The Elegance Coral Project

[revjlw]

Absolutely true. So, how does a decision about what to do get made? There is no board to do it, so does this fall to Eric or what? We can't "assume" this is a done deal and that it should proceed and how. Who will be the point person and do we need a "committee" to steer this to the point where a board can be legally formed? Here's how it works in the non-profit world with which I am familiar...

Step One - someone hatches a good idea
Step Two - the organization that is "giving birth" to the new foundation approves the idea and then forms a committee/task force of it's members to investigate and then recommend a course of action, this usually includes conversation with a lawyer to be sure the correct procedure and issues are addressed, and draws up bylaws.
Step Three - the birthing organization adopts the recommended course of action and bylaws by vote.
Step Four - a Board of Directors is formed and filled and approved by the membership of the tentative foundation (this membership may or may not be different than the membership of the birthing community)
There you have it - a foundation is born.

Some of these steps would be difficult in our context, as RC isn't really in a position to hold votes from it's membership, so maybe it could be the moderators or staff who serve in this capacity. I don't know exactly, but this is how it works in my world.

 

[Ronald]

The idea of a foundation was hatched from this thread and from Eric's work. As a scientist, he may have little time for this or even less interest in the admministrative aspects (unless he says otherwise then great!).

Cathy has done wonderfully at organizing this fund drive for the elegance coral project and shows an ability to do that. The internet as a unique entity can be at the same time difficult to organize, and even harder to secure.

I would suggest after taxes are done, to have people interested in being administratively active let that be known and then have a person(s) (possibly Eric, the moderators as a group, Cathy, or Gene if interested collect CVs or verifiable background info (by snail mail or private e-mail) in a secure environment. After information is collected, board positions can be elected based on that pool. A vote should include those who were active in this project, the moderators, and possibly contributors to the elegance project to select a board. Voting parties should be sent a synopsis of those desiring to be on the board by mailing self addressed envelopes to RC or Cathy or whoever has the info and votes should be registered by mail. The board should include RC staff (if interested), Science staff and community (RC) members on a volunteer basis. Time commitment will be involved. Any financial burden for this process should be kept small and focused and shared by our on line community by contribution. This includes legal fees, paper and photo copying, mailing fees etc. Our goal is to get as much money available in the foundation for research as possible.

The first task of the board will be to define the organization, state the mission and devise funding streams. Obtaining tax deductable non-profit status is also high priority but not necessarily needed initially.

I would be happy to help in any way possible, including collecting and distributing perspective board member data, providing verifiable information to ensure data security to those interested. Etc. Let's work together and get this done.

Ron

 

[zenya]

I do not have any experience in this type of venture, but I also would be willing to help.

Ditto, all of this is way beyond my organizational capabilities but I'm willing to do whatever is needed of me,besides the financial contributions.
Ronald has some exellent ideas and it would be a good starting point, I mean before the voting starts or anything like that we should all have clear picture of what is involved and some idea of where this organization will be heading. I suppose it is a structure and a mission at this point.

 

[crpeck]

Wow! You all have some great input ... sorry to be so slow in responding, but all those last posts were April 15. Between the tax deadline and a near miss on a tank crash, I'm just now getting back to this thread. Since I didn't respond to the first email from RC saying there was a new post to the thread, I missed them all until just now.

I like the idea of recruiting an initial board. I think there is room here for several levels of participation. A board level for people willing to commit to the time and effort for administration and decision making and a "member" level that would be willing to support the cost of a website and newsletter to be a part of things and to help influence the direction of the organization. Ideally, the board resources should include science resources, of course, business/fundraising resources and representation of the hobby. Eric started all this and has followed through to make it happen so I would want to follow his leader. None of this would have happened if he hadn't thrown out the challenge to us all to put our money where our mouths were and then been willing to follow through with the research when we did. Besides, for a science guy I'm amazed how good he is about keeping track of receipts.

I don't see the logistics as being that difficult once the initial organization is set up. I am amazed really at how easy it has been to generate this level of response, interest and financial support that we have gotten for this project all online. I have been struggling to get a start up nonprofit financially off the ground here in Memphis, http://www.ewh.org, for more than a year which is a REALLY good cause also and have not been able to even begin to reach this many people or generate the response we've gotten off of this board. The internet is an incredibly powerful resource for bringing this together. We start right off the bat as a nationwide organization of resources.

I have been keeping meticulous track of all of the donations and the email or postal addresses of everyone who has donated/participated so far. So when the time comes to rally, we can do so quickly. Letââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢s just be sure that when we go to the next level weââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢re ready to do it right. My feeling has been to get through this initial project and then address where weââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢ll go with any funds and energies that are left. Assuming we have some success with this project (no pressure, Eric), then we have something to stand on going forward.

