a GFCI somewhere down the line, that is all that really matters, as that will trip as well if something goes bad at the outlet. (don't know how true that statement is, I am not an electrician)

However, as I am not about to spend the time to figuring out which outlets are on what circuit at my apartment... it was easier, and less of a worry to just install another at the end terminal at the tank. The GFCI outlet is about 15 dollars in comparison to the 1 dollar regular outlet. The 14 dollars is worth the extra piece of mind.

 

[Hitch08]

I purchased one of these as I might have used a non-electrician (myself) to install a GFCI. A little extra peace of mind as to how it was done.

I went around the house and checked other ones. Turns out the original builder did one wrong, which I was able to correct. Go figure.

 

[homer1475]

3.29 for a regular outlet, 10$ for a gfci one. No brainer for me, and certainly not a place to try and save a couple bucks.

GFCI by nationwide building codes has to be installed anywhere there is a possibility of the outlet getting water in it. You can circumvent the code by having at least 1 GFCI outlet on a circuit(if a regular outlet gets wet but is inline with a GFCI, the GFCI will still trip), or a GFCI breaker.

Since I have some electrical experience, I did one better on my tank and installed 2 GFCI outlets on separate GFCI breakers. If one fails, the other will trip.

 

[T Haynes]

So the wall where I am putting my reefer 450 lacks a power outlet. The electrician is coming today to put one in. Is a regular outlet with a good quality surge protector ok? Should I have a gfci done? I know gfci can trip and shut the power down easier. I guess that's a safety feature but.. The electrician recommends a regular outlet with a good surge protector. What do you guys do? I also could do a regular wall outlet with a gfci surge protector like this:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B000W...ector+gfci&dpPl=1&dpID=41d-MsenEAL&ref=plSrch

its not that it shuts down easier, its that a gfi trips and a regular one wont. one will burn your house down, the other wont. gfi arent that much more expensive. get that

 

[Utwo229]

I am an electrician so maybe I can clarify what is being said here. Yes the NEC (safety) code requires a GFCI 3ft from a sink/tub and in damp/wet locations. So In my opinion, anywhere near a tank or sump qualifies. But more importantly isn't the distance or the immediate area, but rather all the electrical equipment that has water running through it or nearby.

So here are a few electrical facts to understand. You can install a GFCI receptacle and/or a GFCI circuit breaker. Both will protect YOU from any undesired electrons that leak out and you get between them and their proper return path (a ground fault). That hopefully saves your life it it happens.

If you ground your tank/sump and the water, then if undesirable electrons leak into the water from a defective pump or thermometer or something else, then hopefully the GFCI will sense that and save your livestock. That's what we do for swimming pools.

Just remember, a GFCI receptacle will ONLY pop (trip) if the electron's return path becomes potentially dangerous by sensing a ground fault.

Now both a GFCI breaker and a non-GFCI breaker will trip to provide over current protection and short circuit protection. Over current is when you ask the circuit to power too much stuff. Your receptacles are going to be 20amp or 15 amp. You Must NOT change out the breaker for a larger one just, because it keep tripping because of over current. That's asking to burn your house down. A short circuit usually occurs when the wires or the receptacle get damaged. It can also occur if the device you plug in has a short somewhere.

But since a GFCI breaker can also trip if it is providing ground fault protection in addition to over current and short circuit protection, this may be confusing as to the root case..

So you are risking your life if you don't use either a GFCI receptacle or GFCI breaker. The breaker will protect everything on that branch circuit, while a GFCI receptacle can be installed to protect anything plugged into it AND other receptacles wired downstream on the same circuit. It must be wired correctly for this to work.

 

[joshbrookkate]

Thank you for the clear explanation!

 

[kcinnick]

My house was built in the 50's, pool in the 70's, not a single GFCI in the house or on the pool. We are getting the pool redone, so it will probably get upgraded. We have old school outlets that are mounted up high by the light fixtures by all the sinks.

 

[Utwo229]

You can replace any receptacle in an old or new house with a GFCI one. It will protect you from ground faults even though it is "ungrounded". If you do this you will be adding protecting against ground faults but you will not be adding a 3rd ground wire. The third ground wire is there primarily for short circuit protection. So when you may want to do this is anywhere you may be standing in water or touching water and could accidentally come in contact with stray electrons from a defective device or wire.

The name GFCI is a little confusing as it actually has nothing to do with the ground. How it works is It has a computer chip that detects if there are electrons not returning on the neutral wire that should be. If it senses 5mA or more out of balance (minus what your load used) it will pop.

 

[snorklr]

have him install the outlet where it is accessible (not neatly hidden behind the tank)because it has been my experience that gfi outlets will go bad from time to time (2 in my garage under 3 yrs old and another in my friends house 15 yrs old)....thats the only reason i can think of him suggesting a regular outlet, they're almost good forever...and the load center you pictured is a gfi....but a 50 dollar one instead of 15

 

[Utwo229]

Excellent point. Both GFCI receptacles and breakers do go bad. Every time a power surge, like a lightening strike or a brownout or similar occurs, the varistor in the GFCI weakens. Here in Florida (the lightening capital) I replace them all the time.

Another fact about GFCI devices is that the UL listing changed as of 7/1/2015. With older GFCI devices you may or may not know when they fail unless you press the test button. I doubt many people go around testing GFCI receptacles on a regular basis, if ever. The problem is that depending on the manufacturer, some of the receptacles stop providing power if they fail while others do not. He of the companies had a patient to do so and it wasn't licensed widely.

So the new GFCI devices have self testing and will stop providing power if malfunctioning. Some even have an audible alarm. So try to make sure you or your electrician are installing new ones. Some of the old ones are still being sold until inventories run out. The down side is that the new ones are about 20% more expensive right now.

 

[michaelrc51]

Excellent point. Both GFCI receptacles and breakers do go bad. Every time a power surge, like a lightening strike or a brownout or similar occurs, the varistor in the GFCI weakens. Here in Florida (the lightening capital) I replace them all the time.

Another fact about GFCI devices is that the UL listing changed as of 7/1/2015. With older GFCI devices you may or may not know when they fail unless you press the test button. I doubt many people go around testing GFCI receptacles on a regular basis, if ever. The problem is that depending on the manufacturer, some of the receptacles stop providing power if they fail while others do not. He of the companies had a patient to do so and it wasn't licensed widely.

So the new GFCI devices have self testing and will stop providing power if malfunctioning. Some even have an audible alarm. So try to make sure you or your electrician are installing new ones. Some of the old ones are still being sold until inventories run out. The down side is that the new ones are about 20% more expensive right now.

Are the new ones arch fault as well or completely different?

I know when I sold my house which I had put a 100amp lug panel in the garage the inspector said that the building codes going forward all new electrical receptacles will have to be arch fault.

I understand GFCI very well but not understanding why arch fault stuff is going to be required?

To the OP.......don't mess around, get a quality GFCI outlet installed. Honestly, if your electrician friend even suggested not installing a GFCI receptacle I would probably find someone else to help you or hire an electrician.

 

[Reefugee]

If the outlet will be accessible (e.g. not block by the stand) - I would definitely put in the GFCI outlet. If the outlet will eventually be blocked or hard to get to, I would install a regular out AND install a GFCI circuit breaker at the breaker box.