ReefKeeper vs Apex

[Dr. Reef]

another update:
i have 6 AI Sol blues. also have the vdm and Ai cable. Beig new to Apex i read up and made some profiles and programmed the outlets. well its wasnt working correctly so i emailed Neptune on sat. on Sunday i had a reply back with detail steps and exact programming details.
Paul almost wrote the whole program for me customized to my needs and timings.
That is some excellent customer service along with an excellent product.

 

[Mr.Mustang]

I have to put in kudos as well for their customer support as I had issues with my base unit and after some emails back and forth was fixed with an RMA. Also had a separate issue with a firm ware update later on and Neptune got back to me with a fix over the weekend.

 

[RKLion]

I have an Apex full system.... Works well... Really like it .... Great CS(Paul helped me too...many times lol)... Recommend it highly

 

[yachtdr22]

Here is my story on this question. FWIW

I had the RKL. I thought it was a nice piece of equipment and did a good job, and did, everything it was supposed to do.

I heard about the Apex, and that it could control my vortechs, changing the mode and percentage throughout the day and night, and I thought that was a great idea.

I checked out the DA forum and found that the RKs couldn't control the vortechs. I asked on the DA forum, and found that there was no date for when this would be available. I pressed further, and I was told that DA had missed so many dates in the past that they didn't give out time frames for such things any longer. I politlely expressed my disappointment in their company for deciding to stop trying instead of deciding to get better at it. I got no response, and gave up.

I sold my RKL used, and bought a new Apex, and I have been very pleased since.

I am interested in the new Vertex, when it's released, though...I love the gadgets.

DITTO! DITTO! DITTO!!
Looks like I am going to have a RKL+ for sale shortly.... goin Apex!

 

[The Grim Reefer]

I wonder how much money this single thread has cost Digital Aquatics.

 

[Tickle]

All in all i think they are about a horse a piece. Rkl can control tunze pumps,the apex vortech. They both have probs for temp ph and other things. I went with the rkl because of the power strips being more compact and it would fit my cabinet better.

the phone in my hands

 

[Dr. Reef]

Dont take me wrong, both units have some advantages and some drawbacks. but all in all being owner and operating both units now for months side by side, its hard to explain but with apex i find myself not double checking all the probes or modules or double questioning its readings and i feel like its a true auto pilot situation. while with RKE i have to go back and check and double check its probe readings and calibrate them often, and i just dont get a good sense of security with RKE like i do with Apex. i hope that helps.

 

[yachtdr22]

Dont take me wrong, both units have some advantages and some drawbacks. but all in all being owner and operating both units now for months side by side, its hard to explain but with apex i find myself not double checking all the probes or modules or double questioning its readings and i feel like its a true auto pilot situation. while with RKE i have to go back and check and double check its probe readings and calibrate them often, and i just dont get a good sense of security with RKE like i do with Apex. i hope that helps.

I ordered a Apex system yesterday... decided against upgrading RKL to RKE to support modules...
What did you not like about the Apex unit? I know there are Pro's & Con's with anything, but I am curious so I am not surprised later.

thanks
Drew

 

[James77]

For me negatives about the Apex:

Display. I do like RK head units for the color change and slightly better looking.

Buss cable. The USB work fine, but finder longer runs of the data cables like RK uses are easier and cheaper.

Package power strip. I do like the RK coming with 2 4-outlet strips each with 2 relays. But the other 2 channels on the PC4 suck since they only handle 3 amps. Plus the Neptune 4 strip outlet has 4 relays.

Even with that, the Apex is still infinitely better than digital aquatics. Programming is better, more reliable. If you ever do need service, you know it's there.

 

[Dr. Reef]

All that James said is pretty much i dont like about Apex. mostly the 8 outlet strip. i like to plug all my strips to dedicated 110v outlets and with 8 things on 1 outlet is the idea i dont like.

 

[adamk22]

I am happy to answer your questions. I have had the RKE for over 3 years, so I will just cover a few of the issues.

1) Errors in pH readings when more than one SL1 is used (engineering problem where the SL1 lacks galvanic isolation)
2) Modules getting 'lost' (PC4s and other modules would randomly disappear)
3) Headunit failure (the headunit would freak out and just go blank)
4) Lost communication with the Net module (plus the email bombing that would occur when an alarm went off)
5) Having to reflash modules a few times for the firmware to take
6) The fact that the SL2 was out for over a year before a working Salinity probe was even close to being produced.
7) The 1+ year long saga for those who owned said un-functional salinity probes.
8) I have had my RK systems stick with outlets on/off as well
9) Lighting issues with the lights rapidly turning on/off due to electrical interference with temp probe readings.

These are just a few off the top of my head, without even considering the horrible customer service, lying, censorship, and plain rudeness on the part of DA. I am also not even mentioning how DA is consistently behind in releasing modules and features for their controller as well.

I don't mean to come off harsh here. I am glad you like your choice, but for many more, and especially those who have owned both, the general consensus always appears to be the Apex.

Hope this helps,
Landon

I'm with Shard. He hit the nail on the head.
I have RKE for 7 months and I have experienced issues 1,2,4,5 and 8.
Words cannot express how POOR their support is. Dropping DA, getting an APEX.

 

[yachtdr22]

I guess i should feel fortunate that I have not had any performance issues with any of my 7 month old RKL. I have not really had much issue with Customer service and had called a few times with various questions.. phone was answered, questions answered.. So i guess I am lucky that way....

I will say that for the last few weeks of reading and re-reading... email to both DA and Nep. it just seemed like Paul wanted to help and went out of his way to do so... even when I originally decided to stay with the RK......

