STN: I'm In desperate need of advanced help.

malx

Active member
Hi, Everyone.

Grab a coffee, you'll need it.

Let me start out by saying that no matter how frustrated I am with my tank right now—as I am in fact frustrated--I love this hobby. For my first tank, I built the most amazing system I could think of. I’m a huge gear head so I love equipment, all of it, and only the best of it! Everything runs outstanding—maintenance, water changes, cleaning, feeding, gear checks, everything is super easy and I never worry about my gear not working properly. In terms of fish, they look outstanding. They’ve all been properly quarantined as babies, they eat like pigs, they grow fast, they great me when I wake up, and they eat everything I feed them. My Midas Blenney was so happy when I adopted him that he jumped out of his container while being drip acclimated (don’t worry I caught the idiot and he’s fine). I am truly their dad. In the six months this tank has been up I’ve fought and won battles against Diatoms Twice, Cyano Twice, Bubble Algae, been constantly bit by clownfish, and just learned a lot in general. I’m super grateful for my tank and everyone who has helped me along the way.

One thing I can’t seem to overcome is my STN problem. No matter what type of SPS I put in the tank, it slowly dies. When I acclimate a new coral after being Bayer dipped, It will show PE for a few weeks, then start to slowly develop tissue loss, algae will take over and then BAM, it just loses the battle. There seems to be no rhyme or reason where the tissue loss is. Sometimes at the tips, sometimes at the base, and sometimes in the middle for plating corals. Over the past few weeks I have determined to figure out what is wrong. First my tank was too clean, so I overdosed on some ZEOvit elements and had several algae blooms, then, the Calcium level was off because my Hanna checker was crap and didn’t have the right calibration solution, then it was not enough light and enough flow. A few weeks ago things were starting to look great as I have been slowing making changes, and then, back to their old self again.
I’m determined to fix this. Please, all of you, give me ideas of what to check because I am completely stumped. Here’s everything that you need to know.


Tank Parameters:
  • Tank Size: 56 Gallons 36x20x20
  • Total Water Volume: Conservative Estimate of 75 Gallons


Life Support:
  • Sump: Ruby 36 by Trigger Systems
  • Calcium Reactor: Vertex RX-C 6D
  • Protein Skimmer: Vertex Omega 150
  • ZEOvit Reactor: Vertex RX-Z 1.5L
  • Other Equipment: Theiling Rollermat
  • RO/DI: 7 Stage RO/DI Unit from BRS that has One Membrane, One Sediment Filter, 3 Carbon Stages, and Two DI Stages.


Media Used:
  • In a Mesh Bag in the Sump: Zorallen-Zucht Activated Carbon 300ml
  • In the ZEOvit Reactor: Zorallen-Zucht ZEOlite Media 700ml
  • Salt: Red Sea Coral Pro


In the Calcium Reactor:
  • One Bag of Reborn Calcium Reactor Media
  • One Container of CaribSEA Arm Reactor Media
  • One Bag of 1000ml Zorallen-Zucht ZEOmag


Lighting:
  • Two Kessil A360W Tuna Blue
  • Two 39w T5 Coral Light II Bulbs by Zorallen-Zucht
  • One 39w T5 Fiji Purple Bulb by Zorallen-Zucht
  • One 39w T5 Coral Light Super Blue Bulb by Zorallen-Zucht
  • All lights mounted approximately 7” from Water Level


PAR Readings:
  • 100-150 on the sand
  • 160-360 on the different rock levels
  • Measured with a Seneye Monitor
  • Most SPS are mounted above 180par. I am slowing increasing the Kessil lights 5% intensity each seven-day period. So far they max out at 50% intensity.


Photo Period:


APEX Readings:
  • Tank PH Readings over 24hrs: 8.19 – 8.31
  • Tank ORP Readings over 24hrs: 369 – 397
  • Tank Temperature Readings over 24hrs: 79.5 – 79.6
  • Apex Screenshot: https://www.screencast.com/t/cxp98lq6Q
  • Note, all probes are calibrated quarterly. Last calibration was 30 days ago.


