PO4 high, not coming down, need advice.

The tank gets a pinch of flake in the morning...

in the evening we're putting 2 cubes of mysis, 1 cube of brine and 1 cube of blood worms in there, with a quirt of some R.O.E. and some of the powdered coral food. but we are feeding 15 fish in the tank...

We throw the occasional clam in, also, for a little treat.
I would get rid of the brine and blood worms. Both are not that nutritious and could contibuting to higher phosphates.

Go to the grocery store and buy some raw shrimp. Do mysis one night and chopped up shrimp the next. Instead of flake clip kelp or nori to the side of the tank daily
Raw shrimp has the lowest ratio of protein to phosphates that Randy measured. Frozen mysis in the amount you feed adds little
 
Food is the number one contributor to ongoing PO4. And from what I have understood is water changes will not lower PO4, only the nitrates. Randy published a whole article on the subject in the Advanced Aquarist.

I have been using the Rowa Phos in the NextReef reactor with good results down to .06-.08 from .36. The rest is going slow but the second change I made small as the stuff seemed so aggressive that I wanted to slow it down. But I think I will need more GFO in there. The Rowa Phos is expensive, but the reviews are impressive.
 
I would get rid of the brine and blood worms. Both are not that nutritious and could contibuting to higher phosphates.

Go to the grocery store and buy some raw shrimp. Do mysis one night and chopped up shrimp the next. Instead of flake clip kelp or nori to the side of the tank daily
Raw shrimp has the lowest ratio of protein to phosphates that Randy measured. Frozen mysis in the amount you feed adds little

I forgot to say we also have some 56 corals, as well. I was broadcast feeding the corals also once per day when doing the evening feeding. We'll constructively cut back on feeding, and see if that helps drop the numbers.
 
I forgot to say we also have some 56 corals, as well. I was broadcast feeding the corals also once per day when doing the evening feeding. We'll constructively cut back on feeding, and see if that helps drop the numbers.

Broadcast feeding with what
You are not doing them any favours by running high phosphates
 
Broadcast feeding with what
You are not doing them any favours by running high phosphates

What am i feeding the corals? Real Ocean Eggs (R.O.E.) made by reef nutrition, Coral Frenzie, and the bits and pieces they'll collect of the brine. I also squirt some phytoplex in there every other day (I know that's not really contributing to the problem)....

I have a mixed reef, a little of everything, but they're all baby corals for the most part...
 
What am i feeding the corals? Real Ocean Eggs (R.O.E.) made by reef nutrition, Coral Frenzie, and the bits and pieces they'll collect of the brine. I also squirt some phytoplex in there every other day (I know that's not really contributing to the problem)....

I have a mixed reef, a little of everything, but they're all baby corals for the most part...

Okay to go back to some of the original suggestions installing a reactor of Gfo will help in your situation
If your are going to provide an enriched environment for corals...which is ideal then IMO you need sme kind of carbon dosing and Gfo media
 
.... I understand. I have a GFO reactor I bought and set up 2 weeks ago... it's TLF Phosban 150. I was running the XportPO4 in there, but it obviously got saturated quickly. I switched out for some new Xport, but I'm going to switch over to the BRS stuff with a carbon media mix, so I can keep the GFO from binding. I'm also short on room in the stand. and will monitor the output water of the reactor to see when I need to change...
 
I believe the best short term fix was already mentioned. Lanthanum Chloride will get you back to square one with PO4 levels. After that it is all about how much of what you feed and GFO. GFO alone to bring it down could be quite expensive.
 
I believe the best short term fix was already mentioned. Lanthanum Chloride will get you back to square one with PO4 levels. After that it is all about how much of what you feed and GFO. GFO alone to bring it down could be quite expensive.

I'll do some research on here, because I know nothing of it... it's sounded rather complicated from what little I had seen.
 
You buy LaCl in the form of a fairly concentrated aqueous solution, generally a pool-care product like SeaKlear. You then dilute it with RO, and drip it into a stream of tank water passing through a very fine mechanical filter, such as a 5 micron sock.

It forms a precipitate (lanthanum phosphate, La04P) which is insoluble under normal reef tank conditions. It can remove extremely large quantities of phosphate very, very quickly and at a very low price. It can also bind with alkalinity, but with much lower affinity. That's generally only a consideration once you get to very low phosphate levels.

Downsides:
-More complicated to use than just plugging in a reactor, but then again cleaning a reactor isn't exactly all fun and games either.
-Need to source very fine mechanical filters.
-Need to observe tank to make sure the filter is catching the precipitate, and that alk is not being depleted.
-It will lower PO4 VERY quickly, which could be stressful to some corals.

If you've had such high levels for a long time, your rocks will likely continue to leach phosphate for a very long time to come, and unless you feel comfortable recharging it, I just can't really imagine GFO being an economical solution.
 
What if I dilute it into my ATO tank, and run the water line over to the skimmer chamber with a mechanic sock to filter the output from the ATO?
 
Did some reading on ATO's and they don't seem to be consistent enough to use for dosing. I'm thinking a 1000ml IV bag with 1L RODI water, 5mL of Seaklear, and drip it into a 5 micron filter sock in the sump, next to the skimmer seems to be a relatively common usage of the stuff.... dose as necessary to bring the numbers back to normal. Sound like a fair plan?

I just testing the output from the GFO reactor and it's still 1.04ppm....
 
I am not disputing the above information however I have reduced higher phosphate levels then your reading by using my On my way! mixture of carbon Rowaphos.
In the reactor i start with a layer of carbon then a layer of rowaphose and finally a layer of carbon again. This allows me to crank up the flow in the reactor without losing all the Gfo
Since you will have to change it initially a few times it is still cost effective to do it this way
 
Your plan for lanthanum chloride seems reasonable to me.

If you want to use more flow with your reactor, you could reverse the pump input and the reactor output tubing.
 
Thanks, guys. I've only been reefing for a year so all help is greatly appreciated. I have a maxijet 1200 pushing water through the reactor, so it has pretty good flow.

I'll post back here with results on how this goes.

Thanks again.
 
Thanks, guys. I've only been reefing for a year so all help is greatly appreciated. I have a maxijet 1200 pushing water through the reactor, so it has pretty good flow.

I'll post back here with results on how this goes.

Thanks again.

It's nice to know you appreciate the help. Tks
 
Little update, here. I am in the process of dosing the SeaKlear right now. I'm going slow and started out with a mix of 1.25mL of SeaKlear to 250mL of RODI. I'm going to do another mix of same dose. I am then going to stop, test water, and will continue on my day off next Tuesday.

One thing I noticed is that my water went crystal clear like I have never seen it. Amazingly clear. I wonder if it has something to do with the PO4 binding to the lanthanum Chloride? Anyone else have this happen?

I'll dose/test, report results here in a little bit.:fish2:
 
set up some macro algae for the long term care once you get it clear...

also rowa phos kicked butt in my tank...
 
set up some macro algae for the long term care once you get it clear...

also rowa phos kicked butt in my tank...

Thanks. I'm running about 2/3 of my sump with caulerpa covering the LR...

I'll have to check out that rowa phos once my brs runs out. ;)
 
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