Questions about bacteria, an experiment.

[ivans75]

Guys, I am no scientist but I do love trying some new stuff from whatever I can find interesting.

I came across this product that contains probiotic bacteria strains as follow:
1. Lactobacillus
2. Sacharomyces
3. Acentobacter
4. Bacillus.

This product is actually designed to clean septic tank, removes bad odor in toilet, kill some bad bacteria (typhus, dysentri, cholera) in 500 ml bottle. It doesnt contain chemicals or preservative and it has to be used the whole lot in the toilet or it will go off.

Now pardon the "yuckiness", I am just curious, can we use the bacteria in this product to act as phosphate and nitrate remover? And would it really go off once I open the sealed bottle even if I put it in a fridge?

If this can increase phosphate/nitrate consumin bacteria population, I can say goodbye to the more expensive products that I am using such as N-P bio pellets or prodibio bio digest.

I know there's another post about using letuce as bacteria food source, but I thought I'll start another one as the strains of the bacteria here are noted.

Your thoughts please...

 

[Lemeshianos]

From wikipedia:
Lactobacillus will break down lactoze and other sugars to lactic acid.(good for the tank)

Sacharomyces breaks down sugars again.(good for the tabk)

In general, Acinetobacter species are considered nonpathogenic to healthy individuals. However, several species persist in hospital environments and cause severe, life-threatening infections in compromised patients. The spectrum of antibiotic resistances of these organisms together with their survival capabilities make them a threat to hospitals, as documented by recurring outbreaks both in highly developed countries and elsewhere. An important factor for their pathogenic potential is, it is presumed, an efficient means of horizontal gene transfer.

Bacillus has some strains that are pathogen for insects and others for people(food) but there is a number that breaks down food(good for the tank)


Given the last two bacteria strains, I would keep the bottle away from the tank. Assuming that there isn't any bacteria strain that could be harmful to humans, there could be a pathogenic bacteria to insects and we don't know how it will affect the invertebrates in the tank.

 

[victor_c3]

Given the last two bacteria strains, I would keep the bottle away from the tank. Assuming that there isn't any bacteria strain that could be harmful to humans, there could be a pathogenic bacteria to insects and we don't know how it will affect the invertebrates in the tank.

As I was reading your post, that same thought went through my head. As you suggest, I'd also recommend keeping this stuff away because of the unknown affect on the tank's invertebrates.

 

[ivans75]

Thank you, make sense. But let's see what others might say.

On the bottle it also says that it can make the well water cleaner as it purify the surounding soil from possible contamination of septic tank.

Is there anyway to test this product outside the tank, in a small tank perhaps with LR and no skimmer just a power head running?

 

[ivans75]

Also it does say eco friendly...would that mean the strains of Acetobacter and bacillus would be those harmless to any living being...including corals.

it says non poisonous, will not irritate skin, also it says somewhere on the bottle: safe, practical, economical and healthy...not healthy to drink I suppose lol but I think it meant to say healthy environment/well water.

 

[jdegrasse]

Bacteria are specifically pathogenic. That is to say that those bacteria which infect humans don't infect other species and vice versa. Salmonella lives harmlessly among certain farm animals, but wreak havoc on humans.

I don't think those bacteria would infect the tank and cause disease.

Would they be effective? Probably not. Those bacteria are not evolved to thrive in saltwater. The septic tank is so different than the tank in terms of food and physical environment. They would survive, but my guess is that they will not grow in a fashion that would affect nutrient levels.

The lettuce idea is intriguing because one is introducing bacteria and a food source. So you could introduce the food source for these bacteria as well.

 

[ivans75]

Bacteria are specifically pathogenic. That is to say that those bacteria which infect humans don't infect other species and vice versa. Salmonella lives harmlessly among certain farm animals, but wreak havoc on humans.

I don't think those bacteria would infect the tank and cause disease.

