Silent and Failsafe Overflow System
- Thread starter BeanAnimal
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BeanAnimal
Premium Member
You don't need "upflow" as much as you do good circulation in the tank. You can either achieve that with a huge return pump (not efficient) or closed loops or power heads.
I prefer closed loops because they do not add clutter to the tank. I can't stand to see equipment in the tank AT ALL. My current setup uses a high flow pump for the return and I have a fairly high flow pump for the closed loop. The returns are split into TWO fan style loclines and the closed loops returns through an oceans motions squirt. I would use a BIGGER loop pump, but am limited by the single 1" intake I drilled (Not thinking when I setup the tank).
I prefer closed loops because they do not add clutter to the tank. I can't stand to see equipment in the tank AT ALL. My current setup uses a high flow pump for the return and I have a fairly high flow pump for the closed loop. The returns are split into TWO fan style loclines and the closed loops returns through an oceans motions squirt. I would use a BIGGER loop pump, but am limited by the single 1" intake I drilled (Not thinking when I setup the tank).
okay , I will have to check on and do some reading on closed loop to see which one I want to go with.( I know nothing about them, surprised ) That must be why i hear people say they have a sump and fug. I would assume that i should drill more holes to accommodate a closed loop system. I don't like overflows over the top. Thanks for all your help. You have answered a lot.
BeanAnimal
Premium Member
The overflows over the top will limit the backflow into the sump during a power outage. The deeper the return is submerged, the more water it will siphon out of the tank. Check valves and siphon break holes are not reliable. The only truly reliable method is to keep the returns from being submerged more than you can afford to backflow!
Yes, you can drill more holes for the closed loop intakes and returns. That is the cleanest method with regard to aesthetics.
Yes, you can drill more holes for the closed loop intakes and returns. That is the cleanest method with regard to aesthetics.
BeanAnimal
Premium Member
That is a fairly hard to answer question in many ways.
A good rule of thum is at least 2 diameters apart and at least 1 diameter from an edge. You will hear other similar numbers... but you get the idea.
I have seen 75G tanks with 6 or more holes drilled in the back. The key is clean holes with no chips. I would imagine that 6 good holes would be safer than 3 hacked holes.
A good rule of thum is at least 2 diameters apart and at least 1 diameter from an edge. You will hear other similar numbers... but you get the idea.
I have seen 75G tanks with 6 or more holes drilled in the back. The key is clean holes with no chips. I would imagine that 6 good holes would be safer than 3 hacked holes.
BeanAnimal
Premium Member
You should be fine 
Ask in the DIY forum and I think you will get plenty of people what will show you photos of more than 6 holes in the back of a tank
Ask in the DIY forum and I think you will get plenty of people what will show you photos of more than 6 holes in the back of a tank
BeanAnimal
Premium Member
Not a bother at all zoa. Let us know how your project shapes up.
BeanAnimal
Premium Member
What size is your return pump?
BeanAnimal;
I like your standpipe/overflow idea. I'll implement in it's fullest when I upgrade and have the luxury of a drilled tank. But for now, my tank is not drilled.
So I have a question for you that I haven't seen addressed as I skimmed through this thread.
Is there a way to implement this in a HOB overflow box or do I have to use a Durso/Stockman standpipe? I want it as quiet as possible.
The overflow and associated plumbing do not exist as of yet, so mods would be easy at this time. In general, I'd like to use the return for all water flow in the tank. I was thinking of using an OM super squirt to get some "random" water movement from the 4 returns.
Let's say I want to use a 1600gph U-tube overflow box with (2) 1.5" drains. Also assume my return pump has excess capacity (such as a reeflo dart). The nature of the HOB beast won't allow a third emergency drain, right?. I haven't come across a slick way around this yet. Do you have any thoughts on this?
Is it a bad idea to use your siphon method where the sump feeds are below the surface of the sump water in this case?
Would this siphon method be able to pull more flow than 1600gph through the drains?
Would that be asking for trouble?
Thanks for your insight,
Paul
I like your standpipe/overflow idea. I'll implement in it's fullest when I upgrade and have the luxury of a drilled tank. But for now, my tank is not drilled.
So I have a question for you that I haven't seen addressed as I skimmed through this thread.
Is there a way to implement this in a HOB overflow box or do I have to use a Durso/Stockman standpipe? I want it as quiet as possible.
The overflow and associated plumbing do not exist as of yet, so mods would be easy at this time. In general, I'd like to use the return for all water flow in the tank. I was thinking of using an OM super squirt to get some "random" water movement from the 4 returns.
