salinity/conductivity probe
- Thread starter septicdeath
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septicdeath
New member
It's jacked, it won't even calibrate anymore, and went as high as 65ppt and stayed there in RO/DI as well... Rma'd to marine depot at day 64 (I think they still accepted it as they issued rma online and older orders wouldn't allow rma option)...
septicdeath
New member
Also, just to be safe, I tested voltage. Looks like I have 3.9 volts, isolated it to my brand new cad lights tia-1150 skimmer? Since its less than 45 days old, should I be contacting cad lights about this voltage? Or is this kinda standard (a little voltage , ie: 3-5 volts?)
I tossed a grounding probe in anyways, now tested ZERO voltage, all probes still read as they did before, however salinity is due to arrive tomorrow? Marine depot just replaced it.
After dealing with Neptune, I can tell everyone that working with marine depot was a million times better, they paid to return my bad probe, had a replacement in the mail before I even had my old one packaged up, I did all this with marine depot (including getting a new one) in the time it took Neptune to even reply, so kudos to marine depot. (this wasn't a bash or praise thread, but I thought I would post my experience and once new probe is calibrated will let everyone know.
Thanks for the input and following along, hopefully I will be able to just report that it was a bad probe, but I've heard that some issues with the pm2 happen as well.
I tossed a grounding probe in anyways, now tested ZERO voltage, all probes still read as they did before, however salinity is due to arrive tomorrow? Marine depot just replaced it.
After dealing with Neptune, I can tell everyone that working with marine depot was a million times better, they paid to return my bad probe, had a replacement in the mail before I even had my old one packaged up, I did all this with marine depot (including getting a new one) in the time it took Neptune to even reply, so kudos to marine depot. (this wasn't a bash or praise thread, but I thought I would post my experience and once new probe is calibrated will let everyone know.
Thanks for the input and following along, hopefully I will be able to just report that it was a bad probe, but I've heard that some issues with the pm2 happen as well.
septicdeath
New member
Well got my new probe, calibrated it with 53,000 and it's correct in th sump an correct in the display tank. Ran it all day, shook it, held its ppt. Made some of my own 35 ppt and nailed 35.3 (homemade, tht close enough for me).
I left the grounding probe out, just to make sure, all results are without it in, but seeing as ~4v I decided to put it in, why not of course. Guess I need to run a few days before ending this thread, but thanks to everyone adding to he collection of information. Much appreciated that's for sure!!!!
I left the grounding probe out, just to make sure, all results are without it in, but seeing as ~4v I decided to put it in, why not of course. Guess I need to run a few days before ending this thread, but thanks to everyone adding to he collection of information. Much appreciated that's for sure!!!!
Dave & Monica
New member
So it was the probe? I'm running into the same exact thing. It's jumping and:
(a) not in sump but display with no air bubbles
(b) shaking it does not have any impact
(c) firmware on apex is 4.11_8B11
(d) no stay voltage in tank
(e) testing my water with a refractomiter shows 35ppt or 1.026 - spot on.
(d) in display it's not in direct light, and not in direct flow
Is the probe wacked? Any idea's ????
(a) not in sump but display with no air bubbles
(b) shaking it does not have any impact
(c) firmware on apex is 4.11_8B11
(d) no stay voltage in tank
(e) testing my water with a refractomiter shows 35ppt or 1.026 - spot on.
(d) in display it's not in direct light, and not in direct flow
Is the probe wacked? Any idea's ????
septicdeath
New member
WOW, your swings are even more than mine. My unit turned out to be the probe. Although I did find 4-5v voltage in my tank from my skimmer pump (isolated it to that).
In my posts across the forums (this is not the only place I posted, although most active), I have been contacted by a couple other people, one person told me that the mini din that the unit connects to the pm2 can be suspect, so make sure it looks good (he made it sound like his was cracked, which mine was not, but Im just mentioning what I was also hinted to look at).
Have you overlaid Temperature and Conductivity? Before I moved my temp probe to the pm2 and add 2.2 to temp compensation, my salinity went up every-time my temp went up, and down every time my temp went down (not as much as yours).
I'd say yours looks to be the probe but of course since that was what was wrong with mine, its easy for me to think that is your issue as well, it has to be, your jumping into the 40's and dropping to 21 (WOW). Looks like every-time you calibrate it rises to 35 and stays there for a couple hours. I would suspect its the probe and hopefully not the pm2.
I bought my probes through Marine Depot, and would suggest that everyone does that (or any online retailer that accepts returns) because Ive now returned a PH probe and a Salinity probe. Being able to return for up to 60 days and get a replacement has proven to be a great value. Thinking about that as I type, -> SUCKS doesn't it?, that I feel I need to buy my probes where I can return them, wonder how many other people feel this way about the apex probes?
