OT: Anyone know where you can buy E85?
- Thread starter mfp4073
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InLimbo87
New member
http://flexfuelus.com/E85-Find-a-Pump . Looks like there's one out off of turkey lake...
thetrueclown
New member
Is there any place out there where you can get ethanol free gas? Is what I want to know. Unless you have a newer vehicle it causes you to get less mpg.
Fuzzy
New member
E85 - Not only does it suck - it's corrosive too.
One of my kids accidentally put E85 in our boat (up north - lotsa E85), the stuff ate through the diaphragm in the fuel pump, leaked onto the exhaust manifold, and blew the hatch off :mad2:
FYI - here's the math for the loss on ~10% ethanol
Gasoline has about 120000 btu per gallon. Ethanol has about 90000 btu per gallon. At a 90/10 percent mix the btu would be:
(120000 * 0.9) + (90000 * 0.1) = 117000 btu, and
117000/120000 = 0.975
So, the E10 mix looses about 2.5% of its energy.
One of my kids accidentally put E85 in our boat (up north - lotsa E85), the stuff ate through the diaphragm in the fuel pump, leaked onto the exhaust manifold, and blew the hatch off :mad2:
FYI - here's the math for the loss on ~10% ethanol
Gasoline has about 120000 btu per gallon. Ethanol has about 90000 btu per gallon. At a 90/10 percent mix the btu would be:
(120000 * 0.9) + (90000 * 0.1) = 117000 btu, and
117000/120000 = 0.975
So, the E10 mix looses about 2.5% of its energy.
AquaKnight
Active member
Not only does it suck and is corrosive, but it also doesn't make sense. Sorry, but the importance of food comes before the luxury of gasoline. Why we are sacrificing acres and acres of farm land just produce E85, which can't support the country is beyond me. "Hey look, E85 is is $1.25 cheaper!" Terrific, so instead, milk is $7.50 a gallon, and a loaf of bread is $4.
Sigh, milk has nothing to do with E85.
As for bread, and other products that Ethanol is a Bi product of...do a little research on where we import it all from. So it makes no differnce that we use land to make products for Ethanol.
Besides, look at all the ways to get the product before you assume there's one or two.
There's been tons of studies and tons of other products that can produce the bi product of Ethanol. I really wish people would think with their brains instead of the egos.
I'm no environmentalist or anything, but hell if you get the entire world producing less emissions then we all win. Think of the bigger picture.
As for bread, and other products that Ethanol is a Bi product of...do a little research on where we import it all from. So it makes no differnce that we use land to make products for Ethanol.
Besides, look at all the ways to get the product before you assume there's one or two.
There's been tons of studies and tons of other products that can produce the bi product of Ethanol. I really wish people would think with their brains instead of the egos.
I'm no environmentalist or anything, but hell if you get the entire world producing less emissions then we all win. Think of the bigger picture.
Fuzzy
New member
Actually, I have done a bit of research on ethanol. In my job I get to attend a lot of corporate meetings. Not too long ago I worked one for a large bio-fuel conference.
Yes, there is a growing demand for it, but there are many obstacles to overcome, primarily in distribution. Which is due essentially to the corrosive nature of ehtanol. Also most ethanol is transported by river barge - the companies who make the barges are at capacity and can't build them fast enough.
But in time there will be better alternatives. Butanol (sp?) is the first that comes to mind. It has the same properties as gas but is clean burning. There is a lot of research on different crops for conversion as well as new types of refinement. Some of the FL colleges have had very good results with sawgrass - significantly higher yield per acre than corn. And it grows better in adverse conditions. Also there are new technologies in refinement that use bio-engineered bugs to speed up the conversion process.
Regardless - the fact remains that there is simply not enough land available to meet our food and energy needs. While ethanol is a starting point it is clearly not the solution.
Yes, there is a growing demand for it, but there are many obstacles to overcome, primarily in distribution. Which is due essentially to the corrosive nature of ehtanol. Also most ethanol is transported by river barge - the companies who make the barges are at capacity and can't build them fast enough.
But in time there will be better alternatives. Butanol (sp?) is the first that comes to mind. It has the same properties as gas but is clean burning. There is a lot of research on different crops for conversion as well as new types of refinement. Some of the FL colleges have had very good results with sawgrass - significantly higher yield per acre than corn. And it grows better in adverse conditions. Also there are new technologies in refinement that use bio-engineered bugs to speed up the conversion process.
Regardless - the fact remains that there is simply not enough land available to meet our food and energy needs. While ethanol is a starting point it is clearly not the solution.
AquaKnight
Active member
What in the world are you talking about? Have you done any research yourself?
Of course E85 has everything to do with milk. What exactly do you think goes into cow-feed? We're forcing cows to be fed distiller grains (the mush left over after the ethanol process).
Or how about the need for phosphorus, a fertilizer needed in mass quantities to treat ethanol products? And for a start, may research the effects of mining phosphate rock, an environmentally devastating, and geopolitically perilous activity. Just an idea....
Jimbob
Active member
we're not speaking about biodiesel here... we're speaking about E85. The amount of energy required to prepare raw ethanol so that it is suitable for automotive use and in sufficient quantity is staggering. Call it what you want, but the power that is used to refine that ethanol into E85 has to come from a power plant and the majority of power generation comes from sources that pollute more so than our automobiles do.
Biodiesel, on the other hand can be made from a multitude of sources, many of which require virtually no supplemental energy.
AquaKnight
Active member
Because of the tropical nature sugarcane requires. The US does not the acres of Amazon to mow down, in order to set-up sugar cane farms. Pretty much limited to the southeast in the US, Florida and the Mississippi river delta area.
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