Let's say I want to use a 1600gph U-tube overflow box with (2) 1.5" drains. Also assume my return pump has excess capacity (such as a reeflo dart). The nature of the HOB beast won't allow a third emergency drain, right?. I haven't come across a slick way around this yet. Do you have any thoughts on this?
Is it a bad idea to use your siphon method where the sump feeds are below the surface of the sump water in this case?
Would this siphon method be able to pull more flow than 1600gph through the drains?
Would that be asking for trouble?
Thanks for your insight,
Paul
BeanAnimal
Premium Member
This is a complex issue but the easy answer is that it will not work for your proposed surge setup. There are ways to make it work, but the complexity will outweigh the benefit. You best bet is likely going to be several large diamter drains and possibly cascading p traps to quite the surge flow as it makes its way to the sump.
BeanAnimal
Premium Member
Sure. The U-tube supplies the overflow box with a fixed volume of water. A split compartment box would likely work the best.. I.E. the box outside the tank would have a compartment for the U-Tube discharge and weir that overflows into the standpipe box. That will ensure that the water level for the silent standpipe and the u-tube siphon levels do not at all interact.
I will comment on the rest of your qestions a bit later, I have a conference call to jump on...
quote:Originally posted by BeanAnimal
What size tank?
Sump?
Pumps?
Planned livestock?
Budget?
What is your experience in the hobby? What is your goal?
Your question is VERY open ended. There are dozens of ways to setup a viable system.
You may be better served by looking at some local systems. Visit a few local reef club meetings and a few fish stores. It will be MUCH easier for you to make decisions once you have a better grasp of your options.
hey bean i have a few questions for you if you have time to answer.
first of all i decided to go with your overflow system because after reading a couple of times it makes complete sense .
so now this is my setup updated:
55g acrylic
20g long sump
aqua c EV180 with mag 7
i didnt decide on the return pump yet cause i dont know which one its gonna work for me.
livestock:mostly lps
Now my question to you is what size should i use on the pvc to build the overflow system?Bulkheads size?
And what kinda of overflow box should i build?
thank you
What size tank?
Sump?
Pumps?
Planned livestock?
Budget?
What is your experience in the hobby? What is your goal?
Your question is VERY open ended. There are dozens of ways to setup a viable system.
You may be better served by looking at some local systems. Visit a few local reef club meetings and a few fish stores. It will be MUCH easier for you to make decisions once you have a better grasp of your options.
hey bean i have a few questions for you if you have time to answer.
first of all i decided to go with your overflow system because after reading a couple of times it makes complete sense .
so now this is my setup updated:
55g acrylic
20g long sump
aqua c EV180 with mag 7
i didnt decide on the return pump yet cause i dont know which one its gonna work for me.
livestock:mostly lps
Now my question to you is what size should i use on the pvc to build the overflow system?Bulkheads size?
And what kinda of overflow box should i build?
thank you
Young Frankenstein
New member
yaks
chee what a project hehehehe
chee what a project hehehehe
robertifly
Premium Member
Thanks Bean, I have achieved "TOTAL SILENCE AND FAILSAFE" with your system! I am using a reeflo snapper and om 4way on cl for tank circulation which is silent too. The only noise I have problem with now is the sump return which is using a T4 and one 3/4" return over the top and turned out about .5 to .75" under the water surface. That gives a very good ripple and shimmer effect to the tank without draining too much water into the sump when powered down but also gives a pretty healthy water dripple < is that a new word? effect. How can I silence that without cutting back on the flow any more,
Option 1: I know I could split it out to multiple exits but I like the clean look with only the one pipe over the back since the tank is drilled for everything else.
Option 2: I could just point the return down and drill a siphon break in the pipe(may not be reliable) but that will lose the shimmer effect and surface agitation.
Option 3: Any suggestions?
BTW, thanks again for sharing "YOUR" overflow and silent drain system, it is BY FAR the best I have used or seen anywhere. Robert
Option 1: I know I could split it out to multiple exits but I like the clean look with only the one pipe over the back since the tank is drilled for everything else.
Option 2: I could just point the return down and drill a siphon break in the pipe(may not be reliable) but that will lose the shimmer effect and surface agitation.
Option 3: Any suggestions?
BTW, thanks again for sharing "YOUR" overflow and silent drain system, it is BY FAR the best I have used or seen anywhere. Robert
BeanAnimal
Premium Member
Robert, try a 3/4" loc-line fan nozzle. That is the exact setup I had, but split into TWO 3/4" loc-line fan nozzles. I now use the snapper as the the return pump, split into two loc-line fan nozzles. They are about 3/4" under the water surface (just to the point where they do not cause a vortex.
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