maddog2002
New member
I have powder blue tang n my 135g Reef more than a year till now . He eats formula two pellet, Mysis and seaweed. He is fat and active. I love it.
Powder blue tang primer
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TRBOFISH
New member
I've had my PBT for close to 6 years now and love it :thumbsup:
It's in a 140 G tank with 2 Tunze 6100 on pulse mode.
Skimmer is an ATI BBM250. The tank is currently lit by 2*250W 14000K + 2*36W T8 blue lamps.
I wish I had a larger tank but unfortunately can't modify my set-up at the moment.
It is now about 5 inches and eats whatever I put in the tank, dry food, mysis, brine shrimps, nori...
He's getting along in the tank with other tangs, far too much would one say: purple tang (close to 10 years old), hippo (7,5 years), sohal (close to 7 years) and achilles (5 years).
They all get along quite well but I would not advise anybody to try to do like me.
For so many tangs, lot of open space + lot of water motion + lot of hiding places + very good feeding is very important in my opinion
You have all these in the same tank with no issues? :beer: Hats off to you. I just setup a 220 and I would love to have your tang selection plus a regal angel, majetic angel and emperor for good measure.
blennielove
New member
Greetings everyone,
I've got ich issues with my powder blue tang and then everyone else got in in 10 days. Here is my question to you and it is from something that I've read:
Do you experience an ich flare up everytime you add a new fish to the tank?
Was your Powder Blue Tang or any Tang the first fish to show signs of ich?
Do you think that Ich is carried on the Tang and then with each new addition or stress they are the first to show symptoms?
Here is the link:http://www.reefs.org/library/aquarium_net/0297/0297_2.html
Here is a portion of that article from Aquarium.Net Feb 97 Diseases in Fish Part 5 by Mr. Shawn Prescott:
A special observation:- The writer has observed with some of his co-workers on many occasions, that Crytocaryon irritans often breaks out under the following conditions. The Hobbyist will have a tank with several specimens all of which are free of any signs of the parasite. A new fish will be introduced & the following day, "white spots" will be observed in a great many cases, NOT on the new introduction, but on one of established inhbitants. This happened so often so years ago, that we made some experiments on apparently "disease free fish". Most especially some powder blue, & yellow Tangs.
Cyst of C.irritans
We found on these fish, which had been free of all problems for more than half a year, that when we did some skin scrapings, that we found evidence of trophonts under the skin. Evidently these had not found it necessary to reproduce & leave the fish, as no sign of disease had occurred over a long period of time
With this evidence we explained the phenomena just mentioned as follows:-
A parasite by definition has a vested interest in co-existing with it's host. As long as no unusual disturbance takes place, it will continue it's idyllic existence , in harmony with it's host. However when a new specimen is introduced to the Aquarium, often the established inhabitants become quite excited, feeling that the newcomer will in some way, take their "space", eat their food, or even team up with their favourite fish/companion. This causes some form of chemical message to course its way through the fishes system, in much the same way, as adrenalin causes us, to become excited if we get a fright or suchlike. This chemical message, in some way alerts the parasite, which in effect says to itself, "Oh boy!, maybe I should get out from here, & look for a new host". The consequences are seen the next day, when it bores out from the host, leaving the telltale white spots.
I've got ich issues with my powder blue tang and then everyone else got in in 10 days. Here is my question to you and it is from something that I've read:
Do you experience an ich flare up everytime you add a new fish to the tank?
Was your Powder Blue Tang or any Tang the first fish to show signs of ich?
Do you think that Ich is carried on the Tang and then with each new addition or stress they are the first to show symptoms?
Here is the link:http://www.reefs.org/library/aquarium_net/0297/0297_2.html
Here is a portion of that article from Aquarium.Net Feb 97 Diseases in Fish Part 5 by Mr. Shawn Prescott:
A special observation:- The writer has observed with some of his co-workers on many occasions, that Crytocaryon irritans often breaks out under the following conditions. The Hobbyist will have a tank with several specimens all of which are free of any signs of the parasite. A new fish will be introduced & the following day, "white spots" will be observed in a great many cases, NOT on the new introduction, but on one of established inhbitants. This happened so often so years ago, that we made some experiments on apparently "disease free fish". Most especially some powder blue, & yellow Tangs.
