Sorry, another concern about S. Gigantea
- Thread starter sugartooth
- Start date
sugartooth
Reef bully
Absolutely agree with the others, very nicely posted delphinus.
I have mixed feelings now after reading the response. I knew this would be difficult and these anemones had a poor record. I didn't realize just HOW poor.
My feelings are mixed because I admire them so much, and have been wanting to try. At the same time, I am disappointed in myself that I gave in to that so readily.
I did see Rod's when I was there about 4 months ago. That pretty much solidified my desire to keep a gigantea. I have been keeping my clowns in a nursery since then, hoping to find one to put into the tank prior to introducing the clowns.
So, given the information from delphinus, I noted the following as of this morning:
- tentacles seem to move independent of flow
- there are folds present, but not consistently
- the foot is not firmly attached to anything. Sometimes I see partially attached to the rock on the right of it, sometimes it lets go and sits on the sand. What factors cause this, does anyone know?
- sometimes the foot elongates and becomes like a stalk...causing the anemone to look like a toadstool leather w/folds. Then the foot becomes short and fat, flattening the body against the sand and rock. It does not constantly do this, but coincides with on/off of lights or hand in the tank. This may only be because I happen to catch this when I turn on the lights, etc.
I have increased the flow a tad. I estimate it to be 75% of max on the Vortech, set on Lagoon mode.
Should I still perform water changes? If yes, then should I take only seasoned water from the main display, a mix of old and fresh, or fresh only?
Is there ever a case where I need to change the aquascaping? Perhaps I don't have it in an ideal layout?
Again, I appreciate the input and info. I will post another picture tonight. If anything, a picture a day may help someone else in a similar situation better evaluate how their anemone is doing.
I have mixed feelings now after reading the response. I knew this would be difficult and these anemones had a poor record. I didn't realize just HOW poor.
My feelings are mixed because I admire them so much, and have been wanting to try. At the same time, I am disappointed in myself that I gave in to that so readily.
I did see Rod's when I was there about 4 months ago. That pretty much solidified my desire to keep a gigantea. I have been keeping my clowns in a nursery since then, hoping to find one to put into the tank prior to introducing the clowns.
So, given the information from delphinus, I noted the following as of this morning:
- tentacles seem to move independent of flow
- there are folds present, but not consistently
- the foot is not firmly attached to anything. Sometimes I see partially attached to the rock on the right of it, sometimes it lets go and sits on the sand. What factors cause this, does anyone know?
- sometimes the foot elongates and becomes like a stalk...causing the anemone to look like a toadstool leather w/folds. Then the foot becomes short and fat, flattening the body against the sand and rock. It does not constantly do this, but coincides with on/off of lights or hand in the tank. This may only be because I happen to catch this when I turn on the lights, etc.
I have increased the flow a tad. I estimate it to be 75% of max on the Vortech, set on Lagoon mode.
Should I still perform water changes? If yes, then should I take only seasoned water from the main display, a mix of old and fresh, or fresh only?
Is there ever a case where I need to change the aquascaping? Perhaps I don't have it in an ideal layout?
Again, I appreciate the input and info. I will post another picture tonight. If anything, a picture a day may help someone else in a similar situation better evaluate how their anemone is doing.
sugartooth
Reef bully
I forgot to ask...should we be dipping in Coral Revive before going into the tank?
delphinus
New member
I don't really know what that product does, in fact until you mentioned it I had never even heard of it.
I'm not sure that water changes are going to do anything to help. They might even have a paradoxical effect because of the change in parameters. If it were me, I would only do a water change if I felt the water was fouled.
I don't really see a need to change your aquascaping. If anything, resist the urge to change anything at this point because it will introduce too many new variables.
What I've observed with gigantea is that they prefer to attach to rock near the bottom of the rockwork. They might try to find a crevasse to wedge into for additional support.
Your first two observations sound promising, but the foot letting go is a bit worrisome. If it reattaches though afterwards then hopefully there is still some cause for hope. Not really much you can do though except hope for the best.
I'm not sure that water changes are going to do anything to help. They might even have a paradoxical effect because of the change in parameters. If it were me, I would only do a water change if I felt the water was fouled.
I don't really see a need to change your aquascaping. If anything, resist the urge to change anything at this point because it will introduce too many new variables.
What I've observed with gigantea is that they prefer to attach to rock near the bottom of the rockwork. They might try to find a crevasse to wedge into for additional support.
Your first two observations sound promising, but the foot letting go is a bit worrisome. If it reattaches though afterwards then hopefully there is still some cause for hope. Not really much you can do though except hope for the best.
