Sorry John... But I am calling out COPPS!!!

and what precautions should we all take for qt? especially wit copper!! i'm still debating to use copper or not in my qt setup. What kind of fish would you not put through qt? how about anthias do they do well in there? sorry for al lthe questions but seems like you guys got all the answers here!! thanks
 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13993431#post13993431 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by jc16
and what precautions should we all take for qt? especially wit copper!! i'm still debating to use copper or not in my qt setup. What kind of fish would you not put through qt? how about anthias do they do well in there? sorry for al lthe questions but seems like you guys got all the answers here!! thanks
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I don't think there is a fish( well, maybe Mandarins) that can't go through QT, as long as the QT is mature---which lessens or alleviates issues with ammonia. Cupramine copper is tolerated by many types of fish and is easy to administer and monitor in QT. It is also one of the more effective treatments to rid the fish of parasites.
 
I prefer to go with a hyposalinity set up for my QT. This is less stressful to the fish, but does involve more effort on my end. pH isnt very stable in hyposaline environments so I drip a high pH solution, (RO water with sodium bicarbonate) in to replace evaporated water and maintain a pH of 8.2-8.3.

Nick
 
Hyposalinty works well, but wouldn't rely on it solely to rid fish of parasites. Especially because many LFS keep their fish at Hypo levels and ich and other parasites can become tolerant and in fact thrive in Hypo conditions. T
 
I dont rely on anything soley to rid my fish of parasites. I use hyposalinity, (1.007-8) for 30 days, then evaluate the fishes behaviour and health. I've never seen or heard of a case of an invertebrate parasite such as ich surviving an extended hypo QT.

Got any links?

BTW, you change avatars like some people change underwear....:D.....you're confusing me!

Nick
 
Hey Tim, actually a mutation can occur where a strain becomes immune, but it is not because of being kept in those conditions.

I will look up more information on it, but after just taking genetics we just learned about this.
 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14001909#post14001909 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by tcmfish
Hey Tim, actually a mutation can occur where a strain becomes immune, but it is not because of being kept in those conditions.

I will look up more information on it, but after just taking genetics we just learned about this.
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Mutations occur independently of the conditions. However, proliferation of the conditions will leave to a proliferous of that specific mutation for this the environment favors. So, you are both right. Kinda.:D
 
those that survive to produce offspring (or divide and proliferate) win. in conditions that would normally kill off a parasite, like hypo, there may be a certain frequency of a mutant with some adaptation to less saline conditions. the salt-adapted majority die off, the hypo-adapted hang on, additional mutations that confer better adaptation to hypo accumulate (through reproduction, sexual or asexual), and voila, you have an adapted strain.

the same things occur all the time with infectious bacteria being challenged with antibiotics, and developing resistance.

another example is pesticide resistance in insects.

challenge a population. in a large enough population, some individuals carry alleles (genes) that allow them to survive and reproduce. individuals with such genes mate, and the frequency of the resistance gene(s) in the population, and frequency of resistant individuals rises.
 
true, except it can have toxic effects on some fish as well. I understand the value of copper, but I try to avoid it if I can. not trying to argue with the proponents of copper meds, just my choice to leave it alone as much as I can. Cupramine is still in the medicine chest, just in case. :)
 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14002376#post14002376 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by John Dawe
That is why copper is better, a toxic metal poison to the parasite.
No chance to mutate!
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And not really true. I used to work in a LFS that had an AWESOME system for holding. They had run formalin in the holding system twice a week. The formalin would kill almost all the bacteria. However, over time, the nictrosomas and nitrobacter had mutated, and there were some resilient strains. These were selected for (by adding formalin frequently), and voila- formalin resisytnt bacteria. the manager was feircely protective of this bioifilter, as it had taken him a LONG time to culture it. But, all new fish were able to be treated with formalin, quickly, and safely, and as often as needed.

Theoretiucally, the same could occur for copper.
 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14002376#post14002376 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by John Dawe
That is why copper is better, a toxic metal poison to the parasite.
No chance to mutate!
Click to expand...

And not really true. I used to work in a LFS that had an AWESOME system for holding. They had run formalin in the holding system twice a week. The formalin would kill almost all the bacteria. However, over time, the nictrosomas and nitrobacter had mutated, and there were some resilient strains. These were selected for (by adding formalin frequently), and voila- formalin resisytnt bacteria. the manager was feircely protective of this bioifilter, as it had taken him a LONG time to culture it. But, all new fish were able to be treated with formalin, quickly, and safely, and as often as needed.

Theoretiucally, the same could occur for copper.
 
Hey guys... first of all... Merry Christmas!



<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13981431#post13981431 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Cantonesefish
John, first of all, wow!

Secondly, what are your thoughts on the temperature range for C. interruptus in captivity? I remember you said you have one in your SPS system, do you try to keep the temperature at the lower ranges for SPS?
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I run all of my systems on the cooler side... 75-77 or 78...

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13983222#post13983222 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by tcmfish
I believe his C. interruptus was captive raised but I could be wrong, and Frank said that the captive raised ones would live in warmer temps, but his wild broodstock required cooler water.
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Yeah I had the wild father... and one of his CB sons... even the CB interruta require cooler water... but just not as cool... the cooler the better though...

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13984257#post13984257 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by LisaD
Kevin Kohen at F&S weighed posted in my thread with some history on this fish, it was helpful.
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Hey I know that guy! :D Kevin is amazing... he combines a technical knowledge of aquatic life and the hobby with a genuine comcern about each individual animal... he really takes it to a new level in the industry... all the while being a great guy you could have a beer with... Kevin came by my house a couple of months ago... hopefully he can chime in here!:) Here we are...

 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13985608#post13985608 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Laddy
Young Couple: yep
Wife: got one
Kids: got one
Silicon Valley of the "East": Silicon Valley of the "West"; if you look down the hill from our house you can see Oracle five minutes away......I hate those ugly towers :D
Thomas the Train: Dora ('nough said)

At the end of a 70 hr week the last thing I want to do is change water and clean skimmers, but I do......b/c this hobby isn't about instant satisfaction, but rather it requires an appreciation for the the repitition of life.

Keep doing what you're doing. I remember seeing your 10g (and "Jerry" who I hope is still with you) right as I was getting back into this hobby after graduate school. I still hit your TOTM probably once a month for general inspiration. I will never have the level of depth you have in this hobby, but rather I take the simple pleasures--like keeping a yellow tang alive, as the first one I killed back in '92 in a 20g high b/c nobody "knew". We still have a long way to go in this hobby, but small steps are better than big leaps, and it takes people like you forging new ground, and breaking misnomers, to accomplish that task. When my 3yr old gets excited about "feeding time" I too get re-energized to clean skimmers and filter socks.

.......and by the way, you are freakin nuts with all your tanks! :rollface:
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Thanks so much for those kind words! YES, I still do have Jerry, my Solomon Islands perc... here he was over five years ago in my 10g nano...


... and in this recent pic I posted earlier you could see HER... Jerry has long now been a lady... :)



about 4.5 years ago I got Jerry a mate... you could see them both in this photo I posted earlier...

 
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13891399#post13891399 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by copps
And some of my large fish only... separated to transition fish in and deal with certain aggressions... a method I use and will explain later (it's 1:56 am and I had our kids today while the wife was working... so I'm near hallucinating now...) :)

The "left side"




And the right...


I'll have more soon...

Copps
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Here are some full tank and full room shots... my 292 FO in the kitchen...



... a step up from my old 10 gallon kitchen setup years ago in the apartment!

 
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