Seriously considering a downsize.

[AcroSteve]

I think I am serious about this, but need to think it out. My current tank is fairy complicated in that there are many pumps and parts. It is a 180 with a closed loop and remote sump in the basement.


I think I want to downsize to something no bigger than about 30x36x30. Or sized such that one 250w bulb could light it. My current reflector is a luminarc mini. Construction would be two or three sides low iron glass.

I like the idea of a sumpless tank for simplicity, but I think I should have a small one mainly to accommodate evaporation and a skimmer. Overflow would be external as to keep the inside of the tank walls smooth.

My current skimmer is an H&S A200 -2x1260, and is probably too big and definitely a little too noisy for what I have in mind. Other choices for a silent skimmer? Bubble King? Skimmer would be gravity fed from the overflow and return pump would be an eheim 1250 or 1260.

Calcium/Alk demands would be met using kalk, so I could eliminate my ca reactor.

I would like to eliminate my chiller too.

Currently, I have a cheato grow out tank that I would eliminate. Not sure of the consequences of doing so.

For water flow, I am thinking it would be my current Tunze 6100 mounted in the overflow, and probably a wavebox - preferably external or built in. Basically, the pump and controller with the box being part of the tank.

I am still thinking of a mixed reef, but no tangs due to the small size. So what would I do for algae grazers. I plan on keeping my two clowns, lawnmower blenny, madarin, but am not sure of any others. Current candidates are a flame angel, bangai cardinal or my royal gramma.


Please give me some input on these or other subjects.

How would the wavebox work with a tank of these or smaller dimensions? What skimmer would be best? Tank builder? Barebottom?

 

[demonsp]

Any trouble you have in this tank would only double or triple in a smaller tank. Sounds like your almost to the point of total harmony. I would cure any linguring problems and things would be alot easier and less costly.

 

[AcroSteve]

Not sure I follow you. My desire is to simplify and reduce energy usage.

 

[demonsp]

Sounds like you want to downsize to make it easier and cleanup some problems ,No?

 

[Kalied20]

I just downsized from my 90 gallon to a 24 gallon JBJ. I modded it a lot though. Custom ATO, HOB skimmer, bigger return pump, etc, etc. I had forgotten how much I love NANO's. Your suggested Setup would be bigger of course, but I have always liked the idea of less is better in Reefs.

If you are looking at energy costs:

T5 lighting. I used it on my 90 gallon for 2 years with great results. I have actually setup my 24 gallon between two windows in the livingroom. I ordered a new T5 light fixture, but after 4 days in front of the window, I am thinking of leaving it with just natural sunlight. Don't know if you can do this with your setup?

Pumps. Less Pumps is good. Think you are going the right way with the gravity feed skimmer.

Water movement in the tank. I had an idea for a 50 gallon build that I haven't started, but you are welcome to try it. I was going to get a modded Maxijet or a tunze and attach it to a piece PVC the length of the back wall. Make about 6 jets coming off of it and put flex tubing on them to create more outlets with one pump. I was going to cover it with Live Rock rumble and put "Great Stuff" around it to hold it together.

That would be one return pump and one pump in the tank.

Couple of ideas there. Hope that helps you a some?

 

[Kalied20]

Oh yea, I am planning on putting Kalk water in my ATO so I don't have to run a Reactor. Think you mentioned that in your post already though.

 

[tufacody]

Sounds like you are bored. Boredom is very bad in this hobby.

 

[widmer]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=12406391#post12406391 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by tufacody
Sounds like you are bored. Boredom is very bad in this hobby.

I don't know, I can see how too big of a system can get to be too much. I think a smaller system is easier all the way around. Less equipment, easier water changes...

Another way of looking at it, is I don't necessarily know that doubling the size of your aquarium would double your enjoyment, but it will certainly be more to deal with. My 30 breeder is good for me for now. In the future I'd prefer a bigger tank, but I don't see myself wanting anything bigger than 75 gallon, and I've been in the hobby for years.

 

[widmer]

For some reason I've always felt the same way about my cars too, when I used to have my little ford escort I felt like working on that was a lot easier than working on my voyager or 300D, mostly because it was just smaller I think.

 

[jthao]

smaller tanks are much more enjoyable I think because it's easier to deal with, less money definitely, and less time consuming. Big tanks are a PITA to start with, most people hate it at the beginning (like me), but I think that most will agree that once it's up and running smoothly, it's worth it, and will be double the enjoyment.

 

[xtm]

Re: Seriously considering a downsize.

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=12405319#post12405319 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by AcroSteve

Please give me some input on these or other subjects.

How would the wavebox work with a tank of these or smaller dimensions?

The wavebox requires a minimum of 4' to create the seesaw. It will not work efficiently on tanks that are shorter than 4'.

I think I know what you're feeling. My 75g is thriving and in cruise control.. I can't stand it anymore. I need to keep working on something! I told my wife I needed to downgrade to "save on electricity costs" but in reality I think I just needed to keep working on something. I downgraded to a smaller cube tank but I missed having tangs and the joy of having a huge reef tank, so I ended up going back to the larger 75g... This thing is very common with reefers who are getting bored, lol.

Think about it-- an additional 250w halide only costs about $5 /mo. on an 8-hr photoperiod. IMO it's not worth saving that extra $5 if the drawback is having a smaller tank. Also, you're downgrading from 180 to 140 which is not that big of a downgrade.. might as well just stay with the 180.