Cyst of C.irritans
We found on these fish, which had been free of all problems for more than half a year, that when we did some skin scrapings, that we found evidence of trophonts under the skin. Evidently these had not found it necessary to reproduce & leave the fish, as no sign of disease had occurred over a long period of time
With this evidence we explained the phenomena just mentioned as follows:-
A parasite by definition has a vested interest in co-existing with it's host. As long as no unusual disturbance takes place, it will continue it's idyllic existence , in harmony with it's host. However when a new specimen is introduced to the Aquarium, often the established inhabitants become quite excited, feeling that the newcomer will in some way, take their "space", eat their food, or even team up with their favourite fish/companion. This causes some form of chemical message to course its way through the fishes system, in much the same way, as adrenalin causes us, to become excited if we get a fright or suchlike. This chemical message, in some way alerts the parasite, which in effect says to itself, "Oh boy!, maybe I should get out from here, & look for a new host". The consequences are seen the next day, when it bores out from the host, leaving the telltale white spots.
ReefKeeper2009
Member
I have had my 3.5 inch powder blue in my ninety for over 2 years. He is a great fish with tons of personality. However, I think this fish needs to be the last fish added as he seems to get stressed when new tank inhabitants are introduced. As for ich every once in awhile he will get a few spots but nothing major. Overall a very nice fish but not one for the beginner IMO.
jjstecchino
New member
Powder Blue Tang Aggression
My PBT health wise is doing very well. Never had ich, but I quarantine and treat every fish with quinine sulphate prior to introducing them into the DT. Eats everything you throw at him, flake food, frozen food, nori. He and the other fish eat straight from my hands. He is a very active fish, constantly peacefuly swimming and grazin from the rocks. A real pleasure to watch. He is about 2.5-3". The tank is 6"x2"x2" (180g). His tank mates were a 3.5" yellow tang, 6 line wrasse, 2 clown mated clowns and a diamond goby.
Interesting the yellow tank seems to be the most dominant of the two. Always eats first and when he is done, he let the PBT have the nori.
I am in the process of adding more fish and I realized I made a big mistake. I fully knew I should have added the PBT last but I thought that given his relatively small size he was not going to be too aggressive. BIG mistake!
Here is what happened:
I just finished quarantining my new batch of fish. A 6" blonde naso, a 4" scott's wrasse, 2 firefish and 2 gramma loreto, a scooter blenny and a banded goby.
I fed the fish on the DT, turned the lights off and all the fish, including the PBT went to their usual retreats. after a while I introduced the new fish.
As the PBT realized there were new tankmates he went ape ****. He started attacking the naso first. He arassed him for about an hour mainly with tail strikes. The naso is much bigger. As first the naso was afraid but then probably realized the PBT was not a real treat so he let him do the tail thinghy on him for a while longer until all of a sudden, like a switch thrown off the PBT stopped harassing him and now swim together like old buddies.
Now the problem are the oher fish. He does not like any of them other than the scooter blenny that was not bothered at all. He started chasing he firefish gobies and the grammas to one end of the tank to the other trying to bite them. These fish are as fast if not faster than he is so he really did not catch them, however put enough fear on them that they are now hiding inside the rock crevices and I have not seen them at all today.
He then started chasing the scott's wrasse who is not as fast. He got it a few times and almost kill him. The male scott should be an assertive fish and should be able to hold his own. I do not know if it is because he has been weakened by shipping and QT process or if he is not healthy to start with.
Anywhay since it is impossible to catch the PBT, I had to put the scott's wrasse in the refugium. Hopefully he will get stronger there and do ot jump out.
I do not know what to do at thes point. The PBT is a terror. Now that the scott's is out of the picture the PBT seems to be back to his usual self, scurrying around the tank and buddying with the naso and the yellow tang, however if he gets a glimpse of the firefish gobyes ot the grammas, he darts to them.
This fish will make stocking the tank a very difficult painful process. I wish I would have listened to my inner voice saying "don't do it", but the LFS had a very nice and healty looking specimen and I could not resist.
Any advice appreciated as usual
My PBT health wise is doing very well. Never had ich, but I quarantine and treat every fish with quinine sulphate prior to introducing them into the DT. Eats everything you throw at him, flake food, frozen food, nori. He and the other fish eat straight from my hands. He is a very active fish, constantly peacefuly swimming and grazin from the rocks. A real pleasure to watch. He is about 2.5-3". The tank is 6"x2"x2" (180g). His tank mates were a 3.5" yellow tang, 6 line wrasse, 2 clown mated clowns and a diamond goby.
