Sand Bed Vs Bare Bottom
- Thread starter usmcsgt
- Start date
King-Kong
New member
You can try 2 things;
-reduce your lighting period
-feed more / add more fish (just be sure your skimming / exporting can keep up with the new load)
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BB tanks dont really need starboard for any other reason besides "protecting" the bottom of the tank (though many people will say the bottom of our tanks are plenty strong and dont need protection). But, with that aside, a brand new starboard will reflect a healthy amount of light back up under corals. I recently swapped my old bottom out for a new one (old one had some epoxy on it that was leaching silicates) and within a couple of weeks, all of my SPS corals (especially the tabling ones) had tons of polyp growth on the underside (where they were normally pretty sparse). Eventually the boards get covered in corraline anyways.. after a month in the tank, my new boards are about 1/4 covered already
But that's not really the reason for "less light".. the extremely powerful lights we're told to get are necessary because most DSB tanks have an over abundance of "fertilizer" available for the zooxanthellae in our corals. As such, these corals get deep dark colors.
If you dont have enough light you're left with dark brown corals. One way to fix it; blast them with light so you actually burn off the excess zooxanthellae. This is why such powerful lights are recommended, but unnecessary if you dont have the corals sitting in a tank with such an over abundance of nutrients and "fertlizer" readily available.
Then again, there are some BB tanks (take Leonardo's beatuiful BB cube) who have such huge bioloads and feed so much, that they use MH successfully with long photoperiods and really push the limits of growth on their acros (his stags grow like true weeds). So it really becomes a "balancing" act. I think Leonardo has over 20 fish in his 92gallon cube, and feeds pappone as well as normal food to the fish, but his corals are beautiful.
Great thread...
I too have just tore down my setup which had DSB in the sump refuge and SSB in the display. My maintanance slipped over the last year and the tank sort of crashed (macros went crazy and took over the tank). I was considering setting up with BB and no DSB in the sump as both had small areas of "blackness". I know this is down to flow but i keep mainly softies and don't want massive flow in the display (they just won't open up with too much flow). Anyway i think i have enough flow for BB so will give it a try.
Can someone tell me if my chaeto will still grow well in a sandless fuge??
Cheers.
I too have just tore down my setup which had DSB in the sump refuge and SSB in the display. My maintanance slipped over the last year and the tank sort of crashed (macros went crazy and took over the tank). I was considering setting up with BB and no DSB in the sump as both had small areas of "blackness". I know this is down to flow but i keep mainly softies and don't want massive flow in the display (they just won't open up with too much flow). Anyway i think i have enough flow for BB so will give it a try.
Can someone tell me if my chaeto will still grow well in a sandless fuge??
Cheers.
Chris2500DK
New member
Chaeto doesn't need substrate to grow.
rustybucket145
New member
Come on guys......
Thanks for the very informative thread. I don't, however, understand why a simple discussion over sand in a tank always generates such emotion.
One question: do you think that a one-half to one inch layer of sand can be considered a bare bottom?
One question: do you think that a one-half to one inch layer of sand can be considered a bare bottom?
nattydread
Member
Hey Kong, thanks for your insight into BB tanks. Im thinking of doing the same with a deep sand bed in my fuge.
Where is the best place to get a piece of starboad cut? Should it be sealed to the bottom of the tank with something? What color do you think reflects the best light? White?
thks
Where is the best place to get a piece of starboad cut? Should it be sealed to the bottom of the tank with something? What color do you think reflects the best light? White?
thks
RichConley
New member
Lobster, thats got nothing to do with BB, and is just plain good husbandry.
The day that high flow and proper skimmers got labeled as "Barebottom only" was a HUGE setback in this hobby.
King-Kong
New member
I would not consider it BB. It will trap detritus.
The major maintenance done on BB tanks is siphoning whatever small piles of detritus werent picked up by the flow. Most of the time these are small (let's say 2" areas) collections.
An entire bottom covered by sand (no matter how thin) just cant be considered BB.
Most of the flow a long the bottom of my tank is strong enough that if a snail lost it's footing, it rolls across the bottom until it hits the glass.