Let me regroup from taxes, go back and read these last posts when it isnââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢t 2 a.m., touch base with Eric and the attorney contact I have here and Iââ"šÂ¬Ã¢"žÂ¢ll try to start working on a proposal.

Thanks SO much for the support and keeping this going. I feel great things happening in the air.

Cathy

 

[EricHugo]

Hi all:

Sorry, but I just got back from Ann Arbor last night. This next week is going to stretch me thinner than normal, so I may not be able to offer much over that time frame.

Ronald: Thanks for the offer. The doxycycline is no problem. Its just not a stocked item for us and will be here shortly.

Update: The samples are at Scripps and Tracy Mincer said he will know something within a week.

On the rest: Wow. Warms my heart and fabulous ideas. Without really giving it much thought, I would think off the top of my head that if one were to come up with a "board" it would necessarily involve integral personnel. John Link would be absolutely required if this group at all utilized RC, which I think it obviously would.

Then, I think we would want to break it down to various interested parties:

Cathy and/or any attorney would seem logical. A committed support staff - for example, if members of RC sponsors are going to be a source of funding (i.e. Gene, Dr. Mac), then they have a logical interest in any future projects and their outcome. Then, the technical or scientific guidance area. Frank Marini, Ron Shimek and Randy Holmes-Farley seem to be among the more logical choices, but we have many scientists as members, all of whom understand or have specific araeas of expertise and all understand the sceintific method and would be valuable.

Others with more specific aquarium or marine based interests could be approached, and Rob Toonen comes to mind. Each project may require different teams depending on the project. Then, since this would be a hobby-based focus, one would want the input of the hobby to help determine which areas are most desirable to explore. Of the choices perhaps gained by a popular vote, certain projects would be given consideration for funding based on logistics - is it attainable, will it really contribute to advancing the state of knowledge and/or the conservation of reefs.

Also, as with any corporation, I think we should give some thought as to finances. this shouldn;t really be a one way loss of money depending on donations. We should have an output, or some way to at least ameliorate net losses by a concerned few. Non-profits don't have to mean no income. This will especially be true given the efforts required to run such a venture long term. While everyone volunteering their skills and time for a while might be fine, eventually I think everyone putting in time should be able to get some sort of compensation, be it by income, goods, services, or something.

That's it for now. Have to catch up on some posts and get to lab.

 

[crpeck]

************** THANK YOU! **************

........................... Gabriel Vidoni .......................

.................................. $5 ...................................

 

[grafxguy]

Eric, I just wanted to let you know that our club has donated all of it's raffle prize money and other member donations from this past weekends meeting. Scott from Gooch's Corals will be mailing out a check for $114 if you have not already received it.

When you can please contact me I need to discuss something with you.

Thanks,

eric

Eric Liebe
WRS President

 

[gooch]

Just waiting for Eric to respond to my e-mail. I have one coral fixed(Donation from Bill Davis) and am going to match the donation WRS made in addition to the three corals we already sent. We have been having a hard time getting them in and honestly it is very depressing watching these corals waste away.

Gooch

 

[ReefDiver]

Eric:

I was in a LFS yesterday being operated by a new owner. He had a few Elegance corals that appeared very healthy looking. In fact, these were the best that I have seen in quite awhile. Anyway, as usual, we got into a discussion about them. He said that the ones collected from shallow waters did much better than the ones collected from deeper waters. He also said, and I have not heard this before, that when shipped with small pieces of carbon placed in the bag, the corals arrived in much better condition. I guess the theory being that the carbon will absorb the toxic byproducts and leave the water cleaner. Have you heard of this and does this sound plausible or not? Unfortunately, I did not have my camera with me at the time. But I did ask him to hold one of the corals for me. I want to see how it looks and holds up over the next few weeks? Next time I will take the digital along!

Do you still need corals for the project??

 

[brc0488]

my lfs around my neck of the woods gets the elgence corals in quite frequently. but they are like 80 bucks.... But i am getting a job there very shortly.. do u still need the corals?

 

[brc0488]

that elegance coral has been there for over two weeks now?? how long does it usually take to die?

 

[davejnz]

mine was healthy for a month before it began to show symptoms,It lived for another 3 weeks without withdrawing before i decided to fix it and donate it to the project

 

[Chrismo]

I know the majority show symptoms, but roughly what percentage of them end up showing these symptoms? 90 percent? or 75%?

 

[EricHugo]

Hi guys:

I have to go back and read all the posts in this thread since the last time I visited, but here is an official update.