Gary Majchrzak
Team RC
low oxygen levels are often cited as the main reason for this behavior but IME anemones might do it even when water is supersaturated (which is the case here with mine).
It probably can't be stressed enough how important water motion is to this anemone species. Water motion helps to saturate the water with oxygen. I don't know what 75% 'lagoon mode' on a Vortech equates too, but the water motion around my gigantea is great enough to lift it's oral disc and to prevent me from seeing the tentacles vibrate. (To see the tentacles I must turn off my pumps and powerheads. This same kind of water movement isn't necessary with Haddon's carpet anemone IME).
Incidentally I had my (alternating) powerheads turned off for a couple of days and my gigantea appeared to be sick and I was concerned it might be dying.
Hopefully this gives you a feel for how important water motion is.
I think you made the right decision by yanking the anemone that wasn't doing well. Please post pix and update us when possible- I really like your system and the remaining anemone has great coloration leading me to believe it has an excellent chance of making it through acclimation.
sugartooth
Reef bully
Thanks again for the responses. I turned up the Vortech again so now it's moving some sand around....
The Vortech is a powerhead that is supposed to create strong diffused flow/current. It's like the Tunze nanostream, but max out at 3000 gph I believe. So, for me, I have it about 80% max now so my estimate is that it's coming out at 2200-2500 gph? (I'm estimating loss of flow hitting rock, surface break and such)
It has different modes you can set, constant, pulse, lagoon, and reef crest mode. The lagoon creates an ebb and flow, although there is not much detail in their description when you read the directions. Maybe I should have it on pulse?
Also, would you think it's beneficial to add airstones to the sump for more oxygenation?
As an update:
I came home to a setback. I went to look at the anemone, and it was round. The tentacles were long and skinny. I looked at the temperature and it had reached 84F and my heater was still on!!!
So I shut off the lights and turned off the heater. It started to change shape again.
The good news is that it was still in the same spot as this morning.
I took pictures when the temperature reached 82-83F. Please have a look.
No folds, it seems:
<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/nullcable/2344160763/" title="smll gigantea 3.18.08 pm by nullcable, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2043/2344160763_faa5f2198e.jpg" width="500" height="283" alt="smll gigantea 3.18.08 pm" /></a>
I tried to zone in on the foot. It had lifted a little bit, and I was able to take some pictures showing where the foot is....
<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/nullcable/2344160759/" title="small gigantea 3.18.08 foot by nullcable, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2264/2344160759_0dda985d15_o.jpg" width="620" height="600" alt="small gigantea 3.18.08 foot" /></a>
<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/nullcable/2344160767/" title="smll gigantea foot 3.18.08 by nullcable, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3068/2344160767_3aa945974f_o.jpg" width="800" height="535" alt="smll gigantea foot 3.18.08" /></a>
After lights out for about an hour, it completely engulfed itself. Like the skin underneath got pulled up and over into the middle, it now looks like a smooth light bulb?
With regard to Coral Revive, I asked that because Julian Sprung created this dip for elegance coral and other LPS. I think he believed that bacteria was the culprit for many deaths of elegance coral. This dip was supposed to help 'soothe' and 'cleanse' them. I've been using it as a coral dip and found that AEFW readily fall off in this dip.
The Vortech is a powerhead that is supposed to create strong diffused flow/current. It's like the Tunze nanostream, but max out at 3000 gph I believe. So, for me, I have it about 80% max now so my estimate is that it's coming out at 2200-2500 gph? (I'm estimating loss of flow hitting rock, surface break and such)
It has different modes you can set, constant, pulse, lagoon, and reef crest mode. The lagoon creates an ebb and flow, although there is not much detail in their description when you read the directions. Maybe I should have it on pulse?
Also, would you think it's beneficial to add airstones to the sump for more oxygenation?
As an update:
I came home to a setback. I went to look at the anemone, and it was round. The tentacles were long and skinny. I looked at the temperature and it had reached 84F and my heater was still on!!!
So I shut off the lights and turned off the heater. It started to change shape again.
The good news is that it was still in the same spot as this morning.
I took pictures when the temperature reached 82-83F. Please have a look.
No folds, it seems:
<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/nullcable/2344160763/" title="smll gigantea 3.18.08 pm by nullcable, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2043/2344160763_faa5f2198e.jpg" width="500" height="283" alt="smll gigantea 3.18.08 pm" /></a>
I tried to zone in on the foot. It had lifted a little bit, and I was able to take some pictures showing where the foot is....
