some help on future SH setup

[francinemarie]

hello everyone, i'm new to the forums & SH keeping! I'll be totally honest & say that I have never owned a saltwater aquarium, but own an aquatic turtle setup. I know there are huge differences between them, I'm just clarifying that I own something in water .

I've always been fascinated by seahorses & I also recently went to an aquarium last week. This is what ignited ambition to research on seahorses & to my surprise, I learned that you can also own a few Seahorses! I couldn't believe it, I always thought Seahorses could only be kept in public aquariums. I've done tons of research: reading about Sh species, articles, recommended SH websites, viewed pictures of SHs & their owners tank setups, watched videos of SHs in their tanks, & a whole lot more! I fully understand the amount of work & effort that these beautiful animals need to grow.

Right now I am not looking to buy any seahorses or set up the tank anytime soon, but I will be later in the future. For now I would like to post my idea of a SH set up so that I can be guided by all you amazing SH owners to make it the best & most comfortable for my future Seahorses. This is what I what believe is best so far for a SH set up (please not that I am also under a budget):

I am looking to keep a a pair of H. Reidi or H. Erectus (preferably the Reidi) in a Seahorse ONLY set up. I want two of the same sex so that they do not mate because I am not equipped with the correct setup to breed SH fry. I've read that most SH owners recommend Seahoursesource.com, so I plan on buying them from there. I've seen 2 Reidi's at my LFS, but I'm a bit hesitant to buy them from there; poor things are kept in a small tank, I wish I could rescue them.

I would like to keep them in, at least, a 29 gallon tank. I have a 20 gallon long, but I learned that it's too shallow for them & they need taller tanks. I've seen great deals on bigger tanks, but I currently don't have the money or space to put them in; hopefully I will in the future. But whatever tank I get & because I am a beginner at this, I plan on starting off with one pair first.

I would like the tank to be bare bottom & with live rock. I have read the cycling process over & over again so that I fully understand it & have it memorized. My LFS told me (as long as it's been in their tank long enough), that they do sell full cured live rocks. Also, is 20lbs of live rock for US$ 9.95 a good buy? Is there a specific type of LR that I need? I saw at my LFS that they have Fiji LR, I am not sure what the difference is. I don't think I'm ready for LC yet & I'm hesitant to use LS.

Tank mates: Maybe a a few snails as a clean up crew. I would like to get the snails that names start with a N, I'm not sure how to correctly spell their name, sorry . I would be buying them from my LFS. Other than these snails, that's all I want as their tankmates.

Filtration: I would like to use a hang on tank filter such as Aquaclear. Anyone have suggestions to what kind of HOT filter I should use? I think I'll also have a protein skimmer I'm not sure what type is recommended though. I know most people here use sumps or canisters, but canisters can be expensive & I'm still illiterate to the sump idea even the DIY sumps.

Macro algae: i'm a bit confused with this. I need some info on what type to use & where to buy them.

Heater: I've read the optimum temperatures recommended for Reidis or Erectus on Seahorsesource.com & I do have AC in my house, so I think the temperature should be ok. Could anyone recommended a water heater brand? I will also look into buying a heater guard so that the SH don't get hurt or burned. Also, what's the ratio for watts per gallon for a SH set up?

For whatever reason, if the temp. rises is it possible to keep a standing fan next to the tank to keep the temp. in the tank at the proper temp.? The fan head would aerate from left to right so that it's not constantly blowing air towards the tank. Is this a possible way to keep the tank cool other than using a chiller? Sorry if it was a dumb idea.

Lighting: I am also stumped here. I don't know what kind of lighting to use for a SH set up.

Foods: My LFS sells frozen mysis shrimp & that's where I'll be buying from. I also seen them at Petsmart & Petco. I don't think I'll be feeding them Brine shrimp since I learned that they are not recommended. Or maybe I misunderstood? I would like to feed them krill or ghost shrimp too. Are these foods enough?

Hitching posts[/]b: I believe they can hitch onto some of the LR. I would add some fake corals

All advice & information is welcome! thank you for taking your time to read my thread!

 

[francinemarie]

anyone?

I can't remember, but what does LS help with? I may decide to put 1" of LS in the tank. Still not sure

I have also looked into making my own refugium through using half of a HOB Aquaclear 110 (formerly 500) to house some rock & macro. what kind of macro should i use?

this is the info i found on it: AquaClear "500" Power Filter - Maximum Output: 500 U.S. Gal. (1892 l) per hour - Full Flow Control: 166 U.S. Gal. (630 l) per hour - Power Consumption: 14 W - Maximum Aquarium Capacity: 150 U.S. Gal. (567 l) - AquaClear is backed by a two year warranty - Flow Control: Simply shift the patented "Flow Adjustment Control" at the the intake siphon. When the "Flow Adjustment Control" is at its greatest blockage, AquaClear's input and exhaust volumes are approximately a third of its maximum capacity.

the other half will consist of a sponge & carbon. is this an ok set up for a refugium/filter?

