So Overwhlemed help?

[Pandorum]

Okay so first Ill tell you my experience with fish. I have kept Bettas and Guppies, all were in standard freshwater kits or plain bowls, so... not a lot hahaha. I am wanting to get in to SW because a) I am in LOVE with SW fish and corals b) I am wanting to specialize in Marine Biology and I learn best from hands on experience.

I am not able to purchase a tank or get a tank set up right now as I have zero room for one however over the summer I am moving to a larger area and by then I will start to purchase everything that I need. I am asking now because I want to be prepared for success and know upfront what I can and can not afford.

So what I am thinking I want is to go up to ol' Petco for their $1 for a gallon sale and pick up a 50 gallon tank.
A Protein Skimmer.
Powerheads (idk how many?).
Power Filter.
Heater.
Live Rock.
Live Sand.
10,000K and Actinic Lighting
Reef test kit
Salt Mix

Now I am wanting to have a reef tank with mostly Soft Corals as they tend to be the ones I gravitate towards at the LFS. I am also going to add at the very end a Valentini Toby. I want a triggerfish but honestly I don't want to deal with the high level of space they need, their attitudes, and them basically being a Godzilla in my tank. It says the Puffer is a 'With Caution' reef fish and I know they will clear out my cleaning crew pretty easily and might touch my reef, and others have said they did fine because they were added last. I'm okay risking it, their face is adorable and I wouldn't mind, if he becomes a problem, setting him up in his own castle. I might add a Green Mandarin however I'm iffy on my ability to keep the poor guy alive as I know they can be their own Godzilla on the pod population, so maybe in a couple years.

My BIGGEST problem is a sump. When I read up on sumps my head hurts and I want to cry. I see the images and I'm just staring blankly and I don't understand the fishy speak.

Question #1
Can I have a 50 gallon reef tank without a sump if I have enough Live rock/sand, a good Power Filter, and a good Skimmer?
The tank again will only be for corals and 1 fish. Maybe a dragonet but idk. I am okay with HOB equipment. I understand it helps keep water parameters better and ups your water volume. But is it absolutely necessary?

Question #2
If I must have a sump. How can I make one myself for as cheap as possible and as EASY as possible. I don't want some complicated set up that you will find at someones house with a million tanks hooked up and 15 switches with pipes going in every which way.
I read that you can use a Rubbermaid container for a sump.
Where do you put everything for the sump?
How do you get the water in to the sump and control the flow?
How do you return the water?
And what all would I need basically to set this up properly.
Do you have to drill in to your tank? I am NOT trustworthy will powertools.:hammer:


I'm cool with the cycling process, changing water, acclimation process, and all the basic display tank things but a sump makes me want to hide.

ANY help, suggestions, comments, etc are more than welcomed and I am always looking to learn as much as possible. The only thing I ask is for open minded people as I know there are more ways than 1 to get a job done and I appreciate learning from people that believe that as well.

Thanks!
Shandi

 

[worm5406]

Start here:

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1031074

I am not pushing you off, but all of your questions are answered there.

The questions you ask are the manual of a reef tank.

I started (after fresh water) with a 120 with two fluval filters. Upgraded to a HOB skimmer, then upgraded to a 180 with 50 gallon sump.

Sumps are not confusing... Water comes down (gravity) into it, it moves along touching live rock, then gets pumped back to the display tank, only to start the cycle all over again. YES a rubermaid container works wonderful, as long as you have the room and nothing/child/loveone/friend/dog/cat/spilt beer, can fall into it.

Welcome to reef central.

 

[dkeller_nc]

As worm notes, it'll save you a great deal of time, money and frustration to spend a couple of days reading through the "setting up a new tank" threads. You may not understand all of it, and any of us more experienced hobbyists would be the first to admit that there's a lot of jargon associated with this hobby, but it'll still be well worth your time.

With respect to the Petco option and HOB equipment, yes, you certainly can keep a reasonable tank with a HOB skimmer and other equipment without a sump. But a tank with a sump is far easier, and gives you a heck of a lot broader equipment options, not to mention the aesthetic considerations of moving most of the equipment out of the tank.

There's no doubt that a 40 gallon breeder tank from Petco is an inexpensive option (this is about the best small sized reef tank that they sell for $1/gallon during their sales). However, I think you'll find that one of your local fish shops (abbreviated LFS on the forums) can supply you with a "reef ready" 75 gallon tank for about $200, including the plumbing kit. If you choose this option, there's no glass drilling involved - just take the tank home and set it up. You can, however, go to Petco and buy a $/gallon glass tank to use as a sump (many of us do).

