Planning a big tank, ?'s about cost/commitment

[Dangerwill]

My wife and I are in the early stages of planning a big tank. We are thinking somewhere between 180 and 300 gallons. My main concern is how much more time/money I am going to be spending per month in comparison to what I spend currently on my 90 gal reef.
I have read several big system build threads and have seen some amazing setups and while I would love to put 20k into my system that is not going to happen.

My plan is to put together a simple reef system with a maximum tank size of 300 gallons, pref a 300 dd and sump/fuge that maxes out at 100 gallons.

my question to those of you who have made the upgrade from a 125 or less to a monster tank is:

1. was there a huge increase in your monthly cost to run the tank?

2. was there a huge increase in how much maintenance you had to perform?

Thanks much

 

[michael_in_nc]

In the last year or so, I upgrade from a 75G to a 250G. This was my experience:

- Everything is bigger with a bigger tank. The key for me was planning and automation to keep everything in check. (controller, water plumbed to tank for top-off and water changes, dosing pumps, etc.) Makes up front cost more (maybe $500 - $1k more depending on how you handle it), but in the end I think it will make you more successful and the hobby more enjoyable.

- Everything costs more than you estimate.

- I don't have a running tab on my monthly maintenance costs, but for one, I did not notice a major difference in my power bill and I am running halides. power is cheaper here in NC I think, though.

- I am much more attentive to the new tank even after 8 months now. It's just more enjoyable. I can do so much more with it. It's less of a chore...

Definitely glad I did it. It's a lot of fun now and even all the building process was enjoyable for me, but that depends on the person.

Good luck.

 

[Dangerwill]

automation definitely seems like it would be key. with my current setup I do not use an ago or controllers. I have a diy kalk doser and get my water from vending machines. With a bigger tank that would be way to inconvenient.

 

[coondog]

I went from 72 to 240 gallon. I saw about a $120 a month increase on my power bill. I really don't mind doing maintenance on the tank at all. With everything automated and toggles for all you main components: skimmer, return pump, etc.... Doing any maintenance is a breeze.

 

[Dustin1300]

Its not completely exponential but it does go up for sure. I have went from a 120 gallon system to what i'm currently building which is a total of 1000+ gallons.

Electricity before was about 50 a month with halides and no regard for electricity and efficiency. With going to LEDs and trying to be smart about efficiency when I buy, electricity will be 160-180 a month. lighting was the big recurring cost before but I ran 1000+ Watts before on a much smaller system. With LEDs, i'm able to run a 140 gallon frag tank and 600 gallon dt with 960 Watts of lighting!

Up front cost are definitely more though.....

Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk 2

 

[thewire]

automation definitely seems like it would be key. with my current setup I do not use an ago or controllers. I have a diy kalk doser and get my water from vending machines. With a bigger tank that would be way to inconvenient.

I don't have big tank experience but i uesd buy water too..it was PITA!..Buy a RODI and make your own water...easier and cheaper in the long run..with big tank i think you need like 50g drum for water storage unlike 5g bucket i used

 

[SPotter]

startup costs will definitely be higher than you expect just becuase you might have over looked something or decided to go bigger with a piece of equipment or something. Having just completed my upgrade I went over my budget by close to 50% based on earlier totalling....I am afraid to go any further. If you have an lfs that does installations ask them to design a system for you and then take that list to the for sale thread and see what you can buy 2nd hand. As far as maintenance time goes, I really dont see an increase in the amount of time I am spending on maintenance. My wife will say diferently but its not that much more. I was able to semi-automate certain activities making it easier for me to do a couple of things at the same time.

Good luck.

 

[CHSUB]

92 to 300; startup costs = huge. monthly costs and maintenance, with planning, can be lower and easier. i changed to leds and a calcium reactor from, MH and 2 part, just 2 examples!

 

[tobyte1]

Stocking a large tank can get expensive in a hurry too.... Rock aint cheap! If you are doing corals, you need big(ie. expensive) pieces. Frags get lost in a large tank.....