This is probably a dumb question, but could someone tell me what this is used for, Via Aqua 360, 150 gph pumps?

I still haven't figured out what kind of heater or light fixture to use. Maybe buy 2 small heater & put both on opposite ends of the tank?

please help

 

[francinemarie]

could anyone please give me feedback on if I have the basic idea of a good SH set up?

 

[SaylorsReef]

I’ll answer what I can.

Seahorsesource.com is a great place to purchase your seahorses and your supplies. The staff is also very helpful in answering questions. Their website has a guide for tank size listed for each species.

If you are talking about Nassarius snails, these typically hide out in the sand bed until they smell food. They are a great snail to have.

If it were me, I would purchase live rock that was not cured to cycle the tank. I would place it in the tank, after a I did a hypersalinity dip to rid unwanted pests. See here: http://www.liveaquaria.com/PIC/article.cfm?aid=209

Depending on the temperature of your home, you may not need a heater. Check the seahorsesource.com species guide for temperature recommendations. In fact, you may find that you need fans.

In my opinion a protein skimmer is your best choice for filtration. The foods used to feed seahorses can quickly foul the water. You may want to consider a feeding dish for your SH, so that you can easily clean up any uneaten food.

I personally like having a sump because it allows more water volume, decreasing the chances of the water going south quickly, a place to hide the skimmer and other equipment I’m using.

Seahorses do not need any special lighting. Save yourself some money and go with the typical stock lighting found at most of the chains if you are not going to be keeping coral.

I only feed PE Mysis shrimp, or newly hatched Brine.

This article may help you with some of your questions:

http://www.wetwebmedia.com/ca/volume_2/cav2i5/Filtration/Filtration.htm

 

[rayjay]

Re: some help on future SH setup

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14605783#post14605783 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by francinemarie
I've read that most SH owners recommend Seahoursesource.com, so I plan on buying them from there. I've seen 2 Reidi's at my LFS, but I'm a bit hesitant to buy them from there; poor things are kept in a small tank, I wish I could rescue them.

Please don't buy any seahorse unless the seller can show that it is captive bred and tank raised. Too many stores are selling net pen raised seahorses with the same pathogens that come with wild caught horses but with the advantage that they've been trained to eat frozen mysis shrimp.

I would like to keep them in, at least, a 29 gallon tank. I have a 20 gallon long, but I learned that it's too shallow for them & they need taller tanks.

If you are not going to breed them, you don't need a taller tank, but I agree that the 29 would be the smallest size I would keep a pair of H. Reidi's in.

I would like the tank to be bare bottom & with live rock.

I prefer bare bottom tanks, with live rock and heavy protein skimming (commonly known as the Berlin method of filtration) myself.
However, there are many different ways to succeed in the hobby but this is just what I find easiest.

I have read the cycling process over & over again so that I fully understand it & have it memorized.

I thought I had a heads up with over ten years in the salt water aquarium hobby, but it ended up I had to do a lot more learning for the seahorse hobby.

My LFS told me (as long as it's been in their tank long enough), that they do sell full cured live rocks. Also, is 20lbs of live rock for US$ 9.95 a good buy? Is there a specific type of LR that I need? I saw at my LFS that they have Fiji LR, I am not sure what the difference is. I don't think I'm ready for LC yet & I'm hesitant to use LS.

The LFS has a vested interest in selling to you, and most don't mind telling a few fibs to do so. Also, not all really have a handle on what is really needed to raise seahorses, or for that matter, how to properly look after a marine set up of any kind. Before you take for granted what they tell you, it is best to verify the information first, as in checking here in the articles sections, and by using the search function of the forum.
I can't say what is a good buy as far as rock goes as it varies in price across the continent, especially here in Canada.
For me, I don't care where the rock comes from if it meets my criteria.
First, it must be VERY porous and lightweight as that determines how effective the piece will function as a part of the biological filter. If you have two pieces same physical size but one weights more than the other, the heavier piece will not have as much surface area for the bacteria to develop on. Also, while heavier pieces may be sold cheaper per pound, they can cost sometimes as much as a lighter weight quality piece because of it's heavier weight.
The lighter the pieces, the less space you need to take up in the tank for a proper biological filter.
You can save money by purchasing dry reef rock, but keep in mind not to think you are purchasing light weight rock, as it feels quite light compared to wet rock. The same principle applys and you have to consider only the lightest of pieces.
Advantage is you can now sterilize this rock and then after placing it in the tank you can introduce an ammonia source to cycle the tank, and it will become live rock again, but will not be a carrier of pathogens and critters that might be detrimental to seahorse keeping.
The second thing is that the piece appeals to me esthetically and/or has a functional shape to accomplish the look I want.
As for LC, because I try to keep my tanks quite cool, most corals that I keep in my reef tanks don't fare well at the lower temperature and lower lighting I have on my seahorse tanks so I no longer try to keep corals in them. (Gives me an excuse to keep other tanks)
Live sand has the advantage of adding more surface area for biological filtration, but in my opinion, it also retains too much of food waste, thereby negating it's advantage right off. I find it much simpler to be able to vacuum up the crap from the bare bottom of the tank. Again, just a personal choice to make.