Welcome to Reef Central, and don't be afraid to ask questions after you read through the "setting up a new tank" thread - it's what we're here for.

 

[Jdavis8824]

If you like you can check out the innovative marine nano aquariums 10-50 gallons. They have a built in sump in the rear of the tank and is super easy to understand. Comes with 2 overflows and 2 returns with a pump already installed. It has 4 compartments for media, skimmer, refuge, ect. Really good tanks, I have a 20 gallon and couldn't be happier! Although I don't recommend the 16g as they have major leaking issues. But the others are build really well. You could get it running for about for really cheap but I upgraded the hell outta mine and still spent under $800, starting from absolutely nothing.

 

[Sk8r]

for a 50
50 predrilled reef-ready if you can swing it: it'll come with downflow box. If not, a hang on downflow box with piping to 30 gallon sump where skimmer will live.
100 lbs Live rock, aragonite sand. That much primo live rock would be horridly expensive. Get wet, holey and conditioned rock from an lfs, if you have to take a driving trip to go after it. You can also condition rock yourself, but plan on a 12 week cycle and a GFO reactor, because it will come in with mucho phosphate that GFO removes.
Moderately effective skimmer
T5 lighting or reef-rated LED
Heater (Eheim Jager)
No filter.
Pump should deliver 950 gallons per hour. Powerheads not so important if you have that much flow.

 

[Pandorum]

Okay so I've been reading and I found a LFS that is very helpful and not so "stuck" in one frame of mind. I'm more on to a sump now after really reading so, He has two tanks that are predrilled and all ready to go just need a sump tank and he is minimalistic like I am so I just have 1 big worry.
Flooding. What are the odds of the return pump not working all of a sudden and flooding my house? Is there any way to lower the risk?

 

[nmotz]

Okay so I've been reading and I found a LFS that is very helpful and not so "stuck" in one frame of mind. I'm more on to a sump now after really reading so, He has two tanks that are predrilled and all ready to go just need a sump tank and he is minimalistic like I am so I just have 1 big worry.
Flooding. What are the odds of the return pump not working all of a sudden and flooding my house? Is there any way to lower the risk?

Yes, so one of the things about a sump you will notice if you watch videos of them online or see pictures of them is that they are often only a little more than half full with water. This is a failsafe in case the return pump dies. In that case, water will continue to flow down into the sump until the water line in the display tank drops below the overflow box and can no longer drain into the sump. The idea is to leave enough room in your sump to take on this extra water so that there isn't a flood. It might be hard to visualize what I'm saying, but the bottom line is that as long as you have space in your sump, the display tank water won't flood all over the place if your return pump dies.

 

[worm5406]

Always setup a sump so that when 100% of pumps/power is off (including the skimmer) that there is room in the top of the sump for that extra bit of water.

This will involve setting the ATO sensor to the correct height in the return pump section to accommodate water height.

If you notice in a lot of sumps there is a stair step from the input to output of the sump, higher to lower.

It is really not that hard to compute. I actually took my tank and measured from the high point to the pump off, and computed the water volume. Then in making my sump I made my baffles to handle that water in the void space above the last two sections.

 

[IansAquatics]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=XgGamcu5C7g

This helped me immensely when I first started. Modeled my sump refugium literally to this

 

[worm5406]

Yes, if you notice at 4:40 (ish) the view of the sump shows lots of blank air space in the top for power off / drain down.

Just ensure you have room for the top tank to drain down to the bottom of the weirs and drain the pipes.

 

[FraggledRock]

don't buy all that gear from petco. research first.

they have basic gear and double the price.

checkout marinedepot.com or bulkreefsupply.com

 

[FraggledRock]

stay away from API test kits. waste of money.

 

[footyreefer]

Get quality epuipment the first time around. Don't skimp on things like return pumps, skimmers, powerheads, lights, and etc. Doing that will save you so much money in the long run and will also be more beneficial to your livestock. We all went through the pain of buying some cheap but crappy light or powerhead just to upgrade it later on. First thing you should do is set a budget for yourself. cruise on RC looking at people's builds with the same size tank to give you inspiration and ideas. Go on YouTube and watch videos on things you are unsure about. And lastly ask questions. RC is the best place to ask questions bc no one here is trying to sell you stuff. Some LFS in genuinely caring for you and your tank, but most arent. Good luck with your tank and ask those questions!!!

 

[ardsman]

I found out the hard way not to go cheap, I now have a large Tote full of equipment that just "did the job", now I keep them just for possible failures of my better equipment. Get as big an RO/DI unit as you can and a good ATO unit. that was the best advice I was given when I started and I ignored it for about 2 months, ended up getting them both and have never looked back.