Sandbed thread

[Capt_Cully]

I'm the youngest of 7. I never had to be told "don't take the car out at night without permission". I saw my 5 older brothers make that mistake time and time again. I saw each one of them take an old school Italian beat down by my dad. I knew where the line was. Experience told me, "that's probably not the best idea".

It's frustrating sometimes when you try to help others with your experiences. I'm not telling people what to do, I'm just offering them intellectual fodder. But when it's met with, IMO, inane, rebuttles, I don't know.....

I guess it's why I don't surf those forums too much anymore.

 

[Gary Majchrzak]

I removed my DSB when they were still very popular.
Sometimes the best way to learn is by personal experience.

 

[aquadonkey]

Hmm..... food for thought - especially for us noobs
Right now I have a deepish SB - about 3 inches. I originally had about 4 - 5, but took sand out slowly until I reached this point.
Is there a safe way to keep the SB at it's current depth? I like it for my goby/pistol combo. They do quite a lot of digging and in general mussing up of the sand-bed. Is this enough? Or should I plan on changing out sand at regular intervals?

 

[downset]

I have always been a fan of no sand or super shallow just enough to cover the bottom for looks.I made my mind up when I was first getting into the hobby and 6-8+ inch sand beds were common and the norm and I just though what a waste of space plus it looked dirty from the front of the tank to a noobie anyways. That being said I am planning on trying a remote sandbed

 

[Neoz]

Mark as you said experience is everything. I can tell you as a noobie I read several articles about sand beds. Good, bad and ugly. They each *sounded* reasonable with what they were saying. It was tough for someone new like myself entering the hobby to decide which way was best.

Well I'll be the first to say in my short 1 year experience I'm with you about the sand bed. Now this is probably my fault but I never vacuumed the sand bed. Once in a great while I would stir the muck that settled on the sand top but not much at all.
I decided to siphon out quite a bit of sand from my 180 as I prepare for the breakdown. Talk about crap... The smell, the looks everything about it was terrible. But yet it looked good in my tank. My 90 will only have a little bit in it up front. None in the back were you can't see. Lessoned learned from my short time in the hobby.

 

[NirvanaFan]

I currently have a very shallow sand bed. Probably half the tank has no sand. I'm letting some zoas grow on the bottom of the tank actually. I plan on having a ZB (zoa bottom) eventually.

 

[josepha]

Well...OK. I guess having a 2 foot by 8 foot bottom for 10 years, it's time I chime in...again. I actually started with a plenum, yes a plenum, way back when with a DSB. I had a siphon under the plenum which I could siphon every six months to start the anerobic bacteria cycle over again and keep the sandbed clean (or so I thought), which I believe is why my deep sand bed/plenum lasted almost 5 years. Eventually I could not ignore the MUCK and the fact that siphoning is the only way to truly keep a SHALLOW sand bed clean. I can not express how much fun pulling 250 POUNDS of sand and "sliding" a plenum out from under 250 pounds of rock is (right Gary?). How much is 250 lbs of sand? enough to use as leveling sand for the entire path in my back yard ;-). After years of work, I still today have worked it down to just under an inch on my way to a half inch. I do have two 5 gallon buckets in my refugium filled with sand that I have drilled holes in as RDSBs that I can just take out when "full." I also continue to siphon the aragonite gravel in the main tank in sections with every water change and still see and smell the MUCK every time.

 

[Gravesj1s]

Cully~
I hear ya and agree on many points you make.Personaly I dont care to get into debates these days and prefer right or wrong just to stay out of topics as the such..Years ago I sorta liked debating and would read every article I could get my hands on.

As for the sandbed debates,well,I think most of the info out their is probably unfounded.I take most of what Ron Shimeck,Bob Goemans,Sam Gable and others with little credibility.Some if not most of their articles seem to be geared on promoting a product, book or just plain opinion.

For years the report on the Monaco systems ran by Dr. Jean Jaubert where the plenum originated was inaccuate.The articles would state how the sediment would disolve and maintain Ca.,alk and trace elements in closed systems without water changes and no buildup of yellowing compounds.Years later when someone actually went to see the report was just the opposite.All of the systems are open to exchange with NSW at about 5-10 % with the exception of atleast one that I remember of and as you would expect the water was noted as yellowish.

Walter Adey inventer of the Algae turf scrubber,wrote the 600ish page book based on about 20years of research "Dynamic Aquaria".From that he clearly states sediments act as nutrient sinks.
Some groups of reefkeepers think nutrient export occurs naturally on the reef in deep sediments,its simply not true.On the reef its tightly cycled ,the true export is from tidal action where phytoplankton is carried off the reef ,dies and slowly settles the ocean floor.Exactly the reason phosphours levels are lower on the reef than they are off it.

Sand dwellers or cleanup crews as Ron Shimeck publicly stated are responseable for most of nutrient turnover in the sediment is based solely on his opinion,their is no reference to back that statement up.Seems tidal action/evective flow is the true source.

Been working alot so have'nt been around much,I posted some references a few months ago in this forum but cant remember where now.Ill see if I can post them up later.
Take care-