Tank mates: Maybe a a few snails as a clean up crew. I would like to get the snails that names start with a N, I'm not sure how to correctly spell their name, sorry . I would be buying them from my LFS. Other than these snails, that's all I want as their tankmates.

May use snails as clean up crew but I chose not to, even in any of my reef tanks. Again, just a personal choice. I see how many snails die in LFS tanks, and other hobbyist tanks and figure I don't need that as I vacuum my seahorse tanks every time I feed anyway.

Filtration: I would like to use a hang on tank filter such as Aquaclear. Anyone have suggestions to what kind of HOT filter I should use? I think I'll also have a protein skimmer I'm not sure what type is recommended though. I know most people here use sumps or canisters, but canisters can be expensive & I'm still illiterate to the sump idea even the DIY sumps.

This is another personal choice. I have an aquaclear on one seahorse tank but I only use it as a water mover and have nothing in it. I don't like having to frequently clean the crap out of them, and if you don't, the decaying of anything trapped, leads to dissolved organics and other elements that feed nuisance algae.
A protein skimmer on the other hand, can remove dissolved organics before they become food for the algae. I only use a canister filter for the occasional water polishing by hooking it up to run the water through carbon.

Macro algae: i'm a bit confused with this. I need some info on what type to use & where to buy them.

Can't help here as I don't have any.

Heater: I've read the optimum temperatures recommended for Reidis or Erectus on Seahorsesource.com & I do have AC in my house, so I think the temperature should be ok. Could anyone recommended a water heater brand? I will also look into buying a heater guard so that the SH don't get hurt or burned. Also, what's the ratio for watts per gallon for a SH set up?

For whatever reason, if the temp. rises is it possible to keep a standing fan next to the tank to keep the temp. in the tank at the proper temp.? The fan head would aerate from left to right so that it's not constantly blowing air towards the tank. Is this a possible way to keep the tank cool other than using a chiller? Sorry if it was a dumb idea.

I don't see a need for a heater at all because my house never gets below 68°F unless the power is out, and if the power is out the heater won't help me anyway.

Lighting: I am also stumped here. I don't know what kind of lighting to use for a SH set up.

Because I don't want the heat of intensive lighting, I don't keep corals and can use the cheaper lamp set ups that you can buy in Walmart or hardware stores. The lighting is only for my pleasure, to be able to see my seahorses.

Foods: My LFS sells frozen mysis shrimp & that's where I'll be buying from. I also seen them at Petsmart & Petco. I don't think I'll be feeding them Brine shrimp since I learned that they are not recommended. Or maybe I misunderstood? I would like to feed them krill or ghost shrimp too. Are these foods enough?

I feed frozen P.E. Mysis as the pieces are generally less chewed up than other brands, but have to use Hikari which has smaller mysis, for my smaller horses.
I use live adult brine shrimp, gut loaded, about once a week, but that is not necessary unless you are having to get some meds into the seahorses.
That leads to another topic you haven't mentioned. Because seahorses are so prone to becoming ill, you should have a dispensary on hand so you don't have to wait until you obtain the meds to start treatment. There are lists of what you need and can be found on either of the two seahorse specific forums I believe.

Hitching posts[/]b: I believe they can hitch onto some of the LR. I would add some fake corals

Some people with macro have natural hitching posts, but I use the fake things myself.
Good luck!

 

[francinemarie]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14613101#post14613101 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by SaylorsReef

In my opinion a protein skimmer is your best choice for filtration. The foods used to feed seahorses can quickly foul the water. You may want to consider a feeding dish for your SH, so that you can easily clean up any uneaten food.
[/B]

yep i'm most likely going to buy my seahorses from there. And yes I meant the Nassarius snails, but they mostly need sand in the tank & I don't think i'll be using sand. But I have a few other options for other snails.

Why would you buy uncured rock though? I've been reading sites that say it's best to buy fully cured rock. I believe Seahorse.org says that too. And thank you for the article! As soon as I get the chance, I'll read it.

Hmm, maybe when I start cycling my tank I'll check the temperature & see if I'll need a heater or not. I've also read on different ways to cool your tank.

