New thread: LED info only for ATS's only....

outy said:
Actually it has been done. Its obvious you have not read the thread above.

that's why I stated my source as Floyd who is the person responsible for helping everyone here, and gives detailed instructions on how to build lights for ATS.

Blue is not needed
Click to expand...

I read the complete thread. No offense to Floyd, but his name does not equate to scientific peer reviewed papers. In a macro algae refugium, I used a hydroponic fixture with 1:1 ratio of red to blue. I was very happy with it. Does that make it better than a 3:1 ratio of red to blue? Not necessarily, but it was my experience.

I don't use an ATS. For me, the discussion is academic.
 
Even Floyd is a bit wishy washy on this.. From post 6884 in the sticky..

It's actually better growth than I've ever seen out of that form factor of light. I would still say though that the fixture somewhat limits the amount of algae you will be able to grow. Here's my guideline for high power LEDs

Quote:
*** This is current as of 2015-05-15! ***
----------------

Here is my recommendation for LED lighting of a waterfall algae scrubber screen:

This is for a double-sided screen using Philips Luxeon ES 3W Deep Red 660nm LEDs without lenses (120-140 degree) running at 700mA at 2-3" from the screen to LED

Minimum coverage: One LED on each side of every 8 sq in of screen
Maximum coverage: One LED on each side of every 4 sq in of screen

Simple as that. For new screens (bare) if using the "Maximum" level, run at 350mA until mature, or use a diffuser. Might have to do this with the Minimum level also actually, but not typically. The minimum could probably be stretched to a larger area but screen will cure slower and generally have less capacity.

So for a 6x6 screen, which is 36 sq in, /8 = 4.5 per side. Make it 5.
So for a 6x6 screen, which is 36 sq in, /4 = 9 per side.

Supplementing with blue/violet: Always run blues at 350mA, violets can be run higher but should follow the same rule for the maturing stage (350 at first, then increase after maturing). Use one to two at this current level for every 5-6 reds, roughly. Lots of flexibility here, a little blue/violet goes a long way. I've used 440-445nm Royal Blue Luxeon ESs for this, but I know of at least one other that used to use RBs and switched to Deep Violets and almost doubled growth. Steve's LEDs now carries a good Hyper Violet made by SemiLED.
Click to expand...

;)

pg276...
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1977420&page=276
 
Not sure if it could be used in a scrubber as it is a very powerful light on my fuge, but it is growing my cheato like I never have before.. I am posting this, as I have had scrubbers in the past also, and would be interested in someone else's possible experiment/trying this with a scrubber.. After all, it could easily be turned on its side..

MarsHydro Mars300 Mars600 LED Grow Light(Mars300 with Veg/Bloom Spectrum for Hydroponic Indoor Greenhouse/Garden Plant Growing, 132W True Watt Panel) https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00XC3LBI2/ref=cm_sw_r_other_awd_XqP1wb4281DC3
 
Subsea said:
We all are experimenting with what works best. Good fortune on your quest.
Click to expand...


That is just it


They have tested the different spectrums for years, and done side by side test.


Plain white cheapo CF will work, but over time they have worked it out to red leds.


The trick here or main objective, is the most growth with the lowest wattage consumed.


There are many ways to skin this cat, and all I'm telling you is the CURRENT conclusion of what is working the best after years of experience on their part.

Floyd has been with this from the beginning and has been very very helpful to THIS community. As far as I am concerned he is an authority on the topic.
 
Anectodally, it seems that 3:1 to 5:1 (red:blue) ratio provides the most success. But all of this hasn't been scientifically verified.

If you look at chlorophyll a and b peaks, it makes most sense to me to use 4 LEDs (420, 450, 625 and 660). 420/660 for chlorophyll a and 450/625 for chlorophyll b. I have some BML strips that are great at growing algae, but I have not done any control experiments. Here is one strip that I have:

http://www.bmlcustom.com/custom-report-details?partNo=PS1290S201TSTKGTSTLATSTKG

The trouble with knowing what is optimal is that people report everything from low watt CFLs to HPS as being the "best" without any real experimentation going on... me included.
 
outy said:
They have tested the different spectrums for years, and done side by side test.
Click to expand...

Where? I have read most of Floyd's posts here (and at his other site) and he has certainly evolved what he has found to be "best", but I have never seen him do a side-by-side comparison... do you have a link?
 
outy said:
That would be how to waste energy


Way to much power for ATS

I'm getting by with 20w and growing algae.
Click to expand...
What kind of algea though? Turf? Or just the regular green, slime and brown?

And maybe it is, depending on the size of the system, and if lit from both sides. But what about a larger system(say for instance, mine is 210 gallons total and /or larger )? And growing turf algea..

Because turf, from what I learned, is the best to grow and requires extremely strong light..

But Hmmnn.. Lol, I guess if I really want to know, I can build one myself and experiment.. And then see what it does first hand..

