Softies, Zoa, Nem dosing

[lv_reefer]

hello,
The days of water change are behind me. There are many ways to export nutrients, namely, algae scrubber and cheato, GFO, carbon..
I am using algae scrubber and cheato in my 250g DT.
I want to get a survey of the dosing and tests for
Tenya tree, leather corals, mushrooms, zoa and anemone and clownfish tank.
I am researching on All-For-Reef complete solution. But it is using Ca as the indicator of dosing amount. Since softies don't
use Ca. It would be a wong indicator for them.
I believe I'll need iodine for the softies and iron for the cheato, but not sure on other trace element. What to test for?
Please give your opinion.
Thank you

 

[Reefing102]

I can’t help to much as I don’t dose on my softie tank, but I’ll give ya a free bump.

@Timfish @kharmaguru any thoughts?

 

[kharmaguru]

I don't dose anything for softies except some random iodine, however I do water changes, dose ammonia, and chaeto gro so they likely benefit from something I'm adding anyway. Also I'm dosing strontium lately as a coralline growth experiment.

I think since you have a large display and you are stopping water changes, that you could do an experiment of your own. Don't dose anything, do an ICP test once a month or whatever interval you choose for a few months, and see what actually depletes. Obviously your algae scrubber will consume stuff as well but it's still useful information. You could come up with real recommendations rather than the anecdotal BS that we all adhere to.

 

[JTP424]

I've got a 15 gallon with some toadstools, leathers, Kenyas, zoas etc (and some other corals) I dose AFR and AB+ due to simplicity. If you can get the powdered an make it for an auto doser AFR might be a place to at least start and then adjust.

 

[shred5]

Here is the thing with water changes. They add elements that are used up but they also reduce things that may build up over time and things we have no way of measuring or even know how to remove.

Algae and coral allopathy could be a big thing. I think with improvements in testing will will start to figure this out. I think the reason so many can see a improvement after a water change is this. In the wild most of these chemicals gat washed away and really only affect animals close by.. What happens in our reef? Where do these chemicals go that are meant to actually kill other corals or algae. We also have no idea how these chemicals are removed. Some feel poly-filter or carbon may partly remove them but do they? How do we know? I am going to guess it is playing a big part in some mysterious crashes of our reef tanks or I do not know why my tank looks so bad but all parameters test out fine. I think we will eventually start finding out how bad Allopathy is and find a way to test for it. I think this may be a part of old tank syndrome.

ICP test cant and do not test for everything.

Also most three/two part additives add elements in certain quantities but most of these elements we have no idea at what rate they are being used up in our aquariums. Not to mention some of these can bind to the substrate and maybe released later. So if lets say you are adding a 2 part or 3 part and your tank is only using up 25 % of element "A". So what happens to the rest of element "A" at next dose? Does it build up and at what point does element "A" become toxic?

There also things leaching into our tank from like plastics.

Water changes help maintain balance to me so some of these things do not build up over time and cause crashes.


All I am saying is when we add all these broad-spectrum additives we have no idea how much or how fast each one of those elements is depleted. We are getting a better understanding of some of them with ICP. So to me water changes are still one of the most long term benefits to our tanks we can do to keep that balance. I know the average reefer in this hobby does not last long anymore anyway.

 

[Timfish]

hello,
The days of water change are behind me. There are many ways to export nutrients, namely, algae scrubber and cheato, GFO, carbon..
I am using algae scrubber and cheato in my 250g DT.
I want to get a survey of the dosing and tests for
Tenya tree, leather corals, mushrooms, zoa and anemone and clownfish tank.
I am researching on All-For-Reef complete solution. But it is using Ca as the indicator of dosing amount. Since softies don't
use Ca. It would be a wong indicator for them.
I believe I'll need iodine for the softies and iron for the cheato, but not sure on other trace element. What to test for?
Please give your opinion.
Thank you

Sadly, I have to say you seem misinformed to me. Octocorals do need calcium and some have significant amounts of calcium in hte form of spicules in their tissue. Since DIC, aka HCO3, aka Alk, aka bicarbonate, is essential for photosynthesis maintaining alkalinity is important too. Unfortunately the most important things going on in marine systems we can't test for, hence the need to do water changes to help corals keep things to their liking (they are manipulating microbail stuff not only in their surface mucus layers but in the water around them).

Here's some links:


"Coral Reefs in the Microbial Seas" This video compliments Rohwer's book of the same title (Paper back is ~$20, Kindle is ~$10), both deal with the conflicting roles of the different types of DOC in reef ecosystems. While there is overlap bewteen his book and the video both have information not covered by the other and together give a broader view of the complex relationships found in reef ecosystems

Changing Seas - Mysterious Microbes

Microbial view of Coral Decline

Nitrogen cycling in hte coral holobiont

BActeria and Sponges

Maintenance of Coral Reef Health (refferences at the end)
Maintenance of Coral Reef Health

Optical Feedback Loop in Colorful Coral Bleaching
Optical Feedback Loop in Colorful Coral Bleaching / Curr. Biol., May 21, 2020 (Vol. 30, Issue 13)

DNA Sequencing and the Reef Tank Microbiome
Aquabiomics: DNA Sequencing and the Reef Tank Microbiome

Richard Ross What's up with phosphate"
What's up with phosphate? by Richard Ross | MACNA 2014

15 Answers
How 15 Answers Changed the Way I Look at My Tank Forever! 10 Months of Biome Cycling 12 Aquariums.