What kind of protein skimmer would you suggest? Any specific brand? I think I've read that Aqua C Remora are good, I'm not sure. Sump ideas are a good choice of filtration, but I don't think I'll have enough money to invest on one & no matter how much I try reading on them, I still get confused on it's concept of how to make one.

Is any regular tank lighting ok? What kind do you use?

Yep, I've also listed down PE mysis to feed to my future seahorses, but probably not Brine shrimp because they're not fully recommended as a good food sourse for SHs. Thank you for your help!

 

[francinemarie]

Re: Re: some help on future SH setup

Re: Re: some help on future SH setup

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14613442#post14613442 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by rayjay

The LFS has a vested interest in selling to you, and most don't mind telling a few fibs to do so. Also, not all really have a handle on what is really needed to raise seahorses, or for that matter, how to properly look after a marine set up of any kind. Before you take for granted what they tell you, it is best to verify the information first, as in checking here in the articles sections, and by using the search function of the forum.
I can't say what is a good buy as far as rock goes as it varies in price across the continent, especially here in Canada.
For me, I don't care where the rock comes from if it meets my criteria.
First, it must be VERY porous and lightweight as that determines how effective the piece will function as a part of the biological filter. If you have two pieces same physical size but one weights more than the other, the heavier piece will not have as much surface area for the bacteria to develop on. Also, while heavier pieces may be sold cheaper per pound, they can cost sometimes as much as a lighter weight quality piece because of it's heavier weight.
The lighter the pieces, the less space you need to take up in the tank for a proper biological filter.
You can save money by purchasing dry reef rock, but keep in mind not to think you are purchasing light weight rock, as it feels quite light compared to wet rock. The same principle applys and you have to consider only the lightest of pieces.
Advantage is you can now sterilize this rock and then after placing it in the tank you can introduce an ammonia source to cycle the tank, and it will become live rock again, but will not be a carrier of pathogens and critters that might be detrimental to seahorse keeping.
The second thing is that the piece appeals to me esthetically and/or has a functional shape to accomplish the look I want.
As for LC, because I try to keep my tanks quite cool, most corals that I keep in my reef tanks don't fare well at the lower temperature and lower lighting I have on my seahorse tanks so I no longer try to keep corals in them. (Gives me an excuse to keep other tanks)
Live sand has the advantage of adding more surface area for biological filtration, but in my opinion, it also retains too much of food waste, thereby negating it's advantage right off. I find it much simpler to be able to vacuum up the crap from the bare bottom of the tank. Again, just a personal choice to make.

Good luck! [/B]

I need to read that part about the LR more slowly. I never read anything that mentioned that it should be lightweight. Also, is it better to buy them uncured?

I won't be buying any SHs from my LFS. I don't want to risk the possibility of them being WC. I'll be buying them from Seahorsesource.com . I won't be breeding them, but is it still suggested to keep them in a taller tank?

As you mentioned, I'm leaning towards the Berlin method of filtration too. But what kind of protein skimmer would you suggest? Is aqua C remora a good brand? Is there a cheap price on a good type of skimmer? I read that most people are against skimmer because the produce micro bubbles.

How do you add the saltwater to your tank? Where or when do you mix the salt with your water? What kind of salt do you use?

I might buy some snails, but not a lot.

I prefer the Aquaclear . I posted the details on the one I chose. Does it have too much flow or enough?

Yea you're right about the heater. When I cycle my tank, I'll check the temp. & see whether or not I need one.

Can I use any type of lighting? What kind do you use for your tank? I also don't want my lighting to give off any heat.

I'll be feeding my future SHs PE mysis along with other types of foods. Thank you for reminding me about the meds for SHs, I forgot to add that.

 

[rayjay]

Re: Re: Re: some help on future SH setup

Re: Re: Re: some help on future SH setup

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14614763#post14614763 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by francinemarie
I need to read that part about the LR more slowly. I never read anything that mentioned that it should be lightweight. Also, is it better to buy them uncured?

My next seahorse tank will have "dead" live rock. I will sterilize the rock with hydrochloric acid (you can use vinegar), rinse it well, put it in the tank and add ammonia to cycle the tank.
I want to be sure there is no prior source of ANYTHING nasty getting into the tank.
That's why I suggested buying dry rock as it will work just fine and is cheaper, or at least it should be.
As for the light weight aspect, most people don't think about it, but for sure, given the same size pieces of rock, choose the lightest because the lightest one will have more surface area for beneficial bacteria to grow on.

I won't be breeding them, but is it still suggested to keep them in a taller tank?

Not needed unless you want to do it in case down the road you change your mind and get a breeding pair.

what kind of protein skimmer would you suggest? Is aqua C remora a good brand? Is there a cheap price on a good type of skimmer? I read that most people are against skimmer because the produce micro bubbles.

