Refugium tips (formerly "flow rate thorugh a refugium")
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Aquarist007
New member
alot of great information here---I will link it to this thread which although more uptodate will certainly benifit from the info here:
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1349443
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1349443
bergzy
New member
the blue barrel contains about 300 pounds of live rock:
it is used for a cryptic zone wher there is a slowish water flow through it via the 5g white bucket which contains growing chaeto lit by a 65w lights of america fixture.
video of bucket with spinning chaeto:
the bucket drains to the bottom of the blue barrel via a long length of pvc and flows upward to drain. thus, this gives it a fluidized flow to prevent stagnation of water at the bottom of the barrel. i also use some air to circulate water from the bottom to top. the water in the blue barrel then drains near the top and into my sump.
thus, no moving impellers to chop up anything and the flow is gentle enough to encourage the growth of sponges and tunicates.
the ball of chaeto in the video is much larger than i normally keep it as i was growing it out to give to local reefers. normally, i keep it trimmed to a softball size. plus, it is cooler to see in the video to see a big ball of chaeto spinning.
the white bucket is fueled by the excess bled off the over powered pump i use for my skimmer.
chaeto growth is very slow now which indicates that my phosphates and then my nitrates are very low.
this set up is on my 180g sps. i highly do not recommend running a dedicated sps tank skimmerless. i have had excellent results with skimmerless tanks when running lps and softies with a effective and efficient fuge growing chaeto...but with sps, any kind of nutrient affects them...and the macro doesnt soak up nutrients fast enough.
i also do not intentionally grow pods etc in my fuges. there seems to be enough of them as my mandarin is very happy as is my corals.
some of the refugium set ups would qualify as displays imo. but for me, my fuges are not meat to be looked at. they are for pure function. hence the utilitarian use of low cost and unaesthetic materials.
it is used for a cryptic zone wher there is a slowish water flow through it via the 5g white bucket which contains growing chaeto lit by a 65w lights of america fixture.
video of bucket with spinning chaeto:
the bucket drains to the bottom of the blue barrel via a long length of pvc and flows upward to drain. thus, this gives it a fluidized flow to prevent stagnation of water at the bottom of the barrel. i also use some air to circulate water from the bottom to top. the water in the blue barrel then drains near the top and into my sump.
thus, no moving impellers to chop up anything and the flow is gentle enough to encourage the growth of sponges and tunicates.
the ball of chaeto in the video is much larger than i normally keep it as i was growing it out to give to local reefers. normally, i keep it trimmed to a softball size. plus, it is cooler to see in the video to see a big ball of chaeto spinning.
the white bucket is fueled by the excess bled off the over powered pump i use for my skimmer.
chaeto growth is very slow now which indicates that my phosphates and then my nitrates are very low.
this set up is on my 180g sps. i highly do not recommend running a dedicated sps tank skimmerless. i have had excellent results with skimmerless tanks when running lps and softies with a effective and efficient fuge growing chaeto...but with sps, any kind of nutrient affects them...and the macro doesnt soak up nutrients fast enough.
i also do not intentionally grow pods etc in my fuges. there seems to be enough of them as my mandarin is very happy as is my corals.
some of the refugium set ups would qualify as displays imo. but for me, my fuges are not meat to be looked at. they are for pure function. hence the utilitarian use of low cost and unaesthetic materials.
Aquarist007
New member
this is great--would you mind posting it on the other site--alot of guys will be interested in it
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1349443
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1349443
Young Frankenstein
New member
The air bubbler part, I thing that works as well as MH, I have a 10gl refurgium with chaeto outdoors (shaded area) with a bubbler, indoors I have a 20gl with low flow also, but no bubbler+100w MH about 6k, I think the air bubbler works great, but how do you stop the bubbles from throwing salt all over the place?
tntneon
SPSahollic
hello reefers,
-would it be a good idea to let the water comming from main display tank to pass at the bottom of refugium upwards trough soil , roots and leafs of the macro algea.
-this to have an evenly flow , and a great surface area for the macro algea to extract the nutrients from the watercolum and combining the filtering capacities of a undergravel filter.
p.s. sorry for my kindergarden englisch ,but i'm from the netherlands ,
soo far away from the u.s.a. or coralreefs
greetingzz tntneon
-would it be a good idea to let the water comming from main display tank to pass at the bottom of refugium upwards trough soil , roots and leafs of the macro algea.
-this to have an evenly flow , and a great surface area for the macro algea to extract the nutrients from the watercolum and combining the filtering capacities of a undergravel filter.
p.s. sorry for my kindergarden englisch ,but i'm from the netherlands ,
soo far away from the u.s.a. or coralreefs
greetingzz tntneon
bergzy
New member
hello and welcome to reef central!!!
i hope that reefing is alive and well in the netherlands!
your description sounds like you are wanting to utilize reverse flow undergravel filter.
it has been a while since i did freshwater but i think that this is/was a popular concept in freshwater or freshwater planted tanks (popular in the netherlands, yes?).
i would hesitate in using a regular undergravel or reverse undergravel as it will literally suck up detritus into the gravel only to have it eventually break down into nitrates (high flow of oxygenated water).
yes, while the macro will soak up nitrates upon the conversion...the idea is usually to limit nitrate production to as little as possible. nitrate removal is done with a host of methods from water changes, denitrators, protein skimming and macro growth (with harvesting it).