I have a new batch of receipts to turn into Cathy, but I have not even touched the PayPal account money yet. I have spent a total of about $400-500 thus far.

I have all the sick corals we need. There are over 60 in the study, about half of which are "in line" at Mass Histology Services, the other half sitting ready to go if the need arises, completely decalcified and preserved.

I received six corals directly from Indonesia, some of which looked good, some of which didn't. At least one one of a very different color pattern and location from the norm, and which looked fairly healthy. All declined in health.

Samples of the white material are still with Tracy Mincer at Scripps, and I am still awaiting news from them. They promised some information weeks ago, but I know how busy things can get, especially when its being done as a favor. I also froze some of the material and had it sent to another microbiologist at the Univerisity of Alabama who works with marine Actinomycetes.

I am currently trying to arrange permits to get some healthy corals from Australia.

The reason stems from the major news that happened. About a month ago, I received the last sick corals for this study. I temporarily housed them in my main tank, which of course connects to a tank next to it that held my old, beautiful and healthy Elegance that you have seen photos of in this thread. Upon moving the sick corals to the study tank, I found that within two days my elegance was failing to expand. Two large opaque long stringy mucus strands were being rreleased. I grabbed a pipette and removed that material. I was concerned, and rightly so, for within a week my elegance coral was on its way out.

In a panic, and because it was mine, I thought what better time to try the doxycycline treatment, which I had purchased but not yet tried on sick corals. I dosed a treatment tank as per instructions by Sprung, and in this thread, and found the water became quickly cloudy and fouled. The coral was dead within hours, having turned into a mass of muck.

So, bad news is the only healthy elegance in the study, and my precious coral, is now dead and except for the mucus strand, is not even usable for the study. The good news is there is no question in my mind that this condition is contagious, and quickly, too. it also makes me think that of those six corals from Indonesia, if I had isolated each of them, I might have actually had some other healthy corals.

The other thing that makes me concerned is that evenif this is a rare condition in the wild, and even from a single location, a single sick colony in an exporter's tank could infect many if not all of the hundreds of others in the system with it. This would also explain why so many corals in exporters tanks looked fine when we were in Jakarta, but the majority get the condition soon after they arrive in stores here. Mine was almost two weeks to the day between thriving healthy and dead as a doornail.

This also makes me hopeful that once Tracy gets back to me with an ID of the white material, I can culture it and try and establish Koch's postulates on other elegance corals. If it is a single organism as a pathogen, it is also hopeful, then, that a treatment can be found.

 

[crpeck]

Oh Eric! I am SO sorry that you lost your Elegance! Especially given the fact that you lost it directly because of what you were doing for all of us. Its awful and I'm really very sorry.

Touch base whenever you're ready with the receipts and I can reeimburse you through PayPal.

Welcome back.
Cathy

 

[bjolly]

sorry for the loss, Eric. It sounds like its death may have provided some useful clues at least. So sorry though.

 

[ReefDiver]

Hi Eric:

Really feel bad about you losing that beautiful coral. Question: Are you certain that it was due to the addition of the other corals? Or, could it have been just a coincidence? I guess that time will tell on this one. BTW, not being skeptical but rather curious. Thanks for the update as I know that you are very busy, as usual.

 

[Ronald]

I had an experience with my Elegance coral that I had purchased in hopes of sending it out to you. I had a favites that was over a year old near it (down current about 6cm away. The elegance died so fast that It was useless to try to send it. Shortly thereafter I noted white stringy material on the Favites and then a linear advancing line of tissue destruction. I tried debriding the dead tissue and treating the advancing edge with Lugols and iodine dips. I even tried fresh water dips. To no avail. The Favites died over the next 2 weeks. Fortunately no other corals were affected. Certainly this seemed related to the Elegance demise and the material looked similar. I did not collect any. I hope you are successful in isolating and finding the cause. You could probably confirm bacterial pathogen by trying treatment of a sick speciman with Imipenum (it kills almost every thing bacterial).

Ron

 

[EricHugo]

Ronald - thanks for the clue...sure wish you had gotten a sample of the material!! I'll pick some up - any particular supplier you suggest?

Steve, am I sure? No, of course not, but I think the probability given this direct experience and all the other experiences makes any other possibility rather unlikely. I'm going to call it "an assumption" that will be tested upon culture of the material. ;-)

 

[Ronald]

The manufacturer of Imipenum is Merck Pharm. It is a broad spectrum thienamycin antibiotic. It kills many gram positive and gram negative aerobic and anaerobic bacteria including methicillin resistant staph. Good luck. I don't know if it is toxic to coral though.

Ron