<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/nullcable/2344160759/" title="small gigantea 3.18.08 foot by nullcable, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2264/2344160759_0dda985d15_o.jpg" width="620" height="600" alt="small gigantea 3.18.08 foot" /></a>
<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/nullcable/2344160767/" title="smll gigantea foot 3.18.08 by nullcable, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3068/2344160767_3aa945974f_o.jpg" width="800" height="535" alt="smll gigantea foot 3.18.08" /></a>
After lights out for about an hour, it completely engulfed itself. Like the skin underneath got pulled up and over into the middle, it now looks like a smooth light bulb?
With regard to Coral Revive, I asked that because Julian Sprung created this dip for elegance coral and other LPS. I think he believed that bacteria was the culprit for many deaths of elegance coral. This dip was supposed to help 'soothe' and 'cleanse' them. I've been using it as a coral dip and found that AEFW readily fall off in this dip.
Rod Buehler
New member
Kathy, do you still have small clowns?
If they are small/gentle enough, I am a believer that the clowns will help the anemone settle in. I agree with everything that the other gigantea owners have said here, except for the clowns. I have only attempted 3 giganteas... 2 with early clown additions, and one without clowns. The one without is no longer here. My first had a clown from day 1.. the second didnt seem to be doing well until I added a small pair. the third, I didnt add clowns until it was too late. Just observations that I have seen. I have no proof, and I could be wrong.
Strng alternating water current
warmer temps (80+)
strong lighting
established tanks
If they are small/gentle enough, I am a believer that the clowns will help the anemone settle in. I agree with everything that the other gigantea owners have said here, except for the clowns. I have only attempted 3 giganteas... 2 with early clown additions, and one without clowns. The one without is no longer here. My first had a clown from day 1.. the second didnt seem to be doing well until I added a small pair. the third, I didnt add clowns until it was too late. Just observations that I have seen. I have no proof, and I could be wrong.
Strng alternating water current
warmer temps (80+)
strong lighting
established tanks
sugartooth
Reef bully
Thank you very much Rod.
Yes, I still have your two that have stayed small. They are still about 1". I have been housing them with a picasso pair that were much larger.
The picasso pair have grown considerably while yours have grown at a slower rate. (but yours still eat like monsters compared to the others!)
I was trying to decide which pair to go into this cube.
Would you then suggest the smallest of them? The difference in size between the two pairs is pretty big.
Originally I was thinking of putting the picassos in because they have grown and are really beginning to bully the Onyx. I thought this would give the little ones a chance to keep growing in the nursery until I can find another anemone. I have a second setup exactly like this one for each pair.
Yes, I still have your two that have stayed small. They are still about 1". I have been housing them with a picasso pair that were much larger.
The picasso pair have grown considerably while yours have grown at a slower rate. (but yours still eat like monsters compared to the others!)
I was trying to decide which pair to go into this cube.
Would you then suggest the smallest of them? The difference in size between the two pairs is pretty big.
Originally I was thinking of putting the picassos in because they have grown and are really beginning to bully the Onyx. I thought this would give the little ones a chance to keep growing in the nursery until I can find another anemone. I have a second setup exactly like this one for each pair.
sugartooth
Reef bully
Also, do I turn down the flow when I add the clowns and then turn it back up gradually?
I didn't mention the size of the picassos/misbars. They are almost 2".
I didn't mention the size of the picassos/misbars. They are almost 2".
Last edited:
Rod Buehler
New member
Yes, I believe that a small pair would "stimulate" the anemone, but that is just my opinion. Gary could very well be right and the clowns could irritate the anemone. Every situation can be different, but IME the clowns seemed to have helped
sugartooth
Reef bully
Rod, were yours all in top condition when you put clowns in with them?
Also, does it matter the size of the anemone and how they would receive the clowns? This one is pretty small. I would estimate about 4" diameter.
Although color seems to be good on this one, it doesn't have the folds consistently and hasn't really anchored.
Is there any criteria to tell if the anemone would benefit or be irritated at different stages of health?
For example:
Put in clowns before it gets to stage 'X' and it has a chance to recover. If you wait too long and put clowns in, it will irritate them and they won't recover?
Or has there not been enough information out there to say something like that?
Also, does it matter the size of the anemone and how they would receive the clowns? This one is pretty small. I would estimate about 4" diameter.
Although color seems to be good on this one, it doesn't have the folds consistently and hasn't really anchored.
Is there any criteria to tell if the anemone would benefit or be irritated at different stages of health?
For example:
Put in clowns before it gets to stage 'X' and it has a chance to recover. If you wait too long and put clowns in, it will irritate them and they won't recover?
Or has there not been enough information out there to say something like that?
sugartooth
Reef bully
GSM: no, I don't for the cubes. I am nervous and will get one as soon as I can get the chance.