 

[Alex T.]

startup costs will definitely be higher than you expect just becuase you might have over looked something or decided to go bigger with a piece of equipment or something. Having just completed my upgrade I went over my budget by close to 50% based on earlier totalling....I am afraid to go any further. If you have an lfs that does installations ask them to design a system for you and then take that list to the for sale thread and see what you can buy 2nd hand. As far as maintenance time goes, I really dont see an increase in the amount of time I am spending on maintenance. My wife will say diferently but its not that much more. I was able to semi-automate certain activities making it easier for me to do a couple of things at the same time.

Good luck.

+1. Wives are never accurate regarding how much time we spend on our tanks.

Did I also mention that everything in my tank was between $5 - $10?:lol:

Honestly though, , I believe in the 2 foot rule. For every 2 feet of tank length I believe the cost goes up substantially. Lighting, aquascaping, filling it with corals and fish, bigger protein skimmer, more carbon/gfo, supplementing, flow requirements, energy consumption, maintenance costs, etc.

Bigger tanks need more automation or the chores you get away with on smaller tanks will get neglected, and be viewed more as a nuisance than enjoyment. Also, when things go wrong in a smaller tank they reveal themselves much faster. With experience, that's a good thing if you can catch it and correct it. In a larger tank things can happen slowly, but the road back once things go wrong can be downright costly, and if you're on a limited budget, the tank will suffer.

Unfortunately, this is a pay to play hobby. To play with the big boys that have tanks 250 gallons plus will cost a good amount of money...especially if you catch the SPS virus. Look at the cost of what you'll need to set it up, then calculate your maintenance costs and add at least 20% to that.

Still want to sign up?:rollface:

 

[maik1]

Well said Alex T.
It all adds up FAST! If you have a budget that you need to stay within, I would say don't do it.

Maik1

 

[prop-frags]

You are getting some varied perspectives here.
Of course the answer is somewhere in the middle. Our experiences in moving up from 180 to 300g DT, bigger sumps, etc., are:
1) you get what you pay for. If you go cheap on up front, you wind up paying in the long run (e.g., crappy Chinese made equipment that fails after a year). It is by far better to either DIY where you know what the quality is because you make it, or do your homework and save up for quality components.
2) It is OK to start low and grow. This usually means manual, or labor-intensive things at first like top-off, dosing, skimmer cleaning, etc., then you can buy or build-in automation in increments. Again, it's a trade-off of your time invested versus your money invested. We really like low and grow, because it makes you really understand everything that is going on (and what can fail), and also gives you more of an appreciation of the automation equipment.
3) Maintenance costs are going to scale up with the size of the tank. This is particularly true in water changes. At several of the large aquariums we've toured, the aquarists there are consistent in reporting that the single largest maintenance cost is salt mix. We do a lot of water changes, and we plow through some buckets of salt!
4) As the size of your tank goes up, so does your overall investment. Over time, you can sink some huge $$ into your live stock. Along with that investment, the risk of loss due to failure of the system climbs. This makes the conscientious hobbyist think a lot more about insurance and redundancy in their system, and these two things cost more as well. It is a dilemma; we look at the price of say, a battery backup system and then compare that to the cost of losing everything if the power fails when we aren't home, and so we invest more money into the system...it's a spiral that can get out of control if you don't plan accordingly.

 

[Alex T.]

You are getting some varied perspectives here.
Of course the answer is somewhere in the middle. Our experiences in moving up from 180 to 300g DT, bigger sumps, etc., are:
1) you get what you pay for. If you go cheap on up front, you wind up paying in the long run (e.g., crappy Chinese made equipment that fails after a year). It is by far better to either DIY where you know what the quality is because you make it, or do your homework and save up for quality components.
2) It is OK to start low and grow. This usually means manual, or labor-intensive things at first like top-off, dosing, skimmer cleaning, etc., then you can buy or build-in automation in increments. Again, it's a trade-off of your time invested versus your money invested. We really like low and grow, because it makes you really understand everything that is going on (and what can fail), and also gives you more of an appreciation of the automation equipment.
3) Maintenance costs are going to scale up with the size of the tank. This is particularly true in water changes. At several of the large aquariums we've toured, the aquarists there are consistent in reporting that the single largest maintenance cost is salt mix. We do a lot of water changes, and we plow through some buckets of salt!
4) As the size of your tank goes up, so does your overall investment. Over time, you can sink some huge $$ into your live stock. Along with that investment, the risk of loss due to failure of the system climbs. This makes the conscientious hobbyist think a lot more about insurance and redundancy in their system, and these two things cost more as well. It is a dilemma; we look at the price of say, a battery backup system and then compare that to the cost of losing everything if the power fails when we aren't home, and so we invest more money into the system...it's a spiral that can get out of control if you don't plan accordingly.