I have never bought a protein skimmer so I can't help you out on brands or quality or price. I build all my own.
As for micro bubbles, I haven't had that problem but if someone finds a problem with a skimmer producing such bubbles, I suspect it is just not properly set.

How do you add the saltwater to your tank? Where or when do you mix the salt with your water? What kind of salt do you use?

I mix up my salt water in a container and aerate it for at least overnight. Once the specific gravity (or salinity) is where I want it, then I can add it to my tank.
It doesn't matter what salt you use because they all work. I happen to use I.O. because it is cheapest in my area.

I prefer the Aquaclear . I posted the details on the one I chose. Does it have too much flow or enough?

I use that same one on my 40g tall and cut the flow down just a touch. You may find it a bit much for a 29.

Can I use any type of lighting? What kind do you use for your tank? I also don't want my lighting to give off any heat.

If you don't have corals you can use any light you want, even a clamp on light with bulb if you want. It will only be so you can view and enjoy your tank.

 

[francinemarie]

Re: Re: Re: Re: some help on future SH setup

Re: Re: Re: Re: some help on future SH setup

My next seahorse tank will have "dead" live rock. I will sterilize the rock with hydrochloric acid (you can use vinegar), rinse it well, put it in the tank and add ammonia to cycle the tank.
I want to be sure there is no prior source of ANYTHING nasty getting into the tank.
That's why I suggested buying dry rock as it will work just fine and is cheaper, or at least it should be.
As for the light weight aspect, most people don't think about it, but for sure, given the same size pieces of rock, choose the lightest because the lightest one will have more surface area for beneficial bacteria to grow on.

Cycling the tank with live rock is the only thing about a SH setup that is somewhat confusing me. Mostly because there are many types of LR & different ways to do it.

Is "dead" LR the same thing as dry rock? How do you spread the hydrochloric acid on the "dead" LR. Where could I find 100% ammonia?

What I have understood so far is that it's better to buy lightweight LR. So for example, if I were to go to a LFS & possibly purchase some of their LR, I would grab a few out of the tank & estimate which ones are heavier than the others? Then I would buy the lighter ones?

Not needed unless you want to do it in case down the road you change your mind and get a breeding pair.

I doubt I'll decide to eventually breed SHs. And if I do, it won't be for a VERY long time. I have a 20 gallon long. Would that be enough to house 2 female H. Reidis?

I have never bought a protein skimmer so I can't help you out on brands or quality or price. I build all my own.
As for micro bubbles, I haven't had that problem but if someone finds a problem with a skimmer producing such bubbles, I suspect it is just not properly set.

If I use an Aquaclear filter, house half of it with a refugium & use LR, do I still need a protein skimmer in the tank?

I mix up my salt water in a container and aerate it for at least overnight. Once the specific gravity (or salinity) is where I want it, then I can add it to my tank.
It doesn't matter what salt you use because they all work. I happen to use I.O. because it is cheapest in my area.

Does it matter what kind of water you use to mix with the salt? My house has a water purifier system, so all the water we use or drink isn't tap water. The water is purified, would that be ok to mix with the salt?

How do you aerate the mixture? Do you use an air pump?

How would you measure the salinity in the container? Do you use a hydrometer?

I use that same one on my 40g tall and cut the flow down just a touch. You may find it a bit much for a 29.

Would the AquaClear (the one I plan on getting) be too strong for a 20 gallon long? I could decrease the flow all the way so that it is at it's lowest. Or would it still be too strong?

If you don't have corals you can use any light you want, even a clamp on light with bulb if you want. It will only be so you can view and enjoy your tank.

Would you happen to know what kind of light source a refugium needs to grow?

Also, how do you do water changes? When you do them, do you have to prepare & mix more salt to your water that you'll exchange into the tank? Or do you use regular freshwater?

...sorry for so many questions

 

[francinemarie]

help please?

 

[rayjay]