Nutrients Matrix:
  • SG: 34/1.026 with Milwakee Digital Refractometer
  • SG Crosschecked with with standard Refractometer: 1.027
  • Alk Readings Across Two Weeks: 8.0 – 8.9dkh tested every other day over a two-week period.
  • CA Readings Across Two Weeks: 370 – 380ppm with Hannah Checker (known to be inaccurate so using this to test for consistency)
  • CA Crosschecked with ATI Ca Test Kit: 440ppm
  • Potassium: 380ppm with Red Sea Coral Colors
  • Ammonia: 0ppm with Salifert
  • Nitrite: 0ppm with Hanna Checker
  • Nitrate: 5ppm with Salifert (Consistent)
  • Phosphate Over One Month Period: 0 – 0.05ppm with Hanna Checker


Flow:


Feedings:
  • 2x Per Day Mix of:
    • PE Mysis
    • PE Calanus
    • Hikari Mega Marine Angel
    • Cyclops,
    • Nori
    • Sustainable Aquatics Hatchery Pellets
    • Ocean Nutrition Prime Flakes
    • Fresh Clams from Whole Foods
    • Fresh oysters from Whole Foods
    • Fresh scallops from Whole Foods
  • 2x Per Week I do a third feeding of BRS Reef Chili and 0.5ml Selcon


Dosing:


Photos: I’ll get some, but it’s defiantly STN.


Things I’ve tried that have not made any significant positive changes:
  • Slowing adjusting dosing
  • Consistent back-to-back water changes
  • Increased flow
  • Increased lighting in both Intensity and photo-period
  • Checked equipment for rusty magnets.


What I’m trying now
  • Triton Test (Will be 10 days for the results)
  • Patience

What I’m thinking now:
  • Many curse words
  • Like a bad fish daddy
  • Maybe there is something in the tank, like a screw or a metal shaving putting copper and tin in the water that I can’t detect without a Triton test.
  • Why does my Maxima Clam look so amazing and have pure white new growth under his mantel--that I only see at night because during the day he’s out soaking up the sun—if there is some element in the water that is toxic to SPS?
  • Could stray voltage be an issue? I can never get my salinity probe calibrated possibly. If that’s the case, would that even affect the corals? I don’t get electrocuted when I touch the equipment.
  • Should I have just gotten a betta fish?

Please sirs, may I haz some help?

Thanks for listening!
Joey
 
Things that would help would be information about what corals have died, where you got them, were they wild or hobbiests frags, what exactly is happening to the coral as it dies, any color changes?
 
Hi, All.

So here are the pics I promised to upload. I also noticed that some of you asked where they were purchased from. I've included that too. All pics are Facebook links to make this easy to read.


Coral: Stylophora Aquacultured
Status: Deceased
Purchased From: Local Reefer
Purchased When: August 2016
Lasted: Approximately Six Weeks

When First Added: https://scontent-lax3-2.xx.fbcdn.ne...=a2db1bee914a43b8ca4f29c15705f304&oe=58FE1BC8
Week Three: https://scontent-lax3-2.xx.fbcdn.ne...=e764ad86115fb405cd4ce085ebf295b7&oe=591D9450
Week Six: https://scontent-lax3-2.xx.fbcdn.ne...=5ffd4ebb74da9099a04ba03dcaebcdd0&oe=594B2D33

This coral was the first coral I purchased for my tank. I chalked it up to the tank being too new at the time.



Coral: Misc. Acropora Frags Aquacultured
Status: Barly Hanging On
Purchased From: Battlecorals.net
Purchased When: August 2016

Pic: https://scontent-lax3-2.xx.fbcdn.ne...=d1aeff60f483112efeabe27d0d3e2a1a&oe=59053AAB

These frags almost turned completely white but got some tissue back and seemed to have been able to survive barely. Then on the right I believe is dead and I'm going to pull it out soon.



Coral: Green Plating Montipora Wild
Status: Almost Dead
Purchased From: Eye Catching Coral
Purchased When: September 2016

Pic: https://scontent-lax3-2.xx.fbcdn.ne...=18372e192d8f3447a617705440def36c&oe=59065848

As you can see, most of the center has died. This coral was doing great for a really long time. Still some live flesh around the outside, I'm still hoping it's coming back.