How true. When I set up my last tank I manually topped off for three years, and had others do the same for me when I was on vacation with the family. I also lugged buckets to mix salt and dump dirty water. However, I did realize the small nuances that affected my system and learned from them. This makes setting up my new tank much easier than I thought. It's through the labor of doing many things manually that you learn the best way to make it easier for YOU. Knowing the easiest and most efficient way to do something usually involves going through the ordeal firsthand. The issue with doing many of these things manually is "Are you passionate enough about the hobby to do what it takes?" There are many on these boards that sport beautiful reef tanks that claim little maintenance. It must be kept in mind that what they really mean is there is little maintenance....for a reef tank. There is a good deal of work to be done maintaining a system of such large volume. There's really no way to escape it. Your cost in salt will go up substantially, so find a good one that you can afford, check how readily available it is in your area, and go with it.

I now appreciate the automation much more than I would have if I hadn't done some of those things manually. I also find that the habits I created are good to have. Now that I have an ATO connected to a kalkwasser reactor that draws from an RO/DI reservoir, I check my water level in the sump a few times daily to make sure that it's working. When I'm home, I also check the mix times I set for the kalk to mix in the reactor so that it's saturated before it tops off. I don't know if I would have been so on top of it if I hadn't developed those habits. Now, some of the mundane tasks I use to do give me time for other things like paying more attention to the livestock and their progress.

Gadgets are great, and can really make short work of things. Gadgets in this hobby cost a lot of money though. Doing things manually until you see how a specific component will benefit you is probably worthwhile, and will save you some money on your endeavor. More than anything, passion and dedication will get you much further than the most expensive toys. It's those little things that you learn about your system that make it unique. Noticing them, learning from them and doing what works only happens with dedication, observation, passion and knowledge. Nobody has a mature, sparkling clean, full blown reef tank teeming with corals and fish by accident. There are guidelines, but no guarantee.

Plus, knowing the time it takes to design, build, equip, maintain and move into place such a large system, it makes you contemplate whether this is all worth it to you. If you choose to break it all down, you'll have to call the same friends over to move the monster out. That's enough motivation for me to keep moving on and make the tank better each year going forward.

 

[maik1]

This may also help you decide http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2044202

Maik1

 

[mtcoins123]

AND it becomes harder and harder to find "choices" fewer and fewer vendors as you get into larger system components

 

[newtank]

You already have a tank, already clean & maintain it. It costs you money and has for a while. Be patient. Get the 300g, buy good used equipment slowly, as you get great deals. Find low wattage pumps-they run all the time and will have the most impact on the electric bill, skip pressure pumps. Chinease LEDS are cheap and they work, cost less to run, and can be customized. Yes, you will buy more salt. I have a supplier that charges $30 for a 200G IO box. I may do 10% water changes once a month. Again, deals are out there if you look hard enough. As far as maintenance goes, I went from a 55 to a 125 to a 300+ and I still only change filters socks twice a week, clean the glass every few days and sphion the bare bottom once a month. All the same maintenance for a 300 as a 55, it takes about the same amount of time. Having a dog is more work than a large reef, at least for me. The real difference is the pride I take in my awesome reef, that not only reflects my passion for the hobby, but provides me a great deal of joy. Plan carefully, take your time. You will be glad you did it.

 

[newtank]

PS
To answer your question more directly

1. Monthly cost change- 125g to a 300G about $50. Upfront upgrade costs can be steep. Buy used and will probably get your money back if you need to sell.
2. Maintenance-moot. Plan it out well and there will be little to no difference.