NEW plumbing method for an ULTRA QUIET REEF TANK!!!! LONG !!!!
- Thread starter Herbie
- Start date
Herbie
Yep,that one
Hi,
eameres.........
I never tried it the way you are discribing, so I cant really lend any advise..........Sorry.
I *think* I do remember some talk about using both the emergency drain and the main drain, utilizing the same single bulkhead though. Its somewhere within this VERY long thread. I think its around the middle of the thread.
You may want to check back, and re-read some of the posts about this.
GOOD-LUCK though..........
If you come-up with a way to make this work, (quietly and SAFELY) please post it back again. As it may help some some others who only have a single bulkhead, or dont want to give up, there 2nd "return" bulkhead for a safety.
Later...........Herbie
eameres.........
I never tried it the way you are discribing, so I cant really lend any advise..........Sorry.
I *think* I do remember some talk about using both the emergency drain and the main drain, utilizing the same single bulkhead though. Its somewhere within this VERY long thread. I think its around the middle of the thread.
You may want to check back, and re-read some of the posts about this.
GOOD-LUCK though..........
If you come-up with a way to make this work, (quietly and SAFELY) please post it back again. As it may help some some others who only have a single bulkhead, or dont want to give up, there 2nd "return" bulkhead for a safety.
Later...........Herbie
If you try it, the highest point of the bypass should be above the desired water level in the overflow box, otherwise water will just drain through the bypass since it is not restricted.
Also I would not have the bypass ended up joining the silent drain in the sump rather have its own outlet because if you join them the water that flows in one tube will create suction on the other tube.
loose-electron
New member
Another believer in the Herbie Overflow method. I spent last weekend re-plumbing my new tank.
Pump return plumbed outside the tank now, up the back.
Inside the overflow box two simple standpipes with screens on them.
Emergency sump return 90% up to the top of the box, Primary sump return about 20% up to the top of the box.
Primary sump return with a gate valve to the sump, secondary return also to the sump.
It works, and works well.
With some though on the fluid dynamics (yeah an engineer) you see that the system has a small amount of self-correction in it. The gate valve is the primary flow rate control, and after thats set, you realize that the height of the water over the primary return (in the overflow box) also slightly changes the rate of flow, it rises, and flow rate goes up. So it is self correcting.
An old thread with an interesting evolution. When all else fails, build it and try it out.
Nice job Herbie. it works, it works well, and it is totally silent.
I got a Durso standpipe and a Stockman standpipe both in need of a good home.
Pump return plumbed outside the tank now, up the back.
Inside the overflow box two simple standpipes with screens on them.
Emergency sump return 90% up to the top of the box, Primary sump return about 20% up to the top of the box.
Primary sump return with a gate valve to the sump, secondary return also to the sump.
It works, and works well.
With some though on the fluid dynamics (yeah an engineer) you see that the system has a small amount of self-correction in it. The gate valve is the primary flow rate control, and after thats set, you realize that the height of the water over the primary return (in the overflow box) also slightly changes the rate of flow, it rises, and flow rate goes up. So it is self correcting.
An old thread with an interesting evolution. When all else fails, build it and try it out.
Nice job Herbie. it works, it works well, and it is totally silent.
I got a Durso standpipe and a Stockman standpipe both in need of a good home.
pjpeels
Premium Member
Just got through reading the Thread. What day is it?
Seems to be a great system. Would like to implement it.
Wish we could draw up some more conclusions on the overflow box water level fluctuations and minor infrequent valve adjustments.
Do you think that if we oversized the main drain we could make the fluctuations less frequent or less noticeable?
If you had a tank with a 1" overflow rated at lets say 1200gph. I really have know idea if that is close so hypothetically.
Have it drilled to 1 1/2" or 2" and still use the 1200gph pump. Now before the upsize on your holes, do you think that because the overflow and the pump were to closely rated in GPH we see (greater?/quicker?) fluctuations.
Thought maybe a scientist or plumber might have an opinion on the tanks overflow capabilities vs. the pump’s GPH relationship.
Or have I just been looking at the computer screen to long and need to take a break and regroup.
I am sure there could be a number of other factors.
I just thought I would at least discuss the different bulkhead sizes hypothesis since no one has really brought up making them massive.
Trying to bring something to the discussion, Thanks
Seems to be a great system. Would like to implement it.
Wish we could draw up some more conclusions on the overflow box water level fluctuations and minor infrequent valve adjustments.
Do you think that if we oversized the main drain we could make the fluctuations less frequent or less noticeable?
If you had a tank with a 1" overflow rated at lets say 1200gph. I really have know idea if that is close so hypothetically.
Have it drilled to 1 1/2" or 2" and still use the 1200gph pump. Now before the upsize on your holes, do you think that because the overflow and the pump were to closely rated in GPH we see (greater?/quicker?) fluctuations.
Thought maybe a scientist or plumber might have an opinion on the tanks overflow capabilities vs. the pump’s GPH relationship.
Or have I just been looking at the computer screen to long and need to take a break and regroup.
I am sure there could be a number of other factors.
I just thought I would at least discuss the different bulkhead sizes hypothesis since no one has really brought up making them massive.
Trying to bring something to the discussion, Thanks
pjpeels
Premium Member
Another thought,
Could our return pumps be experiencing voltage irregularities?
Power irregularities like sags and swells could be effecting the pump speed throughout the day.