Interesting the yellow tank seems to be the most dominant of the two. Always eats first and when he is done, he let the PBT have the nori.
I am in the process of adding more fish and I realized I made a big mistake. I fully knew I should have added the PBT last but I thought that given his relatively small size he was not going to be too aggressive. BIG mistake!
Here is what happened:
I just finished quarantining my new batch of fish. A 6" blonde naso, a 4" scott's wrasse, 2 firefish and 2 gramma loreto, a scooter blenny and a banded goby.
I fed the fish on the DT, turned the lights off and all the fish, including the PBT went to their usual retreats. after a while I introduced the new fish.
As the PBT realized there were new tankmates he went ape ****. He started attacking the naso first. He arassed him for about an hour mainly with tail strikes. The naso is much bigger. As first the naso was afraid but then probably realized the PBT was not a real treat so he let him do the tail thinghy on him for a while longer until all of a sudden, like a switch thrown off the PBT stopped harassing him and now swim together like old buddies.
Now the problem are the oher fish. He does not like any of them other than the scooter blenny that was not bothered at all. He started chasing he firefish gobies and the grammas to one end of the tank to the other trying to bite them. These fish are as fast if not faster than he is so he really did not catch them, however put enough fear on them that they are now hiding inside the rock crevices and I have not seen them at all today.
He then started chasing the scott's wrasse who is not as fast. He got it a few times and almost kill him. The male scott should be an assertive fish and should be able to hold his own. I do not know if it is because he has been weakened by shipping and QT process or if he is not healthy to start with.
Anywhay since it is impossible to catch the PBT, I had to put the scott's wrasse in the refugium. Hopefully he will get stronger there and do ot jump out.
I do not know what to do at thes point. The PBT is a terror. Now that the scott's is out of the picture the PBT seems to be back to his usual self, scurrying around the tank and buddying with the naso and the yellow tang, however if he gets a glimpse of the firefish gobyes ot the grammas, he darts to them.
This fish will make stocking the tank a very difficult painful process. I wish I would have listened to my inner voice saying "don't do it", but the LFS had a very nice and healty looking specimen and I could not resist.
Any advice appreciated as usual
ReefKeeper2009
Member
Powder blues IMO should be the last fish added. I am learning this through my experiences right now. Jjstecchino your probably going to have to do one of two things, either don't add anymore fish to your tank or you might have to replace your PBT. IMO whats going to happen is that your PBT will get stressed from chasing the other fish and sooner or later she will get ich. For some reason they love to chase fire fish, gobies, wrasses, and damsels.
jjstecchino
New member
I read a lot on the PBT as I started considering it. I did not read about chasing fire fish, gobies wrasses and damsels in particular, but my experience at this point is exactly what you are describing. Unless I try with a trap it is going to be impossible to get it out.
He has calmed down a lot in his behaviour now that the Scott's is out of the picture, however the fire fish are hiding and make only occasional appearance.
I am going to try to introduce the Scott's back in a week or two, this time in a transparent box inside the tank, so that he can be seen but not harmed. I'll try that and see what happens first.
None of my fish has ever had ich in the DT. All have been quarantined and treated for ich with quinine prior to introduction. I hope I have a ich free DT but you never know.
What did you do with your PBT?
Thanks for your help. I
I just picked up a 3.5 - 4" specimen yesterday from a LFS. It looked very healthy and was eating flake food at the LFS. I had a choice of 3 pbt's to choose from and picked a medium sized one. His fins were perfect, his body coloration was a good deep powder blue and not the pale, near white look that so many doomed PBTs have.
Trouble is, after putting him in my tank, I noticed about 5 hrs later that he had white spots/pimples on his body. He was not like this at the store nor did he have those while in the bag being acclimated.
I know these fish are ick magnets but can ick just appear like that in a few hours? Should I be concerned or simply feed with garlic extract soaked nori? I've heard they stress easily and get ick as a result....I suppose this is what happened. He is eating as of 2 hrs after being in the tank and appears very healthy, fins errect and roaming around exploring his tank.
Any advice? The tank is a 180 standard 6'x2'x2' with tons of flow. Approximately 67 times turn over. Huge skimmer and water parameters are excellent. He is the only big fish in the tank. Rest are chromis and 1 six-line.