the water flow through the substrate will also not allow an anaerobic zone to develop. this is also where nitrates can be broken down to nitrogen gas via anaerobic bacteria (if your sand bed is deep enough).
most reefers will flow raw tank water across the macro for nutrient exposure.
if you have read through this entire thread...you may have noticed that calfo has suggested random alternating flow that is far from slow.
my fuges flow range from 120x to 150x per hour turnover...with excellent chaeto growth.
hope this helps a little. feel free to ask me anything else! and welcome to reef central!!!
i hope that reefing is alive and well in the netherlands!
your description sounds like you are wanting to utilize reverse flow undergravel filter.
it has been a while since i did freshwater but i think that this is/was a popular concept in freshwater or freshwater planted tanks (popular in the netherlands, yes?).
i would hesitate in using a regular undergravel or reverse undergravel as it will literally suck up detritus into the gravel only to have it eventually break down into nitrates (high flow of oxygenated water).
yes, while the macro will soak up nitrates upon the conversion...the idea is usually to limit nitrate production to as little as possible. nitrate removal is done with a host of methods from water changes, denitrators, protein skimming and macro growth (with harvesting it).
the water flow through the substrate will also not allow an anaerobic zone to develop. this is also where nitrates can be broken down to nitrogen gas via anaerobic bacteria (if your sand bed is deep enough).
most reefers will flow raw tank water across the macro for nutrient exposure.
if you have read through this entire thread...you may have noticed that calfo has suggested random alternating flow that is far from slow.
my fuges flow range from 120x to 150x per hour turnover...with excellent chaeto growth.
hope this helps a little. feel free to ask me anything else! and welcome to reef central!!!
Aquarist007
New member
[welcome]
I am agreeing with Ben but the trade off with this high flow through the refugiums is that it will carry away your inverts very quickly to the display tank and thus make it more difficult to raise a substantial number there---one of the other functions of a refugium
I have found the best senerio for nitrate reduction to be two refugiums--one for macro algae and one with a deep sand bed.
there are a number of articles on my Log book that discuss and illustrate this:
http://www.reefcentral.com/wp/?p=346
tntneon
SPSahollic
thank you guys,
-in the netherlands we have manny freshwater aquariums, reef aquariums is beginning to get more populair now.
but the quality of reef aquariums i`ve seen here just blows my mind.
that is just what i needed to inspire me to built my own little reef ,
therefore i`m now orienting what sort off refugium and sump set up i`m gonna use , it`s gonna be 75g display tank to start with ,this will probably grow with time and patience [wife ].
p.s. please excuse my kindergarden englisch
greetingzz tntneon
-in the netherlands we have manny freshwater aquariums, reef aquariums is beginning to get more populair now.
but the quality of reef aquariums i`ve seen here just blows my mind.
that is just what i needed to inspire me to built my own little reef ,
therefore i`m now orienting what sort off refugium and sump set up i`m gonna use , it`s gonna be 75g display tank
to start with ,this will probably grow with time and patience [wife ].p.s. please excuse my kindergarden englisch
greetingzz tntneon
pjf
Premium Member
The following suspended chaetomorpha refugium design accomodates a ~1000 gph flow. The current flowing under the first baffle suspends the algae against the PC light. Only a mesh screen keeps the algae from being swept into the return compartment.
The chaetomorpha grows quickly and acts as a mechanical filter. It traps detritus and is rinsed clean during water changes.
Needless to say, the current keeps the bare bottom refugium compartment clean and would obliterate a sand bed.
Aquarist007
New member
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13299045#post13299045 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by pjf
The following suspended chaetomorpha refugium design accomodates a ~1000 gph flow. The current flowing under the first baffle suspends the algae against the PC light. Only a mesh screen keeps the algae from being swept into the return compartment.
The chaetomorpha grows quickly and acts as a mechanical filter. It traps detritus and is rinsed clean during water changes.
Needless to say, the current keeps the bare bottom refugium compartment clean and would obliterate a sand bed.
that's an excellent way of doing it--alot of reefers are running deep sand beds as a refugium and another refugium as just straight macro algae like chaeto.
das75
New member
I'm doing the BB type as well but with LR for the critters and extra filtration (fr the LR).
Display is also BB and nitrates always test zero or near zero, figure if they ever do rise, could try a DSB in the fuge then.
Have relatively low flow (~200gph through the 20G) and since the fuge is feed direct from the DT with no filter sock, I get some detritus settling. The BB allows for easy siphoning.
Display is also BB and nitrates always test zero or near zero, figure if they ever do rise, could try a DSB in the fuge then.
Have relatively low flow (~200gph through the 20G) and since the fuge is feed direct from the DT with no filter sock, I get some detritus settling. The BB allows for easy siphoning.
das75
New member
hey I recognize that fuge.
Some changes, must have been shortly after the post added a 300gph PH, found increased Chaeto growth with the higher flow. Using spiral CF bulb and a couple of weeks ago removed the bubble trap as no longer need since converting to a Herbie from Dursos.
Some changes, must have been shortly after the post added a 300gph PH, found increased Chaeto growth with the higher flow. Using spiral CF bulb and a couple of weeks ago removed the bubble trap as no longer need since converting to a Herbie from Dursos.
lucidheights
NYRC member
lol has to be in error
Two year old? Try 5!
Still a great thread.
Still a great thread.
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