Example: for those of you experiencing an overflow water height difference between the daytime and nighttime. During nighttime, not as much is going on as far as appliance use. During the day is the most common time to operate your kitchen appliances, washer, dryer, lights in house, and AC.
Not to mention everyone on the same electrical transformer as you.
Thoughts?
Got the idea from reading Stereophile magazine. They have frequent articles on power regulation and the importance of using voltage stabilizers/regulators. Supposed to help extend the life of the equipment and give your equipment a better chance to run properlly. Think about what the effects might have on your lighting ballasts or other equipment in your tank or house.
My example may not be perfect, but maybe an electrition can chime in.
Thanks
Could our return pumps be experiencing voltage irregularities?
Power irregularities like sags and swells could be effecting the pump speed throughout the day.
Example: for those of you experiencing an overflow water height difference between the daytime and nighttime. During nighttime, not as much is going on as far as appliance use. During the day is the most common time to operate your kitchen appliances, washer, dryer, lights in house, and AC.
Not to mention everyone on the same electrical transformer as you.
Thoughts?
Got the idea from reading Stereophile magazine. They have frequent articles on power regulation and the importance of using voltage stabilizers/regulators. Supposed to help extend the life of the equipment and give your equipment a better chance to run properlly. Think about what the effects might have on your lighting ballasts or other equipment in your tank or house.
My example may not be perfect, but maybe an electrition can chime in.
Thanks
Wow just finished all 30 pages. great info thanks Herbie.
I didn't see the use of fliter socks in the sump addressed.
I have dual in tank overflows. I intend to connect both lines to a T and a gate valve and then run the single drain thru a filter sock in the sump. If the gate valve is as close to the filter sock as possible, this should reduce the water fall/velocity/noise and still filter the water.
I would imagine this would add some noise above exhausting the drain in the sump, but will it still work to filter the water and reduce noise?
I didn't see the use of fliter socks in the sump addressed.
I have dual in tank overflows. I intend to connect both lines to a T and a gate valve and then run the single drain thru a filter sock in the sump. If the gate valve is as close to the filter sock as possible, this should reduce the water fall/velocity/noise and still filter the water.
I would imagine this would add some noise above exhausting the drain in the sump, but will it still work to filter the water and reduce noise?
pjpeels
Premium Member
If you connect both of your two overflows to a T and put a gate on the single pipe leading to the sump, then you will not have an overflow dedicated as your emergency drain. Unless you don't want one.
Not sure why having the gate valve close to the filter sock matters, but I think you want the output under water in a section of the sump where the water level remains the same height. Back pressure
You might try the method and then use the filter sock if you still have noise. Unless you what to use a filter sock. I don't see a prob. I might start using one on my new tank.
Not sure why having the gate valve close to the filter sock matters, but I think you want the output under water in a section of the sump where the water level remains the same height. Back pressure
You might try the method and then use the filter sock if you still have noise. Unless you what to use a filter sock. I don't see a prob. I might start using one on my new tank.
Wow. I can't believe this thread is still around...
I've been using this method for over a year now with no problems. Instead of worrying about making sure the level is always constant in the overflow, I found that it was best to run the overflow level at it's highest point. By this I mean, the "emergency" drain will always be functioning. The majority of the water will go down the main drain, but some water will trickle down the emergency drain.
Not sure I'm reading this right, but if you have dual overflows, I would dedicate 1 hole in each overflow as the emergency drain vs 2 holes in one overflow. This way you'll get better circulation with a drain on each side of the tank.
By exhausting the water above the water level, you're defeating the purpose of this "silent" method. But to answer you question, it will work above or below the water... you'll just need to tune your system to your configuration.
I've been using this method for over a year now with no problems. Instead of worrying about making sure the level is always constant in the overflow, I found that it was best to run the overflow level at it's highest point. By this I mean, the "emergency" drain will always be functioning. The majority of the water will go down the main drain, but some water will trickle down the emergency drain.
Not sure I'm reading this right, but if you have dual overflows, I would dedicate 1 hole in each overflow as the emergency drain vs 2 holes in one overflow. This way you'll get better circulation with a drain on each side of the tank.
By exhausting the water above the water level, you're defeating the purpose of this "silent" method. But to answer you question, it will work above or below the water... you'll just need to tune your system to your configuration.
Awesome is all I can say.
I'm testing this with a cheap ball valve and it's working great. My gate valve gets here in two days. My Oceanic tank came with a durso kit and I'm using the adjustable bottom piece as the emergency drain, so I can easily try out different heights.
My first reaction was negative since I didn't really want to have to run the plumbing up the back, but I'll turned it into a win by going with a 2-way oceansmotions squirt wave maker and bulkheads through the euro bracing. I just hope the wavemaker doesn't foul up the equilibrium.
Now my powerheads are the loudest thing in the tank!
Thanks Herbie!
I'm testing this with a cheap ball valve and it's working great. My gate valve gets here in two days. My Oceanic tank came with a durso kit and I'm using the adjustable bottom piece as the emergency drain, so I can easily try out different heights.
My first reaction was negative since I didn't really want to have to run the plumbing up the back, but I'll turned it into a win by going with a 2-way oceansmotions squirt wave maker and bulkheads through the euro bracing. I just hope the wavemaker doesn't foul up the equilibrium.
Now my powerheads are the loudest thing in the tank!
Thanks Herbie!
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