Trouble is, after putting him in my tank, I noticed about 5 hrs later that he had white spots/pimples on his body. He was not like this at the store nor did he have those while in the bag being acclimated.
I know these fish are ick magnets but can ick just appear like that in a few hours? Should I be concerned or simply feed with garlic extract soaked nori? I've heard they stress easily and get ick as a result....I suppose this is what happened. He is eating as of 2 hrs after being in the tank and appears very healthy, fins errect and roaming around exploring his tank.
Any advice? The tank is a 180 standard 6'x2'x2' with tons of flow. Approximately 67 times turn over. Huge skimmer and water parameters are excellent. He is the only big fish in the tank. Rest are chromis and 1 six-line.
jjstecchino
New member
THP you should not have put the PBT straight to your large display tank. Yes it is possible for a fish to develop ich spots just a few hours after being introduced, however make sure it is indeed ich. Sometime fine sand grains can stick especially to the front lateral fins and this can be interpreted as ich, so make sure before you do anything.
Keep in mind that ich is not a psychosomatic disease just caused by stress. In order to get ich either the fish has to be a carrier or there has to be cryptocaryon irritans in your tank. A carrier fish is one who has a stronger enough immune system to keep ich as a colonizing organism rather than causing clinical infection and death or a fish who has been kept on suboptimal concentration of copper, enough to keep ich from showing but not enough to kill it.
I believe that most fish at the LFS belong to this second category and it is reasonable to assume that most of the LFS tanks have ich (an LFS has an almost sure chance of receiving a fish with ich and running their system fallow for the 4 weeks necessary to treat ich would be highly impractical and treat all tanks with high dose copper would be expensive and impractical as well since delicate fish will have a low tolerance to copper.)
Given these premises the burden of preventing ich is on you and you do that with proper quarantining. You have a large tank and QT is easy and very little stressful for the fish if properly done. You use water from you main display and keeping good water quality on the QT tank is like doing more frequent water changes in your display for a while. Once you spend several thousands of dollars for your system investing a hundred dollars on a QT is cheap, and this is in addition to the moral obligation we owe to the animals we chose to keep.
At this point if you indeed have ich you can follow one of two avenues:
1) Keep the fish in, feed well and if you are lucky he may recover from ich. Ich however will remain in your DT and the PBT as well as any other fish new or old will be at some point getting ich when stressed and possibly cause the entire fish population getting ill and die. This tanks are all to common and usually when you hear arguments against quarantining (such as "I quarantined my new fish for 4 weeks, he was as healthy as it could be but as I introduced it in the DT he showed ich" , the usual conclusion is that quarantine is useless). Proponent of this kind of argument usually have one of these tanks ridden with ich.
2) second option which I would favor especially since you do not have many fish in at this point, is to take ALL the fish out. Place them in a QT/Hospital tank. Run your display fallow for 4-6 weeks, treat the fish in the hospital tank with the proper medication and then reintroduce them on the now ich free tank.
After this effort observe proper quarantining for anything you put in the tank. As much as possible consider that anything wet can carry crypto and act consequently.
As far as proper medications I tried cupramine in the past but I found it was quite stressful to the fish at the recommended dose confirmed by Cu test. It kills almost completely the biologic filter in the QT and water quality becomes a real issue unless you do daily or twice a day water changes with cupramine addition and testing. A real pain in the butt and very stressful to you and the fish.
Quinine Sulfate is as, if not, more effective than copper for treating ich.
Quinine works not only on the floating tomites but in my opinion also on the attached trophont (the grain of salt on the fish) since as the fish has been exposed to quinine the grain of salt disappear within a few hours to a day leaving a small pit in its place. I do not know if quinine works on the protomont ot tomont phase of ich it may or may not. I have not read any study on that. And I wish a study on this topic would come out since a medication surely effective on all 4 pases of ich would definitely simplify and reduce the length of treatment.
Quinine is much better tolerated by the fish and keeps your biologic filter intact since it is strictly an anti-protozoan (it is used for human malaria treatment) which does not kill bacteria, whereas copper is a wide spectrum germicidal that kills almost everything
Is quinine reef safe? The standard answer is no, however the truth is "dont know". There are anecdotal posts of people who have used quinine in their stocked reef without ill effects. More investigation on the topic is needed.
