Sand is now my enemy...I am going BB and that is that

[Large Polyp Dave]

i setup my old 180 with white starboard. had about 60X flow but it was not enough to keep the detritus out behind the rocks. nitrate issues started to creep up. and the coraline starts to look really ugly after a year. I threw sand over the top. enjoyed it much more.

current tank 75G sps. started off with black starboard. had over 100X flow, still not enough flow to keep the detritus out of the back of the rocks. i threw sand over it and am can confidently say that i will never do BB again unless I have the eductors installed in pointed across the very bottom of the tank.

if you set up a barebottom, make sure you are getting enough flow in your tank (especially along the bottom underneath all the rocks and in the back behind the rocks) or else you will have piles of debris that you can't reach with a siphon that will just breakdown and release crap into your water.

 

[Znut Reefer]

I have seen one tank where a guy used epoxy on the starboard and sprinkled sand on it. He let it sit and cure out before using it. It looked great when he first done it. I think a few others may have tried it too. Not sure how they like it now.

Heres the thread on BB tanks and there are more, but you'll need to do a search.

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=912876&perpage=20&pagenumber=1

There are some very sweet looking BB tanks posted on there.

And there are some very sweet looking tanks with sandbeds out there too. I just found BB works better for me. I don't want the extra work of having to redo a sand bed every yr or so. Just too much work! Some may call that a lazy streak.

 

[Serioussnaps]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8066514#post8066514 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Large Polyp Dave
you will have piles of debris that you can't reach with a siphon that will just breakdown and release crap into your water.

this is what is happening with the Sandbed i have currently...i think BB will be better able to cope with it

the whole thing about BB is that the flow in those areas is easy for me to deal with....careful placement of powerheads.....i think the Tunze nanos that are coming out will come in handy

 

[ScallopKing]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8067392#post8067392 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Serioussnaps
this is what is happening with the Sandbed i have currently...i think BB will be better able to cope with it

the whole thing about BB is that the flow in those areas is easy for me to deal with....careful placement of powerheads.....i think the Tunze nanos that are coming out will come in handy

I'll give some pointers about what I've learned in the time I've been BB that will probably help you.

First, I'd remove all the sand at once. You'll never get it all out especially if you leave the rocks in while you do it (they'll shed it like crazy for a long time). Take everything out (corals, rocks and water) then remove the sand with a wet vacuum. Take all the rocks and clean them thoroughly try to remove every bit of sand/deitrus with the use of a strong powerhead of swishing around it the water.

Second, make the rockscape as open as possible to allow lots of flow in between the rockwork. I've found the less rock the better since most time is stacked on top of one another and stuff settles in there. You also want to stack the rocks so that no rocks are sitting completely flat on the bottom this way flow will be able to push out the crap that's collected and not allowed to settle.

Third, leave plenty of room on the sides and behind, basically a channel running behind the rocks and all around the front to each side. This will make it easier to siphon the piles out. You need to be able to get to them all and sometimes flow will just get that one you can't get at the back.

I switched for the same reasons, darn sand bed kept getting cyano and I couldn't get rid of it. Plus, I had sandstorms with just some seios for flow. I'd hate to see what would happen now with my streams and sand. Adios.

The only two warning I can give to you is don't starve your tank afterwards and make it too nutrient poor. I'm actually starting to feed more again now and added more fish to bring things back up for the acros. Also, I had huge nitrate readings for a long time afterwards and was forced to put in a remote fuge with chaeto and yep a sand bed of about 3" deep. And that's running my bb 180. I'm a firm believer that sand is a must but not in the main display. There's huge benefits with leaving it out.

Here's a couple pics of mine from a couple months ago, I hope you like coraline!!. HTH.

 

[JMBoehling]

BB display with Chaeto in a BB refugium has worked for me.

 

[Serioussnaps]

Thanks for all the tips Scallop!!!

---------------When I originally planned this tank...i was going to add another overflow(drill it again) but with a 55 2 overflows is killing space that you dont really have.
I was going to do 1 30 G sump with just equipment(skimmer and what not) and the other overflow would go to a 30 G fuge that had a 5" DSB and Chaeto.

I got lazy and didnt drill it and ended up with a 30 G that is basically a BB sump/fuge type thingamajiggder. One side has a stack of live rock and chaeto growing under PC lamps and the overflow outlet runs directly into the ASM G3. Its kind of rigged up but the chaeto helps me out and the skimmer is skimming pretty well.

I have a problem baffling it(i used a rubbermaid) so a DSB may be hard due to the skimmer not really being partitioned completely from the macro grow out area. In the future on a larger tank i will definitely have 2 overflows for fuge and sump separate but right now thats not the case.

seems like a DSB in the sump would defeat what i was going for....any and all deitrus and organic material to be crushed by the skimmer and WC's

My rockscape has alot of openings and alot of arches so water can flow around everywhere...right now its stronger in some places than others but a couple of small upgrades on pumps does that for me....if i can get my GF's camera to work today ill post some pics and maybe you guys can give some rockscaping suggestions....mine is a piece of junk.......

 

[msn711]

1. Has anyone tried painting the bottom of the tank maybe black or blue (as opposed to a starboard bottom), just so there's something to look at until corraline grows in. Obviously, I mean painting the outside of the tank.

2. Does anyone keep sand in their fuge when running a bb tank, or is the entire system bb?

 

[Chicago]

dumped my fine sugar sand and put in some large gravel argaonite to cover the bottm... glad i did.. no more sand storms ... i didnt go bare mobttm for fear of rock slide... taking all rock out of tank and resettin up was not an option for me...