Coral: Purple Encrusting Montipora Wild
Status: Surviving
Purchased From: Eye Catching Coral
Purchased When: September 2016

Pic:
Close Up:

There was one day that this coral all of a sudden showed no PE for like two weeks. A good chunk of it died on the top but after two weeks, polyps came out and then the dead tissue stopped spreading. It seems to have been doing well and has bounced back and is currently at this state with some algae on top.



Coral: Stylophora 2.0 Wild
Status: STN
Purchased From: Eye Catching Coral
Purchased When: November 2016

Full Pic: https://scontent-lax3-2.xx.fbcdn.ne...=3196b8d5aaa869dad2c9480d65020063&oe=591BDB85
Close Up: https://scontent-lax3-2.xx.fbcdn.ne...=cb39a62d591df7cbf0c8a5669dfcae56&oe=590871B7
Close Up 2: https://scontent-lax3-2.xx.fbcdn.ne...=255edc6fd9aca0f0a23942c110a43485&oe=591EB3E5

If you look closely in Close up 2 the center looks good for some reason. In Close Up, you can see white tips forming algae.



Coral: Turbinaria Wild
Status: Thriving
Purchased From: Eye Catching Coral
Purchased When: November 2016

Pic: https://scontent-lax3-2.xx.fbcdn.ne...=af7190624110328df2e889802dffed7f&oe=5911BB79

I love this piece, always shows PE and a nice natural mustard color. Not sure why this is doing so well.


Coral: Green Porites Wild
Status: STN
Purchased From: Eye Catching Coral
Purchased When: November 2016

Full Pic: https://scontent-lax3-2.xx.fbcdn.ne...=8ee313f3f5a0b095f78a4f3bed6bb735&oe=5909C8F7
Close Up: https://scontent-lax3-2.xx.fbcdn.ne...=bcf0146f55014990e100c6499b4d09d1&oe=590CF556

As you can see by the pics tissue is receding on some of the parts in the middle on the bumps.



Coral: Serriatpora
Status: STN
Purchased From: Eye Catching Coral
Purchased When: November 2016

Pic: https://scontent-lax3-2.xx.fbcdn.ne...=8f06610d678d9e58dc0e75798bd240f7&oe=5906DA44
Close Up: https://scontent-lax3-2.xx.fbcdn.ne...=3acfe99fd90af10fd9b87d7b83953ebc&oe=590C14D5

This was acutaully a large colony that I had to frag out because it started to lose flesh at the inside. It seems it's still doing that even with fresh pieces cut.



Coral: Plating Montipora Aqualuted
Status: Doing Amazon
Purchased From: Local Reefer
Purchased When: November 2016

Full Pic: https://scontent-lax3-2.xx.fbcdn.ne...=5f935817c1b1e899a866490b137b54b9&oe=59102459

Doing Amazing, my favorite coral!


Coral: Monitipora Digitata Maricultured
Status: STN
Purchased From: Exotic Reef Imports
Purchased When: December 2016

Full Shot: https://scontent-lax3-2.xx.fbcdn.ne...=fb9ac55ee2fcfc42cc6ee6d25a8af227&oe=591AD7C0
Close Up: https://scontent-lax3-2.xx.fbcdn.ne...=b1398eb12ea29e6a3fa0aae848846154&oe=5918C04A

This was doing very well in its mounting place. The only real change to the tank since it's been there has been an increase in lighting. As you can see it did not color up and algae is forming on the tips.



Coral: Unsure but Maricultured
Status: Not doing well
Purchased From: Exotic Reef Imports
Purchased When: December 2016

Full Shot: https://scontent-lax3-2.xx.fbcdn.ne...=3c559b9caace88b0b3633e5ee87a5227&oe=59009127

It's showing PE in some places and other places algae has taken over. This seems to happen right before the tissue begins to turn white and die. I've had others do this.



