RO & ATO setup ideas

[Tastee]

Hi,

I am planning to install an RO unit for my tank and would love to hear any suggestions and details of their own setups all the reefers have. I have a 250L/65G Red Sea Reefer DT, a 35L/9G QT and a 10G freshwater tank so my water needs are fairly modest.

My house is freestanding on brick piers with access under the house. Timber frame, cladded, timber floor. The DT is near an eastern external side wall with a bathroom on the other side of a northern internal wall. The floor is about 2' above ground level. That side of the house is on the eastern side, almost permanently in shade, and is the "˜dead side'. I have access to it through a small rear gate, but the distance from the house to the fenceline there is only 1M/3 1/2'. It is open to the elements but very protected.

I plan to install an RODI outside that side of the house near the DT permanently plumbed into the water supply. The RODI will fill a reservoir mounted alongside it. The intention is to run the RODI fully automated to maintain a full reservoir using a float switch (and probably a second redundant one as well). I haven't settled on the particular RODI unit yet. Note that I am Australian based so don't have access to the same range (and the same prices grrr...) that the USA based reefers do.

Conveniently I already have a power supply outside in that spot (put there for the spa bath we will soon replace). I will make an appropriate termite proof timber structure, sitting off the ground, to house the RODI and reservoir and weather protect it. In this configuration the reservoir base will be about 2' below the sump base. Possibly even only 1' below.

I will use a Neptune ATK to replace the Reefer ATO and connect the RO reservoir directly to the sump, running the line under the house, up through the floor behind the tank and into the sump. That will only need about 25L/7G per week to keep the DT topped up.

I also want to be able to tap RODI water into the house to fill my barrels to avoid carting barrels around. I can then use those barrels for water changes, top up the QT and FWT etc. Or I can just tap directly into jugs to fill up QF/FWT. For this I need some form of a pump to bring water into the house. I don't want to raise the reservoir and gravity feed as that complicates the setup and also introduces risk into the ATO setup.

I guess an alternative would be two reservoirs - one filled by the RODI at a height which I can gravity feed from and a second sitting below that, topped up from the top one with a float switch, which the ATO draws from. Again increased complexity and failure points though.

One pump option is a separate Neptune PMUP or equivalent plumbed into the house through the floor like the ATK, on a flexible line, ending in a ball valve I can manually open to fill my barrels. That could sit neatly in the sump when not used. This would be a charged line.

Alternatively I could fit a pump inside the sump, plumbed to the reservoir, with a flexible outlet, and power it on and off as needed when filling barrels.

I would love to hear any thoughts people have about this type of setup.

I have a two specific questions:

1. How big an outside RODI reservoir should I have?
I may only go through 200L/50G per month. I don't want to keep water too long that may spoil. Or is that not an issue if the reservoir is reasonably well sealed?

2. What pumps would you suggest for my tap line?

Appreciate any thoughts you have. Thanks, Brad.

 

[OzIA]

So my first thought is that you should consider two float switches in your reservoir. A full / stop switch that will shut off the water (input) to the RODI and a second one to trigger the start / fill activity.

It’s my understanding that the RODI systems work better if they are on for longer durations. If you just have a fill switch, that means you will be turning the system on and off more, for shorter durations as the ATO comes on and off.

Also, with two float switches and since you have a Neptune controller (I am assuming that since you are using other Neptune products) you can add some alarms if the RODI is on for too long a period, if there is a leak for example. The two floats give you a specific fill amount each time so that you can set a timer on that fill cycle.

If you are going to end up with two reservoirs, one for ATO and one for salt mixing, you can also use the Neptune to split the RODI output using solenoid valves that you can get off Ebay for a few, uh… what currency is used in Australia? Anyway, I would set the reservoirs up to capture a weeks worth of water usage. If you are using 7 gal a week ATO, then no more than 10 on that one, trigger refill at 7 gal. For the salt mix, what do you usually mix each time? I’m assuming the reservoirs will be covered?

 

[Vinny Kreyling]

I use about 30 gal a week with top off & water changes.
I have a 55 gallon tank kept full after water changes.
Below that 55 gallons is a top off tank of 30 gallons.
Some day you will "need" the extra capacity. So better off with the extra capacity.
Keep the tanks covered and don't run the RO in short time increments longer is better.

 

[Vinny Kreyling]

Brad,
Since you are working with a pressurized system I would just run the line inside the house & try it. It can always be changed if not to your liking.
I am using a Spectrapure Litremeter pump for ATO & it is a little costly but Extremely reliable & repairable if needed. Although from Down Under it may take a while.
They show up used on RC every once in a while. Take a look @ the specs & see if it fits the bill.