Today is day 5 since I got it.
I came home for lunch to check on it. Here is what it looks like now:
Close up
<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/nullcable/2345099387/" title="smll gigantea 3.19.08 by nullcable, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2274/2345099387_21efbb72b7_o.jpg" width="800" height="532" alt="smll gigantea 3.19.08" /></a>
Farther out shot
<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/nullcable/2345099383/" title="small gigantea 3.19.08 by nullcable, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2302/2345099383_a8f867bc22_o.jpg" width="800" height="532" alt="small gigantea 3.19.08" /></a>
Today is day 5 since I got it.
I came home for lunch to check on it. Here is what it looks like now:
Close up
<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/nullcable/2345099387/" title="smll gigantea 3.19.08 by nullcable, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2274/2345099387_21efbb72b7_o.jpg" width="800" height="532" alt="smll gigantea 3.19.08" /></a>
Farther out shot
<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/nullcable/2345099383/" title="small gigantea 3.19.08 by nullcable, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2302/2345099383_a8f867bc22_o.jpg" width="800" height="532" alt="small gigantea 3.19.08" /></a>
delphinus
New member
FWIW, both of mine never had clowns for at least a year.
I'm a little leery about posting something that differs from Rod's experience because he's way smarter than me.
Or at least been doing this longer than me. 
But at the size of the anemone you have there, I would be a little concerned about clownfish thrashing about in there.
There could be something to what he says though. Clowns will help with localized water movement, probably help flutter away any slime, might drop small bits of food that the anemone can scavenge ... and so on.
But I've seen the way MY clowns treat their carpet, and at times they thrash about like a fish out of water. A healthy anemone can withstand this, a new anemone mmmmmmmight not.
Other than that though, it looks to be doing not too bad, all things considered.
Stay the course, hang in there.
This one has a lot of promise should it live for you.
I really feel for you. I've never been so stressed out as the times as when I've added a new anemone to my collection. I can only imagine how much sleep you're getting.
I'm a little leery about posting something that differs from Rod's experience because he's way smarter than me.
Or at least been doing this longer than me. But at the size of the anemone you have there, I would be a little concerned about clownfish thrashing about in there.There could be something to what he says though. Clowns will help with localized water movement, probably help flutter away any slime, might drop small bits of food that the anemone can scavenge ... and so on.
But I've seen the way MY clowns treat their carpet, and at times they thrash about like a fish out of water. A healthy anemone can withstand this, a new anemone mmmmmmmight not.
Other than that though, it looks to be doing not too bad, all things considered.
Stay the course, hang in there.
This one has a lot of promise should it live for you.I really feel for you. I've never been so stressed out as the times as when I've added a new anemone to my collection. I can only imagine how much sleep you're getting.
sugartooth
Reef bully
I tell you, this is a roller coater ride. It changed again, it got bigger than I have ever seen it before! What does this mean? I'm a little concerned.
Note I had to pan out a little to take this picture...also, note how much of the anemone is covering the second rock on top, near the foot....as well as towards the back. I wish I can show it the picture better. The anemone also stretches to the rock behind it vs. earlier pics.
What's going on? Still midday.
<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/nullcable/2346022416/" title="small gigantea 3.19.08 midday by nullcable, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2420/2346022416_d917cd1b40_o.jpg" width="800" height="532" alt="small gigantea 3.19.08 midday" /></a>
Note I had to pan out a little to take this picture...also, note how much of the anemone is covering the second rock on top, near the foot....as well as towards the back. I wish I can show it the picture better. The anemone also stretches to the rock behind it vs. earlier pics.
What's going on? Still midday.
<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/nullcable/2346022416/" title="small gigantea 3.19.08 midday by nullcable, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2420/2346022416_d917cd1b40_o.jpg" width="800" height="532" alt="small gigantea 3.19.08 midday" /></a>
sugartooth
Reef bully
Delphinus: Thanks for your thoughts. I swear I thought I was going to have an aneurysm with seahorses, this is just as bad!
GSM: Yes, I'm anxious about what to do with the clowns. Will putting one in mess up their social order they have established thus far?
Also, will that mess up the other 3 in the nursery?
GSM: Yes, I'm anxious about what to do with the clowns. Will putting one in mess up their social order they have established thus far?
Also, will that mess up the other 3 in the nursery?
Gary Majchrzak
Team RC
lookin' good! :thumbsup:
at this point I'd introduce one small Clownfish and see how the anemone handles it.
at this point I'd introduce one small Clownfish and see how the anemone handles it.