Coral: It's My Happy Clam, Blue Maxima
Status: Alive and Well
Purchased: October 2016

Pic: https://scontent-lax3-2.xx.fbcdn.ne...=0aad6d217c9f6547b82b5f65371a435a&oe=59020DEA



Coral: Idiot Blenney
Status: Not Jumping Out
Adopted: December 2016

Pic: https://scontent-lax3-2.xx.fbcdn.ne...=5a69782cf61d3e33446098479cef6acb&oe=591CE70E

Here are three full tank shots.
Front: https://scontent-lax3-2.xx.fbcdn.ne...=a4ea60f2e3e8ece0d62d8f376b69edb9&oe=5904E66F
Side: https://scontent-lax3-2.xx.fbcdn.ne...=0d35cb024c0b960e863604f1bf722b70&oe=594B21DF
Rear: https://scontent-lax3-2.xx.fbcdn.ne...=8c1ae0ba6ece11edadf37d95a8353f30&oe=59196576



Note, there are other examples of these kinds of things with more Monitipora and acorpora, but in general this is what I face. Let me know if anyone needs more information!

Thanks!
Joey
 
im a zeo reefer, what is your flow through zeovit reactor/hr, what kz products and dosing schedule are you presently dosing, what is your potassium level. i would not increase lighting % if you are having trouble, also your tank is pretty young. did you start with dry rock or fresh quality livr rock? glad to help a fellow zeo head.
 
ok i saw your dosing schedule, stop with the aminos, and stick with the zeostart 3 twice daily, sponge power every other day, coral vitalizer every other day, zeobac every other day, you dont need booster or cyanoclean. why are you dosing so much k strong? what is your potassium level. i also think you are feeding too much. if it were me i would cut way back and stop overloading the reef with so much organic materials. also the recommended dosing amounts for alot of the kz products are intended for busting out loaded mature reefs that can handle all that organic input.... good luck
 
im a zeo reefer, what is your flow through zeovit reactor/hr, what kz products and dosing schedule are you presently dosing, what is your potassium level. i would not increase lighting % if you are having trouble, also your tank is pretty young. did you start with dry rock or fresh quality livr rock? glad to help a fellow zeo head.

My potassium level was 380 last time I checked a few weeks ago. I will test again tomorrow. I'm not sure what my flow is but I did tune the valve a bit. I have to do a rock change tomorrow. What flow do you recommend I tune it to?

I started with fresh live rock in the sump from my LFS but Dry Pukani Rock from BRS in the display.

My full dosing schedule can be found here: https://www.screencast.com/t/xJT1ITnHVCa which I've been working with G.Alexander on over at the ZEOvit forums in this thread: http://zeovit.com/forums/showthread.php?t=35638 where I had several types of algae break out which has mostly been resolved.

In a post above this someone recommends to cut a lot of the dosing out. Let me know if you agree with that or not.
 
ok i saw your dosing schedule, stop with the aminos, and stick with the zeostart 3 twice daily, sponge power every other day, coral vitalizer every other day, zeobac every other day, you dont need booster or cyanoclean. why are you dosing so much k strong? what is your potassium level. i also think you are feeding too much. if it were me i would cut way back and stop overloading the reef with so much organic materials. also the recommended dosing amounts for alot of the kz products are intended for busting out loaded mature reefs that can handle all that organic input.... good luck

Oh it was you. I will pull out the Aminos and also cease all dosing for the next few days unless I hear otherwise. My K levels are 380. I will test again tomorrow and report back. I don't have Coral Vitalizer. I am feeding a lot because a fellow reefer said that might tank may be too clean and things might be starving. I will lower feedings for the next week or so to see if that helps at all. The Cyano Clean, I still have little amounts of Cyano. Should I cease dosing that as well?
 
To add to this, here is some more information about my setup:

For Sand, I just used Dry Aroganite sand that I got at my LFS. I forget the brand but I think it was CaribSea. Same with live rock in the sump. In the display I used Pukani Dead Rock from Bulk Reef Supply that I treated in an acid bath and than cured 8 weeks in heated saltwater for phosphates. I glued some pieces together with Jurassic Gel.

The PVC and Valves were also purchased from Bulk Reef Supple and the elbows and unions were purchased from Home Depot.