JMO

 

[adtravels]

I would go for a 90 cube lit by 1 400 watter and a couple of actinics,I do agree that big tanks are a serious powerdrain, and elec is not getting any cheaper.

 

[AcroSteve]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=12405445#post12405445 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by demonsp
Sounds like you want to downsize to make it easier and cleanup some problems ,No?

Not really. Tank is on cruise right now. Make top off water once or twice a month, feeding and infrequent glass cleaning is about it.

It mostly is about reducing the ongoing cost of the tank.

I want to use as much of my existing hardware that I can. That means for lighting, it is limited to 250 halides, or bulbs i can run off of my 440 icecap.


XTM That was my concern about the wavebox. Even without a real "wave" would it move more water than a stream only?

And, I really figured on much less than 140 gallons, but those where the dims I came up with using a section of my current stand and cutting my canopy in half. Like I said, I want to re-use as much as I can.


Here is an older pic.

I could just re-do the current canopy and rather than 36" long, I could make the tank about 30x30x30 to better match the dividers in the stand. that would be about 110 gal.

 

[Mr James]

I downsized from a 180g tank w/55g sump, to a 58g reef tank w/100g Rubbermaid tub and 40g softie tank. Granted my volume hasn't really changed too much, I run less lights and more power efficient equipment (offloaded MR2 skimmer and got a BM200)....

I downsized because I wanted different tanks with different speicies. I went with more efficient means of equipment too. I like it much better.

 

[miwoodar]

I used to have a junkload of tanks AcroSteve and I imagine that you are going through something similar to what I did just before I decided to get rid of them. I had 540 gals in just main tanks and cared for another ~300 gals for friends and clients. It felt awesome to shed all of that burden. These days I only have one tank - a 65. I'm getting ready to bump up to a 36x36 cube (140 gals) but I think I'll probably stop there for a while and maybe never go larger again. I've decided against putting the sump in the basement due to electricity concerns (Iwaki 100 = $35/mo to run). My return will be an Iwaki 30 instead and my circulation will be provided by stream pumps. The tank will be placed so the house AC blows right into the stand although I've never needed a chiller on my 65 despite having two halides and two VHOs. I attribute much of this to my use of smallish external pumps, steam pumps, and a lot of air flow.

 

[Potsy]

Upon moving to our new house, we went from a 75 gallon reef with a 20 gallon sump, Euroreef skimmer, calc. reactor, 2x250 watt halides, 1/4 hp chiller, and wires everywhere to a 38 gallon sumpless reef featuring a 5x39 watt T5, three maxijets for cirulation , and a CPR BakPak skimmer.

As a result, the power consumption drastically decreased from around 2000 watts down to about 250 watts total for the 38 gallon.

I also enjoy this tank much more. Gave away the tang and now keep a seven year old percula clown, a bangaii cardinal, and azure damsel. Weekly 5 gallon water change and homemade two part solution for calc. and alkalinity. One pitcher of ro water each morning for top-off. And my wife's favorite part: not a wire in sight.

 

[zombiereef]

i say go for the 36" cube idea. drop the closed loop idea for less energy. you can use one 250w light, a small fuge light, a couple low voltage vortechs (or similar) and a small sump/fuge and that will be a sweet tank with 1/4 the energy bill. i just did the same thing you are thinking about. i got a 180 and after getting all the equipment and then calculating energy use, i freaked out. i am really happy that i decided to go with a 60g for now. i will upgrade to a 36" cube someday for a little extra real estate( with same energy use as my 60g), but i sure like the lower energy bill.
i agree with others that you are aching to tinker too.

 

[sammie]

Don't fall into the trap of buying a $9000.00 zero turn mower to mow your grass. How many years could you PAY someone to mow your grass for that $9000.00. What I mean here is you have a really nice settup now, all paid for. How much is a custom made cube tank going to cost you to have made? Yes you can sell some of your old equiptment but your also talking about buying a $500 wave box also. Look at what the new settup will cost to put together and figure out how much power you use every month and see how long it will take you to break even.
Another note Steve I have seen some of the "frags" that come from your tank, you could sell them and pay a little of your power bill. I just sold over $400 worth of stuff from my tank at the Cleveland swap, that will "power" my tank for about 6 months.

It's like the people who buy hybrid cars, sure it used less gas but it takes you 10 years of driving a hybrid to break even with what the car cost you in the first place over a conventional powered vehicle.

Just trying to make you think before you leap.

 

[joesynodontis]

for energy consumption you could get intouch with your local energy supplier and see if there is a time where energy is more inexpensive in the corse of a day, LADWP is off peak is after 5pm and get mor expensive after 10 am. things that do not need to be constantly on like the uv light, a powerhead or just hte amout to light time you give your tank. maybe solar pannels are for you, there are state rebates that are over 50% off.

 

[AcroSteve]

Sammie, you make some very valid points. However, I have even thought of selling it all and not rebuilding. But I don't like the prospect of no tank.


I think I would prefer to sell or otherwise get everything out of my existing tank and just keep the live rock. Then I could work on the new system without the pressure of a timeline. But then there are the corals that I am very fond of. Could I get them back at some point? I am sure I could, but there is always a chance.