Good luck
Thanks for the detailed info. I know I should have quarantined but don't have a quarantine tank. I have also read that these fish do show signs of what appears to be ick and then suddenly look fine again with the issue never returning. Not sure how true that is but I will assess further tonight when I inspect him.
The spots look like pimples on the blue part of the skin. Probably 5-6 per side which definately were not there a few hrs before nor were they ever there in the past 2 weeks of observing him near daily at the LFS. I'm going to feed nori soaked in garlic extract tonight and will keep an eye on him. If the problem appears to worsen or simply remains I will have to look at setting up a quarantine. Trouble is, with quarantines, one can never get a tank big enough and make it worthwill without spending nearly as much as the display.
jjstecchino
New member
You dont need a huge or very complex system for a QT. I use a 20g long tank and this will be ok for most but the very large fish. I QT a 6"+ naso tang and several smaller fish at the same time and they did just fine. This tank can be had from petco or similar stores for about 20 bucks. You need also an hang on filter, I use a marineland penguin 350 ($50) and a small heater. That's all it is needed. Keep it simple. If you keep the filters on your sump for a few days prior to using the QT the tank wll be instantly cycled.
So*Cal Reefdude
New member
when i got my PBT i added it straight to my DT. i took the risk because i thought it would be easier on it. it was fine until i had to remove a trigger because it was spitting sand everywhere. this was about 3 days after adding the PBT. i had to move all my rocks to get it out. I noticed the PBT got several ick spots and just fed huffa & garlic soaked nori heavily for a few days. the spots went away and haven't seen any since.
IFbettas
New member
I got lucky and ended up with a really mellow powder blue. This is probably because he is the smallest tang in the tank. Contrary to most people's experiences, whenever a new fish is added or I walk up to the tank too fast he is the first fish to go into the rocks. I'm hoping he will get bolder with age. I've already had him for 6 months too.
Well, my pbt is doing fine now and the spots seem to have disapeared. He is eating well however I can't seem to get him to eat any vegi food. He seems to prefer Omega1 flakes.
I tried soaking a sheet of nori in garlic extract and placing in the tank with a vegi clip but he never touches it. I then tried breaking up the nori and mixing with Omega1 flakes. He ate a few but soon realized the difference and selectivly picked the Omega1 flakes.
Will this be a problem? He is a herbivor so I'm concerned that he is not getting enough vegitation to eat. What else could I try? I tried a spirulina flake (I think it's Omega2 but not sure) and he has 0 interest in that.
I tried soaking a sheet of nori in garlic extract and placing in the tank with a vegi clip but he never touches it. I then tried breaking up the nori and mixing with Omega1 flakes. He ate a few but soon realized the difference and selectivly picked the Omega1 flakes.
Will this be a problem? He is a herbivor so I'm concerned that he is not getting enough vegitation to eat. What else could I try? I tried a spirulina flake (I think it's Omega2 but not sure) and he has 0 interest in that.
jjstecchino
New member
I would not be so concerned at this point on what he eats. If he likes flakes so be it as far as he is eating. As he will get more established he is likely to sample different foods, especially if you have other tangs eating nori at some point he will not want to be left out and he'll eat that too.
They have a mind of their own and sometimes they like to do different from what WE think is best.
They have a mind of their own and sometimes they like to do different from what WE think is best.
Well, that puts my mind at ease to some extent. I don't have any other tangs and don't plan on putting any others in.
What other tasty options are there out there that you would recommend as a food for a PBT. Aside from Nori, Omega1/2 flake? Maybe I can try different things and find some other food he'll take.
jjstecchino
New member
Mine eats everything you throw at him. Flake food, Frozen food, nori, grass from rocks, he even scrape the tank glass for pods. He has been in the tank for 4 months now. At the beginning he was a shy eater, now he sees the other fish and does not want to miss out on anything. I think he learned from the 6 line wrasse how to hunt for pods.
As frozen food goes I use different types that I rotate every day: Blood Worms, Spirulina loaded Brine Shrimp, Mysid shrimps, cyclop-eeze frozen squid, chopped clams, chopped shrimp.
As frozen food goes I use different types that I rotate every day: Blood Worms, Spirulina loaded Brine Shrimp, Mysid shrimps, cyclop-eeze frozen squid, chopped clams, chopped shrimp.