Cycling the tank indeed can be done in many ways. The method of using uncured live rock is so that the die off that is inevitable, produces the ammonia to start/feed the cycle.
At one time, people used damsels to produce the ammonia and cycle the tank (ammonia comes from decaying uneaten food and from fish waste) but because it quite often caused the death of the fishes, or at best, caused them a lot of stress, the practice has been discontinued for the most part.
I bought a bottle of ammonium chloride that I use, but all you have to do is introduce a source of ammonia like food, and as it decays, it produces the ammonia for the cycle.
Yes, dry rock is dead rock, formerly live rock, but it becomes live again in the salt water when ammonia is introduced.
When choosing the pieces of rock, comparing weight for similar size is part of making the choice, but also, looking at the pieces you many times can see the increased "porosity", but you choose shapes that will also aid in assembling the "reef" in your tank.
IMO if you go with the 20g long, you will have to always be sure to keep the tank clean. It only takes a tiny bit of neglect to produce harmful bacteria conditions that can cost you the life of your horses.
The less water in the system, the faster things can go south.
If you use filter material in the Aquaclear, you will need to keep cleaning that material perhaps every 3 days to remove captured detritua that decays, causing water condition problems.
A protein skimmer is not an absolute necessity but certainly makes the water cleaner and less likely to cause problems with a little less work, fewer water changes. I can't really comment on refugiums as I've never had one.
As for mixing salt water, preferred water is RO/DI unless you know by your local utilities water tests that the water is sufficiently treated enough to not be a problem.
You can use an air pump or power head, or both as I do, to aerate the new mix overnight.
I don't know what your water condition is, or what the house filter system is so I can't properly advise on that.
A refractometer tells you the salinity, the hydrometer gives specific gravity readings. Properly set up, the refractometer would normally be more accurate.
The Aquaclear 500 would most likely be too much flow for the 20g long unless the flow is cut down and the water flow deflected to spread it out on re-entry to the tank.
Water change frequency is dependent on many things so that every tank has it's own needs, depending on bio load, method of filtration, frequency of removing uneaten foods, etc...
Water changes are done with newly aerated salt water of the same s.g. and temperature of the tank water.
I do daily top up of water you use for making salt water, to keep the specific gravity more stable due to change from evaporation.

 

[francinemarie]

Cycling the tank indeed can be done in many ways. The method of using uncured live rock is so that the die off that is inevitable, produces the ammonia to start/feed the cycle.
At one time, people used damsels to produce the ammonia and cycle the tank (ammonia comes from decaying uneaten food and from fish waste) but because it quite often caused the death of the fishes, or at best, caused them a lot of stress, the practice has been discontinued for the most part.

I bought a bottle of ammonium chloride that I use, but all you have to do is introduce a source of ammonia like food, and as it decays, it produces the ammonia for the cycle.
Yes, dry rock is dead rock, formerly live rock, but it becomes live again in the salt water when ammonia is introduced.

So when decide to start cycling my tank, I can just add PE mysis or any kind of food to introduce ammonia in the cycle?

When choosing the pieces of rock, comparing weight for similar size is part of making the choice, but also, looking at the pieces you many times can see the increased "porosity", but you choose shapes that will also aid in assembling the "reef" in your tank.

How can you tell if the rock is very porous or not?

IMO if you go with the 20g long, you will have to always be sure to keep the tank clean. It only takes a tiny bit of neglect to produce harmful bacteria conditions that can cost you the life of your horses. The less water in the system, the faster things can go south.

Ok. I think I'll wait & save for a bigger tank . What size tank would you suggest to buy so that the hobbyist doesn't have to do frequent water changes?

If you use filter material in the Aquaclear, you will need to keep cleaning that material perhaps every 3 days to remove captured detritua that decays, causing water condition problems.

I was planning on housing half of the Aquaclear into refugium. But what kind of HOB filter would you suggest to use instead of the Aquaclear? Maybe one that comes with the biowheel, but I could just take the biowheel off?

A protein skimmer is not an absolute necessity but certainly makes the water cleaner and less likely to cause problems with a little less work, fewer water changes. I can't really comment on refugiums as I've never had one.

If you don't mind me asking, how big is you SH tank & what equipment do you use for it?

As for mixing salt water, preferred water is RO/DI unless you know by your local utilities water tests that the water is sufficiently treated enough to not be a problem.

I read that RO/DI water basically purifies & removes impurities from tap water so that it can be used in an aquarium. That sounds exactly what my dad has installed into our water system in our house. Our water purifier purifies the entire household water system. According to what I've read so far, it seems like I wouldn't have a problem using our household water since it has already been purified.

Thank you so much for the info & on helping me out!

 

[rayjay]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14633681#post14633681 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by francinemarie
So when decide to start cycling my tank, I can just add PE mysis or any kind of food to introduce ammonia in the cycle?

Yes, it takes a little longer because decay process has to produce the ammonia instead of just adding ammonia. I like to save the time by adding ammonium chloride that I bought from the drug store.

How can you tell if the rock is very porous or not?

As I mentioned before, just by comparing pieces and looking for lot's of little holes. You only compare dry pieces with dry and wet pieces with wet

Ok. I think I'll wait & save for a bigger tank . What size tank would you suggest to buy so that the hobbyist doesn't have to do frequent water changes?

I personally like a 40g tall for up to 4 Reidi's, but a 29 would suffice for a pair.