The other thing is conventional thought on scrubbers and cheato is low light. But those same low light fixtures don't produce the growth that I get in my fuge(about 20x18x7). With lots light fixtures and bulbs,, and this is what I think people miss, I was having that typical "die off, light colored, algea. But with higher light, even with low nutrients, cheato and a scrubber does produce well.. And this one even easily outperforms my hps 150..

I may just build one myself and see..
 
outy said:
What's the most ideal ratio of Red/White/Blue LEDS?

and floyds response

Skip the WW and go all red. If anything mix 50/50 660nm and 630nm and maybe 1 455 or 425 blue per 6-8 reds, if any blues at all. Nothing is 'proven' yet but there have been a few getting good growth with only 660 and only 630 so mix 'em and that way you're covered.

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showpost.php?p=19438012&postcount=82
Click to expand...

a few getting good growth with only 660 and only 630 so mix 'em and that way you're covered.
Click to expand...

brings us back to the broad spectrum red/ royal blue "full spectrum" LED's doesn't it?

;)

you can't say I am wrong if nobody tried them..
 
oreo57 said:
brings us back to the broad spectrum red/ royal blue "full spectrum" LED's doesn't it?

..
Click to expand...

Nope.

He is talking about 2 colors of red. 630 and 660 are both red.



These are the lights many of us are running now and they have a little blue as well. close to the 6-8 red to 1 blue being suggested by floyd as an alternative to all red.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/32187555006...49&var=510820920568&ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT


On a side note the 30W light is really using only 20W, so take the drop into consideration when figuring out ones requirements
 
outy said:
Nope.

He is talking about 2 colors of red. 630 and 660 are both red.
Click to expand...
:deadhorse::deadhorse::deadhorse::deadhorse::deadhorse::deadhorse:

It makes little difference:
compred,jpg
 
outy said:
Here is one red VS blue

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showpost.php?p=23848062&postcount=679


First pic is red screen-I got about 3/4 cup algae. There are a couple patches of algae that are kind of stiff with strands maybe a little less than 1/16" in diameter. The strands crush easily. The rest is hair algae. The other pic is the blue screen. I got about 1/4 cup algae.
Click to expand...

That is all blue vs all red. I was asking where is the 3:1 or 5:1 red:blue vs all red side by side experiment? No one here suggested all blue would be better than all red.
 
Oreo, who's LED is that? All the warm white diodes I have looked at have a more broad yellow/red band.

It would be interesting to blend with a rebel lime to get a white with more red in it (none algae use).

Now if you could cut that 450nm peak in half they could be mixed with a little 420-430nm violets for a nice algae grow light.

oreo57 said:
It makes little difference:
compred,jpg
Click to expand...
 
Fredfish said:
Oreo, who's LED is that? All the warm white diodes I have looked at have a more broad yellow/red band.

It would be interesting to blend with a rebel lime to get a white with more red in it (none algae use).

Now if you could cut that 450nm peak in half they could be mixed with a little 420-430nm violets for a nice algae grow light.
Click to expand...

They call them "full spectrum" on flea bay though they don't have any of the green phosphor.
 
Here is one month growth from the 30w light I posted

To large a screen for 1 cube a day, but growth is even and coloring up.


IMG_0523_zpsjrteyjiw.jpg
 
Whoops, I all but fogot I posted this thread,
And Thanks for posting!

This is a controlled experiemnt. LED growth vs CFL.

Well, I pulled the trigger and bought 2 x 30 W Grow Light LEDs.
** The lights I got were NOT plug and play! I kind of expected that however when I read that somewhere.
*Luckily- I save things that I think might be usefull on another project in the future!
I had several 5ft 3 prong/wire plug and wire I cut off my old/used PC lights.
So I got out my soldering iron and solder- that gets used once every 5 yrs or so, and soldered and taped the wires up- now like new!- freebie too.

Here are the lights- I bought two of them- shipped to me for less than $40 total.


After installing the wire/plug. Did NOT require any type of ballast/transformer, etc.


I used my noodle and devised a free, easy way to hang the lights at the existing area using some old (saved for future projects) fiberglass rod sections from an old tent I once had.
I used some old high tensile line salvaged out of my sailing gear. Todd_Sails- right?

The experiment is one sheet has CFL's and one has LED's.
I cleaned both sheets equally and at the same time this time so they both start even.







I'm also tried Aluminum Foil for the top splash guard this time, instead of clear plastic.
The alum. foil kinda stays creased around the pipe better than plastic wrap, and it will block the light too.

You can be sure I'll post back with the results,
Todd
 
Subsea said:
Why have you decided that a red led is an upgrade from CFL? Does photosynthesis happen in only one band width of color spectrum?


I use a 23W CFL that is 5000 Kelvin color reduction from Home Depot under the product name "ecoSmart". It is made in China where standards for color spectrum are not regularly reported.
Click to expand...

I'm doing this comparison, with Chinese CFL's @ 2700K,
and my now grow light Leds 30W, both started with a cleaned screen, side by side, etc.

MY ATS has 2 large screens side by side, I usually clean them staggered, to keep one growing algae.

While I"m getting good growth with the CFL's, Turbo recommends changing them Q 3 months- the LED's should last ~ 10 years.
 
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