Would they be effective? Probably not. Those bacteria are not evolved to thrive in saltwater. The septic tank is so different than the tank in terms of food and physical environment. They would survive, but my guess is that they will not grow in a fashion that would affect nutrient levels.

The lettuce idea is intriguing because one is introducing bacteria and a food source. So you could introduce the food source for these bacteria as well.

Thank you...yeah I am trying lettuce as well as we speak now.

 

[disc1]

I'm not sure that those bacteria can live well in salt water. Also beware that many Bacillis species produce natural antibiotics that may have a detrimental effect on the other bacteria in your tank.

I would want to do some research on the species there before I put it in my tank. Not all bacteria are created equal, and just because something is eco-friendly doesn't mean it won't wreak havoc in a closed system like a fish tank.

 

[disc1]

I can't find anything on Lactobacillus and salt right off hand. But I do know that it likes to grow under slightly acidic conditions. I also know that when you grow it it causes the pH of the media to drop.

Sachromyces isn't a bacterium, it's a yeast. That's what you use to make beer or bread.

Acinetobacter is ubiquitous. What I mean is, any salt water tolerant forms are more than likely already in your tank at equilibrium populations. There's no need to add more bacteria.

Bacillus is a big category.


What are you looking to get out of this? A larger population of bacteria to skim out? Or a larger biodiversity? All of those things can find their way in on their own, you don't need to add it.

Another note about how nitrate and phosphate reduction works with bacteria that may cause you to reconsider. The removal of NO3 and PO4 comes from adding a carbon source and skimming the bacteria out. The nitrate isn't eaten up by or somehow disposed of by the bacteria. They just multiply, and their little bodies contain the nitrate. When you skim them out, you remove the nitrate, not the bacteria.

So if you add a bunch of random bacteria into the tank, now they live there too. Bacteria will only grow to a certain population and then stop. If you add bacteria (which contain nitrate and phosphate) into the tank, and then skim those same bacteria out, you haven't done anything. Worse yet, if they die off you have added nitrate and phosphate to your tank.

Using bacteria to clean up your water isn't about adding bacteria. It's about growing what you have and taking it out. The same idea as using macro algae.


The exception would be the bacteria that grow in the anoxic zones that do consume nitrate for energy. Those bacteria reduce nitrate on their own. But none of the listed bacteria fall into this category.

 

[ivans75]

I can't find anything on Lactobacillus and salt right off hand. But I do know that it likes to grow under slightly acidic conditions. I also know that when you grow it it causes the pH of the media to drop.

Sachromyces isn't a bacterium, it's a yeast. That's what you use to make beer or bread.

Acinetobacter is ubiquitous. What I mean is, any salt water tolerant forms are more than likely already in your tank at equilibrium populations. There's no need to add more bacteria.

Bacillus is a big category.


What are you looking to get out of this? A larger population of bacteria to skim out? Or a larger biodiversity? All of those things can find their way in on their own, you don't need to add it.

Another note about how nitrate and phosphate reduction works with bacteria that may cause you to reconsider. The removal of NO3 and PO4 comes from adding a carbon source and skimming the bacteria out. The nitrate isn't eaten up by or somehow disposed of by the bacteria. They just multiply, and their little bodies contain the nitrate. When you skim them out, you remove the nitrate, not the bacteria.

So if you add a bunch of random bacteria into the tank, now they live there too. Bacteria will only grow to a certain population and then stop. If you add bacteria (which contain nitrate and phosphate) into the tank, and then skim those same bacteria out, you haven't done anything. Worse yet, if they die off you have added nitrate and phosphate to your tank.

Using bacteria to clean up your water isn't about adding bacteria. It's about growing what you have and taking it out. The same idea as using macro algae.


The exception would be the bacteria that grow in the anoxic zones that do consume nitrate for energy. Those bacteria reduce nitrate on their own. But none of the listed bacteria fall into this category.

Hmmm makes sense thanks very much,,,was thinking of reducing my no3 and po4 with these bacteria strains