Return pump / plumbing suggestion to basement

[elwormo]

I am debating moving my sump to the basement. My basement is only half finished so I will have some vertical distance as well.

Bottom of sump to top of tank is 10 feet, 12 feet vertical.

90 gallon tank with corner overflow. Megaflow kit - Dual nozzle out and 1 inch drain pipe

2 wp 25's in a tank for flow and a EvoC 180 skimmer

Medium bio load in mind

50 gallon sump

2 questions

First...I planned to use PVC, but thought pex or spaflex might be easier and can use smaller diamater hose. Does a smaller hose help on the long distance.

Second..Any suggestions on a return pump. I have a Jabeo DC 6000 in the box never used, but assume I need to get a bigger pump.


Thanks for the feedback.

First sump

 

[elwormo]

Ttt

 

[rgulrich]

First - reduced diameter = more head pressure. Use as large a diameter spa flex as you are comfortable with/can get away with, and the use reducers to get to the diameter you need *at the aquarium*. In my case, I'm using about 25-30 feet of 1 1/2 inch spa flex to get from the basement sump location to the first floor living room location of the reef. I then "true Y" (a "Y" fitting) off the return line and reduce it to two 1 inch spa flex lines up to the fittings on the top of the aquarium, where it is further reduced to two 3/4 inch returns. This provides the least back pressure to the pump doing the lifting.

Second - Find a pump that can do the heavy lifting (and it is work getting water to move against that much head pressure) on a long term basis. I'm using a Reeflo Hammerhead/Barracuda Gold Hybrid for my 300, and using some of the extra flow for my algae filter systems as well as my carbon, gfo, and Ca reactors. I'd search through Reeflo, Iwaki, and other pumps for one that will serve your needs at that kind of head.

Basement sumps can't be beat - they give you the room to work and keep the noise out of the viewing area. Sorry for the mess, I've still some tidying up to do after last week's sump replacement...

 

[elwormo]

Pump

Pump

Great info, thanks for taking the time to type it all out. I am looking at pumps and many say max head 13, but do a higher GPH. Is there a safe bet to use to calculate. I have been tinkering with the calc on RC , but many models are not listed.

Do you have a model / GPH Reeflo you suggest so I can compare specs among others? Wow the price goes up for those pumps :|

 

[Wazzel]

With 12 ft of lift you are not going to get much flow out of a pump rated for 13 ft max. Possibly nothing once losses are figured in.

 

[rgulrich]

Here's a few you can take a look at for your system:
http://www.reeflopumps.com/95-275-gallon-systems.html

And a calc from their site that might be of use:
http://www.reeflopumps.com/assets/tips.pdf

Cheers,
Ray

 

[ca1ore]

When I ran my 90 from a basement sump, I used a PanWorld 100 pump. If you are going to the effort of moving the sump, you may want to consider moving to a better drains system like a siphon/backup.

 

[elwormo]

Thanks for all feedback. I think I have it narrowed down to a few pumps. Leaning towards an iwaki 55rt.

I have a question on pump input feed. I see a lot of people drill the side of the sump and place the pump to the side of the tank. This means no distance from tank to input, or maybe inches. My install has a lot of room up and down, but not side to side of sump. Can I mount on the wall and run a hose down to the sump for input?

If sump is 4 feet off the ground in the basement, then pump is mounted 2 feet above top of sump on the wall....does head height start at output of pump or still down at the sump as it now has to suck water up? Being total distance of water entering input and watering leaving output?

Just wondering if there is any benefit to flow being between sump and tank elevation. Hope that makes sense.

 

[smmiller506]

It would be better to drill a hole in the bottom of the sump and have the pump underneath the sump. If you lose power, the pump may not be able to create enough vacuum to suck the water up from the sump and it would run dry and destroy itself very quickly.

 

[SGT_York]

The Iwaki's won't pull water, you need to drill your sump in order to use an external pump.

Also the head height is measured from the water level in the sump to the water level in your display.

+1 to the herbie drain, you'll have lots of bubbles and salt creep in your sump with the water falling that far without a siphon line.

And yes you want larger diameter pipe 1.25 or such if you can fit it.

 

[elwormo]

Thanks for all the input!

 

[Wazzel]

Lifting you sump would help from a lift stand point. Lift is from water level to water level or discharge point, what ever is higher. Putting the sump 4ft off the floor knocks out 4ft of lift even if you put the pump under it. You will get just a little bit more flow losses due to the extras pipe but it will not be much.

 

[elwormo]

Cool - I have horizontal head as well. About a 45 from sump to stand. 10-12 feet up and down then over 10-12. The calcs online don't show hardly any loss when I add horizontal to the mix. Has this been your real life experience as well.

 

[elwormo]

45 degree that is

 

[Wazzel]

Cool - I have horizontal head as well. About a 45 from sump to stand. 10-12 feet up and down then over 10-12. The calcs online don't show hardly any loss when I add horizontal to the mix. Has this been your real life experience as well.

Horizontal runs do not add lift just flow losses. With the short runs we us it should not be much. IIRC if a pipe is properly sized for the flow you should get around 5ft of flow losses per 100 ft of pipe no matter it's configuration.