(another note about calibration fluid)
****es you off spending $4.00 to buy packets of calibration fluid doesnt it. First, I would recommend buying the Pinpoint stuff, it comes in a bottle, and more importantly, at 53 it also is 1.026 / 35 ppt, so you can also use it to calibrate refractometer. I bought some small plastic bottles (2oz) and pour solution into that so I can float it and bring it to same temp before calibration, and just put it in the stand in the dark and its kept on going, rather than buying neptune or da's packets of solution. And there is a decent post here about making solution with salt and a two litre bottle of water. But the pinpoint for 8 bucks that can be used to fill smaller bottles has been my best bet.
Keep us updated.
-John
In my posts across the forums (this is not the only place I posted, although most active), I have been contacted by a couple other people, one person told me that the mini din that the unit connects to the pm2 can be suspect, so make sure it looks good (he made it sound like his was cracked, which mine was not, but Im just mentioning what I was also hinted to look at).
Have you overlaid Temperature and Conductivity? Before I moved my temp probe to the pm2 and add 2.2 to temp compensation, my salinity went up every-time my temp went up, and down every time my temp went down (not as much as yours).
I'd say yours looks to be the probe but of course since that was what was wrong with mine, its easy for me to think that is your issue as well, it has to be, your jumping into the 40's and dropping to 21 (WOW). Looks like every-time you calibrate it rises to 35 and stays there for a couple hours. I would suspect its the probe and hopefully not the pm2.
I bought my probes through Marine Depot, and would suggest that everyone does that (or any online retailer that accepts returns) because Ive now returned a PH probe and a Salinity probe. Being able to return for up to 60 days and get a replacement has proven to be a great value. Thinking about that as I type, -> SUCKS doesn't it?, that I feel I need to buy my probes where I can return them, wonder how many other people feel this way about the apex probes?
(another note about calibration fluid)
****es you off spending $4.00 to buy packets of calibration fluid doesnt it. First, I would recommend buying the Pinpoint stuff, it comes in a bottle, and more importantly, at 53 it also is 1.026 / 35 ppt, so you can also use it to calibrate refractometer. I bought some small plastic bottles (2oz) and pour solution into that so I can float it and bring it to same temp before calibration, and just put it in the stand in the dark and its kept on going, rather than buying neptune or da's packets of solution. And there is a decent post here about making solution with salt and a two litre bottle of water. But the pinpoint for 8 bucks that can be used to fill smaller bottles has been my best bet.
Keep us updated.
-John
septicdeath
New member
BTW, that graph looks different, where are you pulling it from? Thanks
Dave & Monica
New member
John,
I bought the probe and pm2 just a few weeks ago from SoCal Tropical Fish Outlet (http://socaltropicalfishoutlet.com/catalog/) and I've retuned items to them before. I agree that the cheapest price on the net isn't the best. Marine Depo is good but Tom is a small business and provides great pricing and support.
I'm not using a separate temp Probe or compensation. I calibrated it with the packets, and with a bottle of solution. Each time is the same where it stays for a few hours, then swinggggggs. I'll look through each pieces and the connection, then recalibrate - Maybe - because right now, in this moment, it's at 35 ppm.
The graphs come from Reeftronics.net, and Russ here on RC maintains it. You apply through the site, click on the reeftronics at the top to take you to his front page. My particular page is located here: http://www.reeftronics.net/d-m/apex-status
Thanks for replying and providing insight. //Dave
I bought the probe and pm2 just a few weeks ago from SoCal Tropical Fish Outlet (http://socaltropicalfishoutlet.com/catalog/) and I've retuned items to them before. I agree that the cheapest price on the net isn't the best. Marine Depo is good but Tom is a small business and provides great pricing and support.
I'm not using a separate temp Probe or compensation. I calibrated it with the packets, and with a bottle of solution. Each time is the same where it stays for a few hours, then swinggggggs. I'll look through each pieces and the connection, then recalibrate - Maybe - because right now, in this moment, it's at 35 ppm.
The graphs come from Reeftronics.net, and Russ here on RC maintains it. You apply through the site, click on the reeftronics at the top to take you to his front page. My particular page is located here: http://www.reeftronics.net/d-m/apex-status
Thanks for replying and providing insight. //Dave
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I'm having major swings daily. It will drop to 28 then rise to 50 throughout the day.
It was getting to 70 recently, I just calibrated it last night, and it dropped to 28 overnight and topping out what I calibrated it to around 35. Something isn't working with the temp compensation for me. I also have the "lab grade" probe. This is just FYI. Similar issues for me. I'm posting a separate post for my own resolution. Not meaning to hijack!
It was getting to 70 recently, I just calibrated it last night, and it dropped to 28 overnight and topping out what I calibrated it to around 35. Something isn't working with the temp compensation for me. I also have the "lab grade" probe. This is just FYI. Similar issues for me. I'm posting a separate post for my own resolution. Not meaning to hijack!
septicdeath
New member
seems more and more users encountering these "swings", Im still subscribed to multiple threads, most have a user here or a user there mentioning the same thing?.