 

[Znut Reefer]

I do have a refug on my 550. But it is also BB.

 

[King-Kong]

I use a faux-sand bottom.

That is, sand mixed in with two part epoxy to form a solid hard substrate. Detritus is not able to settle thanks to 70x turnover, but I get the look (or had it for over a year, corraline is going CRAZY right now) of sand.

Here is a close-up when first installed (tell me that doesnt look like real sand, but touch it, and it's solid as a rock):

http://www.d3f.org/misc/fish/90g/21-faux-sand.jpg



And here is a more recent pic of the overall tank:

http://www.d3f.org/misc/fish/90g/a03-fulltank-big-mille.jpg

 

[King-Kong]

Also, to add, I used to run chaeto in my sump (about a month+ ago). In the old BB days before I skimmed wet and had 1/2 as much flow, it would grow (and my corals werent doing so well).

Then, I increased my flow and changed rock work, and the chaeto stopped growing. It wouldnt grow at all. It just sat and collected detritus like a mechanical filter, and other algae grew on it.

I finally threw it out, and have been very thankful ever since.

 

[RichConley]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8067392#post8067392 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Serioussnaps
this is what is happening with the Sandbed i have currently...i think BB will be better able to cope with it

the whole thing about BB is that the flow in those areas is easy for me to deal with....careful placement of powerheads.....i think the Tunze nanos that are coming out will come in handy

Snaps, you can have plenty of flow in a sandbed time

I've got sand, look at my sig to see what I have for flow.


Your problem is not the sandbed, but the lack of flow.

 

[elephen]

Not to sound like an *** but: http://dictionary.reference.com/search?r=2&q=detritus

Not deitrus happy reefing

 

[Serioussnaps]

thanks for the correction....i have been saying "deitrus" for the longest time...i have also seen lots of other people...

nice to learn something new

 

[143gadgets]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8069834#post8069834 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by msn711
1. Has anyone tried painting the bottom of the tank maybe black or blue (as opposed to a starboard bottom), just so there's something to look at until corraline grows in. Obviously, I mean painting the outside of the tank.

2. Does anyone keep sand in their fuge when running a bb tank, or is the entire system bb?

1. Yes i painted mine Black.

2. Nope. No fuge, no rock, just a sump. That's all u need.

 

[panic]

A faux epoxy sandbed will soon be purple and make siphoning more difficult and more detritus will settle in the pits.

Colored starboard will soon be purple too. I have starboard in case a rock falls to the bottom - insurance.

I have a 1/2" space between the starboard and the tank walls to catch the detritus. It is easy to siphon.

To eliminate siphoning the back - aim some of your flow directly on the bottom back edge of the tank so nothing can settle there. I never have to siphon the back. Saves time.

I cannot keep macroalgae alive in my system. I think due to very low nutrients.

A major downside to a BB system to think about is that you can't let your reef go 2 months without a siphon or water change like you can in a sandbed system. Continuous cleaning is a must.

 

[Serioussnaps]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8073896#post8073896 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by panic
A
A major downside to a BB system to think about is that you can't let your reef go 2 months without a siphon or water change like you can in a sandbed system. Continuous cleaning is a must.

This is one reason why I am going BB-----i cant go a week without a WC so it fits the BB philosophy perfectly.


I am surprised your macro dies...i see people who have it but it just doesnt grow...but it never dies....i guess BB will give me the undoubtedly CLEAN tank i want.

 

[old salty]

Good thread. I have recently begun the process of removing the crap-trap from my tank. Of course, I'm much too hard headed to remove everything from the tank to get the sand out. I like the look of a shallow sand bed, but the crud that it traps is astounding- I can clog a 100 micron filter sock in 12 hours after stirring everything up. I have a bunch of nano rock in my fuge that I have been breaking up into 1 inch pieces and placing them on the bottom. It takes away from the flat glass look, though it's not as nice as sand.

 

[Serioussnaps]

I officially just removed the sand. There is still some and the Tunze is full blast on the bottom blowing it about 5 inches high on the other side of the tank...going to siphon that out in a couple of days. I love watching all that DEITITRUS formerly known as DEITRUS flow out of the tank and into my skimmer....it was alot for my liking....not regretting it at all of course I am now ONLY 3 hours into BB.

ONLY ONE THING NEGATIVE SO FAR....i bought a 1" baby(not baby but baby) who was very small...it paired up with my adult perc in no time(not mating because male is so young and small) anyways the smaller perc went missing on me about an hour ago...i dont think he liked the rearrangement of the ph's on the bottom to blow everything to a spot for me to siphon it...

i looked everywhere and he is nowhere to be found but...my overflow runs right into the skimmer and if he went into the overflow then he went into the skimmer and he was so small he is puree in the skimmer cup...

hopefully this isnt the case and he is just hiding somewhere I cant see or find him....if it is the case than he died for a greater cause


In the big pic ....functionally speaking.....i like BB so far and i think it will give me a better chance at an ACRO dominated tank

 

[Serioussnaps]

Old salty i was thinking about something like that....I do have 2 Croceas that I allowed them to attach their byssal threads to a flat tongan peice of LR so i can move them around easy without tearing their threads.....i can put them on the bottom(i read that croceas like rock work better than sand anways)

I thought about rocks but will slowly just add some corals to cover the glass bottom.


I HOPE THE BOTTOM DOESNT BREAK....THEN I WILL HAVE TO DUMP ON A BIGGER TANK..OK MAYBE I HOPE IT DOES BREAK