 

[Tastee]

So my first thought is that you should consider two float switches in your reservoir. A full / stop switch that will shut off the water (input) to the RODI and a second one to trigger the start / fill activity.

It's my understanding that the RODI systems work better if they are on for longer durations. If you just have a fill switch, that means you will be turning the system on and off more, for shorter durations as the ATO comes on and off.

Also, with two float switches and since you have a Neptune controller (I am assuming that since you are using other Neptune products) you can add some alarms if the RODI is on for too long a period, if there is a leak for example. The two floats give you a specific fill amount each time so that you can set a timer on that fill cycle.

If you are going to end up with two reservoirs, one for ATO and one for salt mixing, you can also use the Neptune to split the RODI output using solenoid valves that you can get off Ebay for a few, uh"¦ what currency is used in Australia? Anyway, I would set the reservoirs up to capture a weeks worth of water usage. If you are using 7 gal a week ATO, then no more than 10 on that one, trigger refill at 7 gal. For the salt mix, what do you usually mix each time? I'm assuming the reservoirs will be covered?

Thanks for the reply. I had a quick chat to my LFS on Sunday and will take it further with them once I draw up some sketches. I will definitely look into the low/high float switch setup, makes sense to allow the RODI to run a decent amount of time each cycle. I think there may be a bit of extra waste water at the start of the cycle too.

I do have an Apex (2016) so will be able to control this. We can't get the EB8 in Australia, just the EB6 so I will need a breakout box to mount outside with the RODI to connect the floats etc.

At this point I don't plan to have a saltwater reservoir outside, will tap inside into my mixing barrel for that. I normally only change 10% or around 25L. I already have a good setup using a pump with the change barrels mounted on a dolly that avoids a lot of manual handling. I will make room in the housing for a salt barrel in future in case I change my mind.

We use the Aussie $ over here (-: It's actually fairly strong, it's the other costs of getting stuff into the country that is the issue. I can buy in the US and ship to Australia for 35% more than you pay in $A, but if I buy the imported unit it's closer to double. Part of this is our electrical certification overhead. Plus we simply can't get some stuff like the EB8.

I use Aquaforest reef salt currently. I will be covering the barrels. Thanks for the size suggestion, I am thinking of around 100L as the main reservoir, depending on the easy barrel options I have, a little smaller would be fine.

The other item I have identified I want is a storage container for the waste water. My current thinking is to install a rainwater tank and empty the waste into that. I've been thinking about a rainwater tank for some years now so this is a good opportunity to do that as well as the RODI and ATO.

 

[Tastee]

Brad,
Since you are working with a pressurized system I would just run the line inside the house & try it. It can always be changed if not to your liking.
I am using a Spectrapure Litremeter pump for ATO & it is a little costly but Extremely reliable & repairable if needed. Although from Down Under it may take a while.
They show up used on RC every once in a while. Take a look @ the specs & see if it fits the bill.

Thanks Vinny. That is a good point with the short cycles, so as per the prior response a pair of float switches makes a lot of sense.

My ATO will be using the Neptune ATK and PMUP. Although the RODI will be pressurised I am planning to keep the reservoir unpressurised. I'll look into the pump you mention however as an option for my house line. Anything I get that is mains powered I will be looking to source locally new, but thanks for mentioning the used options on RC.

 

[OzIA]

Ah, that's right. I forgot about the voltage difference there. If you have one of the variable speed ports free, you can use it to drive some external relays. This saves from having to use the EB6 ports to drive valves. Make sure you have the optically coupled input. The Apex variable speed ports will put out 10v at full power, which will activate a 12v relay. These are also available on eBay. A two relay optically coupled board will allow you to drive up to 3 valves without using the EB6 outlets.

I like the rainwater barrel idea. I never thought about needing to capture the waste water. We are so wasteful over here.

 

[Tastee]

Thanks for that. I hadn’t looked into the VSPs yet, but thanks for reminding me I do have 4 in the EB6, none of which I currently use. I’ll do some research into the options you mention.

 

[NubbsJRN]

When I kept fresh water I used to keep the waste water to water plants and gardens and it worked awesome. Are you just keeping FW waste?

If you are keeping saltwater waste what are your plans with it? I cant think it would be good for much and also depending on what kind of corals (palys ?) It actually could be possible harmful.

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[Tastee]

When I kept fresh water I used to keep the waste water to water plants and gardens and it worked awesome. Are you just keeping FW waste?

If you are keeping saltwater waste what are your plans with it? I cant think it would be good for much and also depending on what kind of corals (palys ?) It actually could be possible harmful.

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Hi, I am only planning to keep FW waste. SW waste will go into the sewage.


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