I just downloaded the unofficial guide, so i have some reading / prep work to do...
I have to try to find the thread about programming for Vortech ...

on a really happy note... my swimmers in the QT get to go into the DT... 15 weeks Fallow!!!
:celeb1::lol2:

 

[Pool_shark]

Hello all, first post... :wave:

I am making my controller decision right now, and this thread made it quite simple, my money is going to Neptune. Thanks to all for your contributions and information!

 

[Dr. Reef]

The few major problems that i have faced in last 8 months or so of comparing both systems side by side are as follows.
(rk owned for 7yrs, Apex 8months)

Only bad thing i have against Apex is the 8 outlet strip. they do have 4 outlet strips now but does not come with the package, has to be purchased extra.
Choosing display background color choice is also not present in Apex. which to me is not a big deal.
Problems with rk:
1. Errors in pH readings. it swings off every few weeks to a month. needs calibrating quiet often. Apex ph probe has been pretty steady since i got it 8 months ago and only calibrated once at purchase.
2. modules do get lost every now and then in rk, no such issue with apex.
3. communication errors in rk are common, no issue in Apex so far in 8 months.
4. Firmware needed to be loaded few times before really taking it on the module, happened on both units RK and Apex.
5. Salinity probe on RK is a joke and is on recall for replacements as new version becomes available. Conductivity probe on apex doesnt have any issues so far.
6. I own 6 AI sol blues and with RK to control then u have to splice the wires and make patches to have it work with RK, (a technical procedure for people that dont wanna cut open wires) with Apex its a standard cable..

 

[adamk22]

Best decision I have ever made.
Apex has much greater flexibility, stability and speed (net module vs apex embedded web server). Every Apex feature (in my experience so far) is either equal to or better than the Reefkeeper - or MUCH better.
You get out of it what you put in. You can use the Apex wizards to easily setup the basics. If you want to take it further, the programming capabilities are endless. It may seem intimidating at first, but as programming anything goes, this is about as easy as it gets.
Just give both the official and unofficial manuals a good read - you will be referencing them in the beginning.
One final piece of evidence why Neptune wins this battle: They are constantly developing their product, adding new features, and creating modules to control other equipment (like my Vortech).
Digital Aquatics can't make a conductivity probe and rarely updates (or fixes) their already broken product.

 

[yachtdr22]

Best decision I have ever made.
Apex has much greater flexibility, stability and speed (net module vs apex embedded web server). Every Apex feature (in my experience so far) is either equal to or better than the Reefkeeper - or MUCH better.
You get out of it what you put in. You can use the Apex wizards to easily setup the basics. If you want to take it further, the programming capabilities are endless. It may seem intimidating at first, but as programming anything goes, this is about as easy as it gets.
Just give both the official and unofficial manuals a good read - you will be referencing them in the beginning.
One final piece of evidence why Neptune wins this battle: They are constantly developing their product, adding new features, and creating modules to control other equipment (like my Vortech).
Digital Aquatics can't make a conductivity probe and rarely updates (or fixes) their already broken product.

I just finished my conversion from RKL to Apex...
DITTO! DITTO!! DITTO!!!!

Worth every penny!!:bounce2:

 

[jcmelski]

I have a RKE, net module, 2 pc4's, moon light module, and a sl2 with a temp, ph, and salinity probes.Let me just say I've had issues with the ph probe and salinity probes. Once I woke up and my tank was dead, the only thing working was my skimmer and it was overflowing since my return shut off. The RKE had errors out the whazoo!!!!! I had to do a factory reset, then disconnect everything just to update each individual module. This was at 7 am after getting home from working a nightshift at 5:30am! Right now my PH reads 3 and my salinity probes reads error! BTW I had to wait over a year for it! I'm giving DA till next yr to fix their SL2 issue and salinity probe problems otherwise I'm getting an APEX! I might get the Apex anyway since I can't stand having to disconnect each module to update. I have everything underneath my tank and its not so easy.

 

[James77]

I'm giving DA till next yr to fix their SL2 issue and salinity probe problems otherwise I'm getting an APEX! I might get the Apex anyway since I can't stand having to disconnect each module to update. I have everything underneath my tank and its not so easy.

They still haven't fixed the salinity probe problem?!!!

Last I heard they were shipping them out...not sure if that was early this year or last year. What is the SL2 issue exactly?

 

[rogergolf66]

I have a RKE, net module, 2 pc4's, moon light module, and a sl2 with a temp, ph, and salinity probes.Let me just say I've had issues with the ph probe and salinity probes. Once I woke up and my tank was dead, the only thing working was my skimmer and it was overflowing since my return shut off. The RKE had errors out the whazoo!!!!! I had to do a factory reset, then disconnect everything just to update each individual module. This was at 7 am after getting home from working a nightshift at 5:30am! Right now my PH reads 3 and my salinity probes reads error! BTW I had to wait over a year for it! I'm giving DA till next yr to fix their SL2 issue and salinity probe problems otherwise I'm getting an APEX! I might get the Apex anyway since I can't stand having to disconnect each module to update. I have everything underneath my tank and its not so easy.

they all have there issues its not just RK. my apex is about 3-4 months old at most and have had to call paul 4 times so far. make it 5 times because my unit is out again as of tonight. the customer service is good with Neptune but well I can't speak for the RK but all I have had is problems with my apex. so far 2 thumbs down for apex product. thumbs up for apex support.

 

[James77]

they all have there issues its not just RK. my apex is about 3-4 months old at most and have had to call paul 4 times so far. make it 5 times because my unit is out again as of tonight. the customer service is good with Neptune but well I can't speak for the RK but all I have had is problems with my apex. so far 2 thumbs down for apex product. thumbs up for apex support.

Whats going on with it?