All of the other little float switches and plumbing parts were purchased from Bulk Reef Supply.

Here are pics of the equipment.

7c5b9cd3c77683fac91d97d555936f34.jpg


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d93eba87330dc420aa96ea316c39c1a4.jpg


e611432650680468b1008b51387d7a8a.jpg


2374239fb0a0f10456775331ffc5e76f.jpg


1fb22dd0dbf09a024f2488cd63cb1860.jpg


2f520ee3b6b7e933f4e498fcc411b69a.jpg


c09a9b55789f769a215b91299556e051.jpg


35d71f2206d643cd8abee8fe29593cfa.jpg


b714fe6e98b9a163cf1df274b144e3ac.jpg




Here's a list of products used on the plumbing and to mount corals.

BRS Extra Thick Gel: http://www.bulkreefsupply.com/brs-extra-thick-gel-super-glue.html

Tunze Coral Gum: http://www.bulkreefsupply.com/tunze-coral-gum-instant.html

Jurassic Gel: http://www.bulkreefsupply.com/jurassic-gel-reef-adhesive.html

Teflon Tape: http://www.supplyhouse.com/Blue-Mon...MKaQWkJthwwtidzMd9fnvBvOvCiLKDhlZcBoC-Dvw_wcB

This PVC Cement: http://www.homedepot.com/p/16-oz-PV...gclid=CMaE8dK3qswCFVNqfgodo14Nww&gclsrc=aw.ds

This PVC Cleaner: http://www.homedepot.com/p/Oatey-16-oz-PVC-Clear-Cleaner-307953/202329481

Black Acrylic Paint for the Back

Also, this Acrylic Cement for any custom Acrylic pieces Weld-On #3 was used: https://www.amazon.com/Acrylic-Plastic-Cement-Applicator-Bottle/dp/B0149IG548


Hope this helps!
Joey
 
Hi just read your thread.

I have been keeping corals for 25 years some times it can be very frustrating.
If i were you i would try and strip things back and keep it as simple as possible.
You can run a successful reef tank and grow corals with some basic equipment and methodology.
Skimmer, quality light, plenty of flow, regular water changes and some media for bacteria to do its stuff and one other vital thing that is going to ensure stability "patience"!

I think your tank is a bit young yet and is going through all sorts of changes that some corals find difficult to adapt to so quickly.
Hope this helps i have been there and know how frustrating it is.
Good look keep going you will get it sorted. Keep asking questions.
Justin
 
your throughput and amount of zeolites in your zeo reactor is pretty critical, with thatt said, try to caculate your amount of actual water you are running then refer to kz instructions as to amount of zeolites and flow through your reactor. also are you using a carbon reactor? if so i would just start using it passively ime the most eficient use of gac was not a good thing. one more thing... from the look of your skimate you definately need to cut way back on your feeding and organic input, with skimate that dark in conjuntion with the rollermat is telling me your running pretty dirty regardless of your test results.(nitrate po4 etc). again i think the start point is to get accurate water,zeolite and reactor throughput amounts right. good luck........zsu
 
Yes dial everything back to the basics. The Stylophora is a tough coral and killing it is a good sign on things changing too much chemistry wise in the tank. You say you have Kessil lights one two? Every though of adding a couple of T5's lights to the mix?
I would just stop all dosing of extra chemicals and just work on keeping your cal and alk at an even 7 to 8 dkh. Do water changes and keep the tank clean. Good clean water and the proper amount of full spectrum light go a long way in making a tank successful.
 
your throughput and amount of zeolites in your zeo reactor is pretty critical, with thatt said, try to caculate your amount of actual water you are running then refer to kz instructions as to amount of zeolites and flow through your reactor. also are you using a carbon reactor? if so i would just start using it passively ime the most eficient use of gac was not a good thing. one more thing... from the look of your skimate you definately need to cut way back on your feeding and organic input, with skimate that dark in conjuntion with the rollermat is telling me your running pretty dirty regardless of your test results.(nitrate po4 etc). again i think the start point is to get accurate water,zeolite and reactor throughput amounts right. good luck........zsu



I have the right amount of ZEOlite but I'll check flow.


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