I was planning on housing half of the Aquaclear into refugium. But what kind of HOB filter would you suggest to use instead of the Aquaclear? Maybe one that comes with the biowheel, but I could just take the biowheel off?

It wouldn't be any different using another HOB. Any filter material in any mechanical filter is going to need frequent cleaning.
Why not just use the whole HOB filter for a refugium and for water flow? If you have enough rock for the filtration you don't need any filter material in it. Also, if you are doing preventive maintenance and vacuuming out left over food, will be replacing what is sucked out by vacuuming with new salt water, again helping water condition.

If you don't mind me asking, how big is you SH tank & what equipment do you use for it?

20g quarantine tank with bare bottom and rock filtration (originally dead rock), small powerhead for water flow as well as open ended airline to aid aeration.
40g tall again rock filtration, skimmer, Aquaclear 500 no filter material, open ended airline, and bare bottom.

I read that RO/DI water basically purifies & removes impurities from tap water so that it can be used in an aquarium. That sounds exactly what my dad has installed into our water system in our house. Our water purifier purifies the entire household water system. According to what I've read so far, it seems like I wouldn't have a problem using our household water since it has already been purified.

Not all purification systems are the same, and not all area's have the same water quality out of the tap.
If your household filtration is RO or RO/DI, then it's fine. If it is NOT at least RO, then the filtration system is inferior and depending on the local water quality, may not be sufficient.

 

[rayjay]

I should have mentioned earlier, that what I post is only based on my own experiences and is my own opinion. It is not the only way, nor is it necessarily the best way to do things, just that it is the way I choose to do things.
Please take the time to also research other ways before you choose the way you want to proceed with.
Use the search feature on individual topics to see how others feel on those topics.

 

[francinemarie]

Yes, it takes a little longer because decay process has to produce the ammonia instead of just adding ammonia. I like to save the time by adding ammonium chloride that I bought from the drug store.

I guess I'll buy ammonium chloride instead of using food. Saves me money on buying more food & less time waiting on cycling the tank .

As I mentioned before, just by comparing pieces and looking for lot's of little holes. You only compare dry pieces with dry and wet pieces with wet

Sorry, I realized you did mention it .

I personally like a 40g tall for up to 4 Reidi's, but a 29 would suffice for a pair.

So I assume any tank (that is not long) between 29-40 gallons would be alright for 2 female Reidis?

It wouldn't be any different using another HOB. Any filter material in any mechanical filter is going to need frequent cleaning.
Why not just use the whole HOB filter for a refugium and for water flow? If you have enough rock for the filtration you don't need any filter material in it. Also, if you are doing preventive maintenance and vacuuming out left over food, will be replacing what is sucked out by vacuuming with new salt water, again helping water condition.

I thought that the HOB Aquaclear needed carbon to help filter the tank, which is why I thought to make half of it a refugium. Thank you for letting me know! I actually have a HOB Aquaclear 70, but the motor seems to be broken. I was thinking about buying a new Aquaclear filter with the sufficient amount of flow instead of buying a new motor.

40g tall again rock filtration, skimmer, Aquaclear 500 no filter material, open ended airline, and bare bottom.

I've been debating on whether or not I should get a skimmer. I'm leaning towards not getting one because of the amount of cost for equipment & materials. What kind of skimmer do you use?

If your household filtration is RO or RO/DI, then it's fine. If it is NOT at least RO, then the filtration system is inferior and depending on the local water quality, may not be sufficient.

I'll check to make sure that our filtration has at least RO, thank you

 

[francinemarie]

I made a list of the equipment needed for a SH tank. please let me know if anything needs to be added or edited:

Items needed to cycle tank:
- Salt water test kit â€"œ pH (8.0-8.3), ammonia (0), nitrate (<20ppm), nitrite (0)
- hydrometer (measures specific gravity 1.020-1.024)
- Refractometer (measures salinity)
- thermometer (4 watts/gallon)
- ammonium chloride

Medic kit: (rayjay- your thread gave me the sufficient amount of info needed to make sure I buy the correct materials. thank you everyone who posted in the info on his thread!)

Antiparasitc & Antifungal
Formalin 37%
Methylene Blue

Wide spectrum antibiotic:
First choice - Nitrofurazone (Furan 2)
Second choice - Neomycin & Triple Sulpha

Gas Bubble Disease Treatment: Acetazolamide (Diamox) Needs Prescription or order out of the country.

Topical antibiotic:
Triple antibiotic - Neosporin or BioBandage

Deworming:
Metronidazole - Metro+
Fenbendazole - Panacur
Praziquantel - PraziPro

Sedation:
Clove Oil

Tools to have:
- 18 ga extra long IV cath - tube feeding & pouch flushes
- 1 cc and 3 cc syringe
- Hairpin with bulb on end, IV catheter or eye dropper - for pouch evacs
- Magnifying glass or dissecting scope - to get closer examination
- Camera

Filter: (no biowheels) HOB AquaClear
- Aquaclear filter will house as a refugium (sand, rock, pod growth, & chaeto)*

- what kind of light source do I need to sustain growth in a refugium?