Mine has seemed to hold solid, although It seems like it managed to drift a full (1) ppt over the last day or so, which shouldn't happen since I have a ato with 10 days worth of evap replacement in it.
Mine has seemed to hold solid, although It seems like it managed to drift a full (1) ppt over the last day or so, which shouldn't happen since I have a ato with 10 days worth of evap replacement in it.
Dave & Monica
New member
So tonite I will move my probe to a section that doesn't have light, a lot of flow, or air bubbles. I'll have to move some things around but what a pain. The swings can't be tied to any event such as dosing, lights, or heaters turning on or off. Still this is the last item I'll try before returning the module and probe.
Dave & Monica
New member
Question, on pg 3 of the manual (https://www.neptunesys.com/PM2-20104031_WEB.pdf) it states there is salinity, and high for calibrating the probe. I've been using salinity. Has anyone used high? I currently have two temp probes, but neither in the PM2. I read somewhere that if I plug one in the PM2, I can still use it for other conditions, as long as I rename where I've used it. I'll put that on my list of things to try
Dave & Monica
New member
Interesting. I have only one more left.
"NOTE: Many conductivity calibration solutions do not have the same ionic composition as salt water so using a refractometer to measure the salinity of the calibration solution is not valid. For example the Neptune 53.0 mS/cm conductivity calibration standard will not have a salinity of 35 PPT or a specific gravity of 1.0259."
"NOTE: Many conductivity calibration solutions do not have the same ionic composition as salt water so using a refractometer to measure the salinity of the calibration solution is not valid. For example the Neptune 53.0 mS/cm conductivity calibration standard will not have a salinity of 35 PPT or a specific gravity of 1.0259."
septicdeath
New member
Yes, I simply moved my probe (before adding a 2nd one anyways) to my pm2. You can actually rename the pm2 connected probe to the same name. And then no need to change any coding. However, if you have alarms set, when you first disable the first probe, all alarms and heaters will turn on, etc, etc. No biggie, just pull the cable from the main module, and plug it into your pm2, then you can turn the first one off, and turn the other one on (you cant access TempX until its connected, but then you can goto the probe setup and rename it Temp).
septicdeath
New member
This is why I suggest using the pinpoint solution, their 53.0 mS/cm happens to be at 35ppt and 1.026 unlike the neptune. The pinpoint can be used to set a refractometer, then a hydrometer, and conductivity as well.
Good luck....
Dave & Monica
New member
OK, moved the temp probe, recalibrated using the 2.2 temp offset, and used my last calibration packet. I bought 5 thinking that would last a year or more.... Moving the probe wasn't hard. So far, around 20min and it's hovering around 35ppm. Fingers crossed.
Dave & Monica
New member
One definition of insanity is doing the same thing and expecting different results. I really wanted this to work, and moving everything downstairs will not change the swinging since there is nothing happening at the swing points to cause the jump. Temp compensation didn’t help.
Also, switching from Salinity to high, and then recalibrating (used refractometer solution so not to burn up my last packet) but after cal, it read 78ppm. Went back to salinity, and cal to 35ppm. Just some feed back in that didn't work either.
Also, switching from Salinity to high, and then recalibrating (used refractometer solution so not to burn up my last packet) but after cal, it read 78ppm. Went back to salinity, and cal to 35ppm. Just some feed back in that didn't work either.
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septicdeath
New member
Well, I agree, its pretty frustrating. I am following you though, as I had the same issue, I replaced my probe as I stated, and all seemed like it was going well, then out of the blue its starts drifting again, this doesn't make any sense to me? The stuff certainly isn't cheap, I hope you get it working.
I've said this in the other thread as well, but it seems like all the old timers, people that have units older than 8 months, are the ones all saying that they dont have issues, look at this thread, all three of us are since Jan 2012 with our PM2/Conductivity purchase and all three of us have issue, and each of our threads have someone posting "I dont have issues, havent had any FOR THE LAST 2 YEARS or LAST YEAR: <- again, older system.
Im not going to say anything else, just mentioning what I am seeing.
keep us updated. Sounded like it stayed stable for 20 minutes at least..
I've said this in the other thread as well, but it seems like all the old timers, people that have units older than 8 months, are the ones all saying that they dont have issues, look at this thread, all three of us are since Jan 2012 with our PM2/Conductivity purchase and all three of us have issue, and each of our threads have someone posting "I dont have issues, havent had any FOR THE LAST 2 YEARS or LAST YEAR: <- again, older system.
Im not going to say anything else, just mentioning what I am seeing.
keep us updated. Sounded like it stayed stable for 20 minutes at least..
septicdeath
New member
I noticed your firmware is older? Have you tried upgrading it? At one point, I remember being told that a older firmware did have conductivity issues and was fixed? Just curious if you tried?
