Not new,but struggling and frustrated

ZoesZoo

New member
Here's the latest:
45 gallon cube, with 2in sand bed and approx 30lbs live rock.
Canister filter with carbon matrix, and GFO.
Skimmer (Aquaamax) always ran wet.

Have always struggled with high nitrates (20-25ppm) with feeding 2 clowns, 3 damsels, 1 Christmas and 1 anemone. Cleanup crew consists of 2 fire shrimp, 4 hermits, 1 peppermint shrimp.
Feeding: half cube frozen at night dissolved in 20ml tap water - more on that in a second, tiny pinch of seachem flake in morning (about the size of the clicker on a ball point pen).
Anemone fed twice weekly with small amount of clam in tank water.

Water changes every two weeks (10%) with Instant Ocean Sea salt

Recently(2 months ago) I lost patience, and retested all the parameters, and rechecked feeding process and tank setup. I found:
1. Phosphates very high in the tank (Hanna tester) - unmeasurable.
2. Tap water was the same. Stopped using tap water for the feed and switched to RODi.
3. Nitrate still around 25 (salifert)
4.Nitrites 0
5 Ammonia 0
6.Mg 1240
7.Calcium 420
8. Alk 10.2
9. Salinity 1.023

this was after making sure we were testing twice a week and supplementing with Kent Calcium and C-Balance.

Took the plunge on a hob refugium.
2in of Miracle Mud in main chamber, 1 bag purigen, 1 bag chemipure, Cheato, and fuge light running during the day for 10 hours. Also put in a poly pad on the new skimmer (in build with the fuge) output flow for good measure.

2 weeks have passed - I have just lost (quite literally) 1 of the two clowns. Mushrooms are not expanding as much as they were.
Skimmer is producing a thicker skim, although I don't care if it skims wet if its pulling the nitrates.
Astrinea are around, as are shield limpets, some algae on the glass but not much, rocks are clean.
After all this, here are the questions:
A) Should I be so worried about the phosphates?
B) ANything else I should be looking at to reduce the nitrates or just leave things as they are for everything to settle down and just do the water changes to keep nitrates in check. I'm nervous about making any further changes to the tank.
C) Anyone have any observations to make on any part of the above.

Thanks
Simon
 
So it kind of seems like you are chasing numbers. You didn't mention problems, what problems were you having? If the tank was stable or doing well, and now after chasing numbers it is doing worse, then that is no good of course.
 
Not new,but struggling and frustrated

You have very little export of nitrates. Skimmers are only about 30% effective. They remove solids in the water. Not really nitrates but things that will add to your nitrate levels.

You need another way to export nitrates. Chaeto, ATS, carbon dosing etc.

You need to replace gfo quite frequently if your phosphates are high. They get exhausted pretty quickly.


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problems really are the nitrates and I question if I should be trying to get phosphates down. Like I said, I've lost one clown, but i have also tried a couple of SPS in the past which have died.
 
@vincent,
I added chaeto to the fuge when I set it up two week ago, nitrates are still rising (today nearly 75ppm). I'm assuming that the fuge is going to take some time to settle in, and maybe even add to the nitrates as the miracle mud ages a bit. I'll do another water change today, but get the nitrates down (some) but it wont cure whatever the problem is.
 
IMO, your Nitrates are not the problem, but if you have high Phosphates, that is. What are your phosphates? I've run my nitrates as high as 40ppm and my SPS had good color. But I always kept phosphates low (less than 0.05).
 
I have a Hamma phosphate meter, and its reads flashing 200 which means the phosphate level it too high to measure (so over 200ppb).

I'll double the water changes, and see what that does.
Any other thoughts?
 
I am also thinking that the rock and DT sandbed is so saturated in phosphates that its leaching out and so taking longer to get the levels down.
 
I've had good results with NoPoX. You have to go through an 'ugly' stage at which the bacteria are up front and awful, but it gets there. I had clean-up to do after a power failure that took out a lot of livestock (no lights, no circulation, no heat) and while the tank lived, they didn't have a test color to describe my nitrate level. This AND a tougher (many times tougher) skimmer got it down.
 
Lighting a is a fluval marine and reef LED. Timing ramps up from 8.30 to noon (full power) then goes to 75% for 2 hours, back up to full power from 2-6, then dims to off at round 8.30pm when the 'moonlights' come on.
 
I've had good results with NoPoX. You have to go through an 'ugly' stage at which the bacteria are up front and awful, but it gets there. I had clean-up to do after a power failure that took out a lot of livestock (no lights, no circulation, no heat) and while the tank lived, they didn't have a test color to describe my nitrate level. This AND a tougher (many times tougher) skimmer got it down.

Vodka dosing is also a viable solution
 
I wouldn't recommend dosing just yet I would do at least 3 water changes a week until your Nitrates at are 0. Overdosing will more than likely kill your fish.


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I would seriously reduce the feeding by amounts and frequency. Maybe a quarter cube once every 3 days. Also a GFO/Carbon Reactor along with weekly water changes of 10-15%. Need to decrease the nutrients and increase the export. Only a handful of ways to accomplish that. might also consider using some pellet one of the days in place of cubed food. i.e. hikari is good stuff

http://www.bulkreefsupply.com/marine-s-pellet-fish-food-hikari.html
 
Hi all,
just thought i would post a follow up. I installed an innovative Marine AOI reactor into the the HOB refugium, and put a half dose of Phosban into it. I kept the 'fuse lights on 24hours. I also refreshed the Chemipure with Chemipure Blue.
Reduced the feeding to 1/4 cube, and added additional cleanup crew (5 hermits, 10 snails to dig through the sand bed).
As of this morning, phosphates are down to 0.08ppm. Nitrates still high at around 40-45 but coming down.
Water look clearer, and fish less stressed (as am I!)
Will keep going with the water change regime but the NOPOX sits unopened on the shelf (the nuclear option wasn't needed yet).
Really appreciate everyones input, and fish and I thankful for all the good advice.
 
I just dosed until tests indicated the problem was not a problem. Testing PLUS action is better than action without testing. In terms of time, I'd say it took a couple of months.
 
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