King-Kong
New member
But there is plenty of literature out there from prominant experts who go so far as to say skimmers arent necessary AT ALL.. We're not even talking wet skimming, we're saying NO SKIMMER for long-term thriving stony tanks! Getting to the point where we go from that, to "wet skimming" as standard for any tank (regardless of substrate) will take some time
King-Kong
New member
I bought my starboard at www.aquaticeco.com and just cut it with a jigsaw. I beveled my edges 45 degrees, too, and had the board come in a couple of inches from the edge off the aquarium (im only using it to protect the bottom.. again, which may not even be necessary according to some). I didnt seal the bottom. If it lays flat on the glass, whatver might get underneath is really trivial.
RichConley
New member
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10549539#post10549539 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by King-Kong
But there is plenty of literature out there from prominant experts who go so far as to say skimmers arent necessary AT ALL.. We're not even talking wet skimming, we're saying NO SKIMMER for long-term thriving stony tanks! Getting to the point where we go from that, to "wet skimming" as standard for any tank (regardless of substrate) will take some time
Theres also a lot of literature out there saying that SPS corals can't be kept in tanks. Theres a lot of literature that says you should have 5 or 6 small fish in your 90, instead of the 20 or so you have.
Theres a whole lot of literature out there that is absolute crap, and is based on premises that are false. I dont know how many books I've read that keep referencing the same studies from the 50s/60s, instead of doing their own research, even though most of these studies are considered flawed.
Theres a lot of literature out there that says the ocean reef is this ecologicially/climatorily/evolutionarily stable environment, and thats flat out wrong.
I agree it may take a while to get wet skimming to be standard, and yeah, you can run a tank without a skimmer, but why? You need to keep a smaller bioload, and run bigger lights.
Theres just so much dogma in this hobby, and almost none of it is true.
This is absolutely true and is one of the unfortunate and negative aspects of the internet. An idea, right or wrong, can be repeated so often in forums and discussions that it becomes accepted as truth and dogma. Yet when one looks for the origin and objective basis for the "truth," it cannot be found.
RichConley
New member
That I dont completely agree with. A lot of books, and "experts" are spouting stuff thats not true, and a lot of reefers seem to take everything these "experts" say as dogma. Not nearly enough people in this hobby question what they're told. This is a hobby: you should atleast want to have a firm understanding of whats going on.
The problem with the "experts" is that theres too many of them who really are experts in one area, but like to give advice in areas where they have no more knowledge than any other hobbiest, and people take it as an expert's advice. You shouldn't take your MD's advice on Investing as "expert advice," just because hes an "expert," should you?
tor101898
Plankton27
I've been setting up to go BB in a few weeks,as such, i just came across this thread and found it very informative.
In my opinion, I would say that no matter the choice, maintenance plays a huge part in whatever substrate/or lack of choice you make. I for one am going BB because after having a DSB and then a SSB , I would like to go for the BB look. I appreciate any and all info I can get on the subject from those that have tried it before, and realize that it is just that someone elses experience and opinion.
In my opinion, I would say that no matter the choice, maintenance plays a huge part in whatever substrate/or lack of choice you make. I for one am going BB because after having a DSB and then a SSB , I would like to go for the BB look. I appreciate any and all info I can get on the subject from those that have tried it before, and realize that it is just that someone elses experience and opinion.
nattydread
Member
Thks, Kong
I also found a good deal on starboard at USPlatics, same place you can get ro water containers.
http://www.usplastic.com/catalog/pr...SPlastic&category_name=20364&product_id=13494
I also found a good deal on starboard at USPlatics, same place you can get ro water containers.
http://www.usplastic.com/catalog/pr...SPlastic&category_name=20364&product_id=13494
greenbean36191
Premium Member
It's got a lot more to do with flow, real estate, and herbivores than nutrients in the sand. If you exclude herbivores or open up a lot of space on rocky reefs you still get macroalgae replacing corals without sand and without any change to the nutrient levels. The zonation of corals and seagrass is primarily due to wave energy, not nutrients. Acropora still grows in sandy areas as long as the wave energy is high enough and just about every other genus of "SPS" is abundant in lagoons, often even intermingled with seagrass. And yes, there are reef crests with sand.
You mean him.