Heater: Not sure if I'll buy one. Depends on the temperature measured during cycling. I believe it is 4 watts/gallon correct?

Skimmer: Not sure if I'll buy a skimmer, but what is a good skimmer brand?

Live Rock/Live Sand:
1lb of LR/gallon, compare dry pieces with dry & wet pieces with wet| barebottom

Inhabitants:
- Two H. erectus or reidi sea horses of same sex.
- blue sea star/sand sifting sea star, blue sponge?

Clean up crew: not sure what kind to get yet, but these are what I'm looking at so far
- Nassarius (would need sand; 1/5gallons)
- Nerite (1/5gallons)
- Trochus (1/2-3 gallons)

Macro algae: not sure what kind yet, most likely chaeto
- Chaeto (with pods)
- Caulerpa prolifera
- Caulerpa racemosa
- Caulerpa sertularioides
- Caulerpa mexicana
- Halimdea copiosa

Plants:
- Halimeda ?
- Codium (1 short & 1 tall?)

Foods:
- Krill (good for Erectus/Reidi)
- Red shrimp, PE/Hikari Mysis shrimp, (Ghost shrimp: freshwater type should be enriched), Grass shrimp, Glass Shrimp, River shrimp
- Amphipods, Gammarus, Scuds, Isopods

 

[francinemarie]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14634127#post14634127 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by rayjay
I should have mentioned earlier, that what I post is only based on my own experiences and is my own opinion. It is not the only way, nor is it necessarily the best way to do things, just that it is the way I choose to do things.
Please take the time to also research other ways before you choose the way you want to proceed with.
Use the search feature on individual topics to see how others feel on those topics.

I understand. I have actually read & looked at all posts in the SH forum, so I have looked at other options. I just prefer the simplest method of setting up a SH tank & the Berlin method of filtration seems to be the simplest way IMO. thank you for your opinion & information

 

[rayjay]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14634302#post14634302 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by francinemarie

So I assume any tank (that is not long) between 29-40 gallons would be alright for 2 female Reidis?

Long is fine also because you are not breeding them.

I've been debating on whether or not I should get a skimmer. I'm leaning towards not getting one because of the amount of cost for equipment & materials. What kind of skimmer do you use?

Skimmers make the whole system more forgiving and make less work for you in keeping nuisance algae at bay.
If cost is a concern, then it's maybe not the hobby for you as you will find costs are high and ongoing in salt water.
I build my own skimmers.

Items needed to cycle tank:
- Salt water test kit â€"œ pH (8.0-8.3), ammonia (0), nitrate (<20ppm), nitrite (0)
- hydrometer (measures specific gravity 1.020-1.024)
- Refractometer (measures salinity)
- thermometer (4 watts/gallon)
- ammonium chloride

I'm assuming you mean "heater (4 watts/gallon) which I can't believe you would need unless the room the tank is in drops below 68°F.
You DO need the thermometer though, and more than a heater.

- blue sea star/sand sifting sea star, blue sponge?

You won't have suitable conditions for a blue sea star or sponge.

As for foods, just initially stock whatever the horses you buy are feeding on and add one or two others gradually. You don't need so many foods at one time, even though variety of foods is much better for any fish. Two or three kinds will suffice.

 

[francinemarie]

Skimmers make the whole system more forgiving and make less work for you in keeping nuisance algae at bay.
If cost is a concern, then it's maybe not the hobby for you as you will find costs are high and ongoing in salt water.
I build my own skimmers.

If I were to try & set up a SH tank right now, costs would be high (because I currently do not have a job & am in college). But I'm only still doing research for a future SH set up. So I am still very interested in owning a seahorse .

I'm assuming you mean "heater (4 watts/gallon) which I can't believe you would need unless the room the tank is in drops below 68°F.
You DO need the thermometer though, and more than a heater.

yes I did mean that sorry. I only added the heater to my list for the same reason you mentioned above, in case the temperature drops below 68.

You won't have suitable conditions for a blue sea star or sponge.

Mmk, it was just an idea. Thank you .

As for foods, just initially stock whatever the horses you buy are feeding on and add one or two others gradually. You don't need so many foods at one time, even though variety of foods is much better for any fish. Two or three kinds will suffice.

I wasn't going to feed all those foods to my future SHs . It's just a list of what they can eat. I'll be sure to keep a few in stock. Again, thank you .

 

[francinemarie]

Would anyone happen know if you should add macro to the tank when you start cycling or after the tank has cycled?